Job Discussion Forums

[Big_H]

Mornin',

I've been recently employed by a language center in Shanghai, and I underwent the medical check in China. My contract states that the school is liable for any mandatory medical check expenses (exact contract quote below).

A week later when I went to pick my results up from the hospital, I was told that I needed to retake the blood test. I asked the Chinese school coordinator who was with me at the time to pay for this test, but he said that the school will only pay for the "first" medical check and anything else was at the teacher's expense. I made the mistake of paying for the test myself (it was only 140 RMB) and having faith that the school will repay me later as per my contract; all in the intention of not delaying the papers for the residence permit/Foreign Expert Certificate etc. and waste time squabbling around.

Big mistake. Turns out that the manager is adamant that the school will not pay for the 2nd test and if they do, it would be only out of the "good nature of their heart". In fact, they tried to put the blame on me for "needing a second medical check". I should make it clear that when I spoke with the doctor, he assured me that regardless of the 2nd test's results, I would eligible to stay and work in China (although I may have a serious non-contagious illness if left untreated for several years). I was even given the first page of the medical report needed to get the FEC and told that the rest of the medical report would be available next week.

- Contract-wise, am I in the right or the wrong here?
- In case that the school persists in breaking my contract (be it by charging me for medical check, the FEC fee or otherwise), what steps can a teacher take against it to preserve his right?
- Is court the only authority to report to? or is there a specific body to protect foreigners in these cases (like the Foreign Affairs Office)? This is my first endeavor in China.
- Is there any course of action -legal or otherwise- that you would advise (or had to do in a similar situation)?

[The Great North]

I suggest you read some of the other threads about contracts and you will find this long ass explanation of what to do when screwed over that came from another user. Of course you would have to find the SAFEA office in Shanghai, not Beijing:

"And you are dead wrong about accessing SAFEA - I have been to both of their offices in Haidain District (Beijing) and had no problem getting in to see people, get information, and met other foreigners making complaints.

The main offices are in building 5 and building 6 of the Friendship Hotel located at the intersection of 3rd Ring Road and Zhongguancun. Subway line 4 goes to within 100 meters of the entrance to the Hotel (Renmin Station - Exit A2). The only problem with this office is that out of about 100 people that work there, less than 5 speak English. So unless you bring a Chinese friend, be prepared to wait in que for about 30 minutes.

The other SAFEA office is where you apply for and pic up your FEC which is located on Suzhoujie less than 200 meters North of Renmin University's West Gate. Half of the staff their speaks English and the wait is less than 15 minutes. To enter both office locations you will need your passport.

As for the Ministry of Labor, you cannot get in without an appointment but when you write and request and appointment you will get one - at a time they pick whether it is convenient for you or not.

If your employer committed a criminal act you can either write to the Minister of Justice with a WRITTEN complaint or to the Procuriate's Office closet to the offender location with your written complaint. Verbal lip service will get you nowhere. When foreigners file complaints in China, the people at these office do their jobs because they know we can make a lot of noise and problems. None of them want to be found NOT doing their job - just in case publicity comes into play (ie Wei Bo) Here is the address for the Ministry of Justice:

Honorable Wu Aiying
Minister of Justice
Minisrty of Justice, the People's Republic of China
No.10 Nandajie, Chaoyangmen,
Chaoyang District, Beijing 100020, China

Here is a link to the current labor laws in English:
http://www.npc.gov.cn/englishnpc/Law/2007-12/12/content_1383754.htm

The quickest way to get your employer to settle disputes with you is to ask them for a copy of their license and tax identification number. Why? Because most all of them know a visit from the tax authorities will cost them a 50,000 yuan bribe or worse. Many private schools and learning centers are not even licensed to hire foreigners. (You can find out by visiting the SAIC office located 300 meters West of the the Canadian International School about 1,500 meters from Tunajiehu subway station line 10) A clerk there will ask you for the either the license number or the Chinese name of the registered school and you will know within 15 minutes if that school is a)properly licensed and b)authorized to hire foreigners.

Getting back to the tax authorities... The provincial tax authority and municipal tax authority will send an "auditor" to your school within 15 days of you making a report (Great service eh?). You probably will need to find a new job next year, but rest assured you will get every dime they owe you and a release letter free of charge when your contract ends.
The Beijing Tax Bureau is located on Subway line four walking distance from Chegongzhuang West subway station at:

8 Chegongzhuang Street,
Xicheng, Beijing, China
Tel: 86 10 8837 1701

They also have a snitch program and will pay rewards and accept written reports by fax and email.

Lastly, if you suspect or know that your Principal is corrupt, you can file a complaint with the party and send a copy to "Wang QiShan" and email copies to the parents. You will have a new principal within 45-60 days. Quicker if you send your complaint in English. Send it by COURIER so they know you can prove delivery.

