Job Discussion Forums

[ghost]

You can be fluent in a foreign language but not accurate, and vice versa.

Many new immigrant children in Montreal achieve reasonable fluency in French language within one year of arrival in Montreal...however they make quite a few mistakes in the language, mixing up masculine and feminine endings, and not linking the genders to nouns.

On the other hand, you have individuals who have studied English or French overseas who are quite accurate in their register of the new language, and make few, if any mistakes. However these same individuals do not possess fluency in the language, insofar as that they are unable to hold a meaningful conversation in the language, or communicate with all and sundry on a daily basis.

Yaramaz questions one`s ability in Turkish, but having only stayed in the country for six months and studied the language for 2 months, one is bound to make mistakes.

Ben Turkiye`de alti ay oturdum. Veya Turkce iki ay ogrendim, Tomer`de.

Tomer`de buyuk avantaj var, cunku matematik gibi sistem var orada. Ogretmenler orada (Tomer`de) Turkce konusuyorlar. Inglizce dil Tomer`de mumkun degil.

Yaramaz - siz kac yil Turkiye`de oturyorsunuz? Iki yil - uc yil, degil mi?

Siz - Harika guzel Turkce biliyorsunuz? Her adam veya kadin, bazen yanlis yapiyor. Yuzme 100% mumkun degil.....

[Mike_2003]

What has not being able to swim got to do with anything?

[gelin]

Maybe he's talking about the sink or swim system????? Think he meant "Yuzde yuz"?

[Mike_2003]

He also appears to be unsure whether he lived in Turkey for two month OR studied at Tomer for two...

[ghost]

Evet - pardon, ben yanlis yazdim....yuzme yuz degil....yuzde yuz daha guzel.

Turkiye de alti ay kaldim veya iki ay Turkce ogrendim.

Bir factor cok onemli - motivasyon....Ben Turkiye de cok az oturdum, ama motivasyon factor buyuk, cunku Turkce dil aprantisaj daha kolay.

Genelikle Yabanci Ogretmenler Turkiye de cok az Turkce ogreniyorlar cunku motivasyon factor hafif ya.....

Ikinci factor....tembel kultur Turkiye de....Yabanci ogretmenler oyun veya guzel hayat istiyorlar.....Turkce Dil cok zor....yabanci adam soyle...

[Bogazicibaby]

You know what? I've been reading these posts of yours about motivation and learning language and blah blah for some time now and I just have to make my own comments.

Not everyone who lives here is in a postion to be able to take classes in Turkish. Some people work a lot of hours and don't have an opportunity.

It takes a lot more than just motivation and to keep reading about lack of motivation by English teachers in Turkey towards learning Turkish makes me want to puke sometimes.

Your experiences don't equal what everyone else experiences here!!!

Daily life is different for those who teach in language schools, high schools, and universities. Some people in these catagories have private students. Some people have privates, a full time job, and work for a language school part time. For someone in the last case, there are not enough hours in the day to work, have a personal life, AND attend classes. Oh, lets not forget that some people have a family and are not just passing through.

How nice to have been able to go to classes for half a day five days a week for two months. Not everyone can afford this time and for some people the money is a bit much if they have things like student loans and the like.

Don't talk about laziness and desires for pleasure as being THE reason for foreign teachers not knowing Turkish. Please keep your generalities to yourself.


Sometimes I think your comments come from being on a rather high horse and they are annoying. Haydi ya DUR DA!

[gelin]

Ghost -- VEYA means OR and VE means AND.

[Mike_2003]

Learning a language, especially one like Turkish, requires a lot more than simply constructing English sentences with Turkish words. If your level of Turkish is anything to go by, Ghost, Tomer are missing out on some fundamental principles. Considering the amount of money you spent and the length of time you were learning for (in hours), you didn't do particularly well.

Mike

[OzBurn]

I can't say anything about Ghost's Turkish, but I can say that I have met many, many people who have had many, many years of "Communicative Language Teaching" and who are unable to complete even simple tasks in English or understand English spoken at a normal speed.

If someone has studied a language for two months and can communicate at the basic level, stating requests, giving basic information about oneself, and relating simple anecdotes, as well as understanding basic communication -- well, that's a heck of a lot more than the average student gets out of his CLT class at, say, International House, where, as one teacher informed me, the failure rate for beginners is typically "overwhelming."

[ghost]

Ghost makes some mistakes in Turkish - hardly surprising...but his communicative skills were far higher than all the English teachers he lived with, most of whom had been in Turkey for many years - not months.

Ghost was always asked by Turks how many years he had lived in Turkey, and these Turks often refused to believe that poor Ghost had only been living and studying the language for several months....they were simply not used to that level of fluency and skilled register...proof enough (and contrary to what Mike says) that Tomer does indeed deliver the goods for those fortunate enough to invest one or two months to the courses there.

And the 'time excuse' is a weak one....yes people have family commitments, but everyone has 30 mins - one hour in a 16 hour day to devote to some concentrated Turkish study.....even those with family.

It is a question of desire and commitment, and the reason that many are in Turkey in the first place is that they were not able to construct meaningful career at home.....this is not a criticism but reality. You do not see many engineers and skilled people going off to teach EFL overseas...and nor would they have to....

The problem with this whole business (Teaching English Overseas) is that it is often not regarded as a professional business....and with that there is a great diversity in levels and seriousness of the schools and the people who work in them.

[Mike_2003]

If you can count to ten in Turkish they will be amazed and flatter you! Don't take it too much to heart.

[Byzantine]

Mike_2003, you must be around yabancis who have done quite well with Turkish. I lived in Istanbul for two years, and Ghost's Turkish seems well beyond anything I achieved or saw from those around me.

It's odd then that someone who shows such signs of intelligence can be so wrong about so many things.

[Caroline]

Ghost, just out of curiousity, why do you often refer to yourself in the third person?

Also, I agree with the others that you should take compliments from native speakers on your language ability with a grain of salt. I live in Italy and Italians will compliment anyone who makes an effort to speak their language!

[Mike_2003]

[Byzantine]