He Guoqiang
National Bureau of Corruption Prevention of China
NO.2 Guang'An Men Nan Jie,
Xuanwu Disrict,
Beijing 100053

If your school is falsely claiming to be "affiliated" or "partners" with some famous university, they will get hammered with a huge fine and if they are already on probation for another ethical violation can lose their license and the people that care the most about this is the Ministry of Education which probably cares for the sake of their public image. Again if you do not write a detailed complaint, nothing will happen. Verbal jabber is worthless in China when making formal complaints - like most any other country as well.

Honorable Yuan Guiren
Minister of Education
No.37 Damucang Hutong,
Xidan, Beijing, P.R.C
100816

Lawyers in China are a last resort for people lacking the balls to confront their employers (polite but directly - in private, and if necessary - in public) If they see you know the law and the people that enforce it, paying/giving you what is owed or was promised becomes the easiest and less costly option for them.

First the rules of the game changed twice. First on May 1, 2008 when President Hu Jintao signed the new Labor Law & Arbitration Act, and then again when President Xi JinPing amended our employee rights by making them equal to Chinese rights in late 2012 or early 2013 (can't recall right now) with the "Equal Rights Law". But so much of the stuff on the internet and even some government web sites stills show the old 1995-1996 laws which have been superseded. So be sure to rely on the current laws at the Ministry of Labor and at National Library. Most all of the details about arbitration hearings is well-hidden from us and only found in Chinese on the Ministry of Labor And Social Security web site at

Website： www.mohrss.gov.cn and www.molss.gov.cn (now being updated)

But if you actually make an appointment and go there, they will give you copies of the guidelines and complaint forms. Without an appointment you will not get past the front gate. (Be sure to bring your passport) When you ask to make an appointment in your email, say you want to meet with Ms. Cui Huilie (top inspector) and you will get to meet with her assistant unless your case is on Wei Bo or the local news media.

Mimistry of Labor And Social Security
Adress：No.3, Heping Dongjie
Dongcheng District, Beijing
China, 100013
Tel：86-10-84201116
Email：[email protected]

However, 2 or 3 times a year Amcham and the CFTU both have seminars on labor dispute resolution and they pass out a lot of free stuff in English. Amcham charges an entrance fee (150 yuan) and the CFTU seminars are always free for members and a guest - 50 yuan for others. They both have guest speakers from law firms like this one here which also may answer an email from you.

http://www.dwt.com/advisories/Overview_of_Chinas_New_Labor_Dispute_Mediation_and_Arbitration_Law_01_29_2008/

BUT... Arbitration is only the way to go if you are going up against a big international company. If you are going against a Chinese company you have to remove the word "binding" from "binding arbitration" in your contract because it will prevent you from filing a law suit as well if you don't. The big downside on arbitration is how arbitrators are selected. Too complicated to explain here. The very best and most current article that explains the process is here:

http://www.clb.org.hk/en/content/chinas-labour-dispute-resolution-system

Note that only 35% of arbitration claimants actually win their disputes. In courts, the plaintiff's win more than 60% of the claims at present which is more than double of just three years ago. But in Chinese courts you are not allowed to represent yourself and even a new lawyer will charge you at least 5,000 yuan to file a claim.

The good news is that once you make formal complaints with the arbitration board and courts, and you give copies to your principal or tape a copy on the school wall or elevator, you WILL get what is rightfully owed to you. It is simply cheaper to pay you and they absolutely don't want parents of students to know they cheat their own teachers. In reality, they know from experience that maybe 95% of the teachers just take the screwing and disappear, mostly out of ignorance.

Another good trick I learned at the CFTU seminar was to take a well-documented and detailed complaint and at the top of the page type in bold 72pt. letters "NEWS RELEASE" and fax it to the the people below and your school's office (In Chinese is even better)

Xin Changxing, Director of the General Office

Yin Chengji, Deputy Director of the General Office (director-level)

Phone Number of News Release Office: 86-10-84207636 Fax: 84208636

A friend of ours who got screwed over by Webb for 15,000 yuan used this trick and got paid the very next day. But any complaint filed against an employer will mean you are history when the contract ends. Also important: There is a 60 day statute of limitation to file your claims. They must be RECEIVED within 60 days of the offense.

There is yet another way to get a third and fourth bite of the apple for free IF you live is top tier city like Beijing, Shanghai, Guangzhou, etc. which all have their own municipal labor bureaus and a conflict resolution system that takes foreigners seriously. And of course, every Provincial government has a Labor Dispute Board. The more letters and calls your swindling school has to deal with, the sooner you will get paid IMO.

The most important thing I learned at the seminar is that when you go through Arbitration, the burden of proof is on you. But when you go through the Courts, the burden of proof is on the employer.

I got a big pdf file in English from the CFTU for free about all the rules and procedures for making labor board claims at the top central government level, and it seems it is deliberately designed to be a convoluted process to dissuade people from making waves. Remember Chinese were raised to be "harmonious". But I personally believe that in China the "squeaky wheel" gets the grease and that "press release" tricks works like a charm. If by some odd chance that it does not, be prepared to fill out about 30 pages of forms. Disregard all of the above if you have no Z visa - filing any complaint will just expedite your own arrest and deportation."

[dblkhqc]

The last paragraph of the first responder sums it up ... "CFTU"

Trust nothing with references to the hypothetical "union"

[JamesD]

Contract-wise, technically, by-the-book, following the rules, rigidly enforced....I would say they 'should' pay.

Based on experience (18 years here), considering cultural perspectives as regards contracts, reasons too numerous and involved to get into I would say........choose your battles wisely.

If you're willing to establish yourself from day one as a combative boat-rocker over 140 RMB then go for it. Not a great way to start a new job.
Gaining a reputation as someone who will rationally deal with minor problems will serve you much better when larger problems crop up. Larger than 140 RMB I assure you. Why not ask if the school would consider paying half since it was not an anticipated cost? This sets you up as someone who will work with your employer rather than someone who is confrontational.

[roadwalker]

I absolutely agree with JamesD on this on. Choose your battles. If it turns out that the school is continually charging you for things that they should pay according to the contract, then go to war. This is one of those weird things, and is a good opportunity for you to be that guy that they can work with. I understand the thinking of: "if they take an inch this time, they'll take a mile next time," but I haven't run into that behavior by the universities I've taught at in China. Let this one go and keep your eyes open. They could be turds, or you may be surprised at extra bones thrown your way from time to time.

[Big_H]

Thanks for the advice, it goes without say that the bigger issue here to me was whether my medical condition would prevent me from working in the first place. I don't care much about the health check incident as I just want to work in peace. In fact, it was my full intention to let this incident slide regardless of the consequences, but I didn't need to wait for the next bigger argument to start wondering what I should do when the school believes that it's ok to breach the contract again and expect me to keep rolling with the punches.

To explain further, this school's manager has a reputation for testing how far they can push their staff and get away with it. In fact out of a dozen employees that I've met, it seems only one of them has stayed longer than one year in that school. I think it's safe to say that I won't be compensated in any manner when I give them some leeway.

So it's reasonable for me to expect more ill attempts from the school -whether on a smaller or larger scale- and to be prepared with the appropriate response if they persist; be it by warning or legal action.

So again, mucho gracias for the responses and any more of them will be welcome and appreciated.

[mike w]

[Son of Bud Powell]

Great North:

I am ecstatic that SAFEA has turned itself around and that it has been so helpful.

No. Wait. I'm not ecstatic. I'm skeptical.

OP:

140 rmb isn't worth fighting over. An employer that'll quibble over that amount may not be worth working for. By the same token, if an employer can't pay for follow-up tests (due to policy), a good one will do something to make it up to you.

[The Great North]

Forgive my stupidity. I overlooked the 140 rmb part. That contract is definitely NOT worth arguing about. Get yourself a better job.

[Shanghai Noon]

The school is right. You completed the medical exam and got the health certificate. SAFEA doesn't care about the report. If you simply didn't show up for the second blood test (costing 140 RMB), you would still be granted the FEC and residence permit. The second blood test is for the benefit of your own health, and I think you should pay for it and get the diagnosis. If you were to start over in a private hospital, you would pay a lot more than 140RMB for this service.

[wangdaning]

Sounds like a communication issue. The hospital of course wants another test ($), and the school is asking why would I pay. Maybe if you had asked the person with you if you needed the test things would have went away. I hate hospitals in general and Chinese ones make my skin crawl at this point (I have never been hospitalized here, but frustratingly have had the experience of being there many times). The hospital will push whatever they can to get the extra mao. This includes telling people they might have some disease. They told my wife while pregnant that my child might have a heart condition and we needed a 2000+ yuan exam. The follow up question of what happens if the baby does have it was met with the surprise of "kill it." She was almost 7 months at the time. My child has no problems, was born, etc.

What I want to put across is it probably was a communication issue and even if not it is not worth fighting for 140 yuan. Try talking with your employer and saying it was a communication issue and you didn't understand what was going on at the clinic/hospital. Add to that that you would really like to have better communication in the future. I don't think the contract is clear either way here. Best to let them know you are uncomfortable, but want things to improve and are willing to work in that direction.

[dblkhqc]

Keep in mind that the "health department" doing your exam has no legal or ethical RIGHT to force you to get additional tests "for your health" purposes. They can of course say, "you should get these other tests and talk to your doctor about them for your better health" . . . They can require additional tests to prove or disprove disqualifying diseases. The basic government process is paid by your employer, any changes to that required by law is your responsibility. The caveat, they can do a test that is not part of the necessary exam without your permission and cannot withhold the certificate. The naysayers, cower in the corner, saying, "oh, but this is China."

[wangdaning]