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santi84
Joined: 14 Mar 2008 Posts: 1317 Location: under da sea
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Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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spiral78 wrote: |
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Heck, one doesn't need to master MOST concepts in life to move on to something more "advanced".
I'm reminded of Russians who can live, work, and study in English at an advanced level, but still forget their basic article usage. |
Oh, wait. I agree with most of what you post - BUT there is considerable research to indicate that article use is not BASIC, but is in fact typically one of the very last items any non-native speaker of English masters. While there are some basic rules, the finer details of article usage are quite complex (and in many cases arguable).
Fully accurate article use isn't a basic skill, but a very high-level one, essentially. |
I agree completely, which is why I think it is a good example that ESL can't be based on "mastering" basic concepts before moving on to further study. Basic a/an/the concepts are studied in low-level English (at least here). Can you imagine if you won't move on to partitive articles until your students mastered the concept of general article usage? You'd be in 101 forever.... |
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MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013 Posts: 1364 Location: Flying around the ME...
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:02 am Post subject: |
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Ignoring any benefits that a CELTA course might provide in terms of actually helping a newbie to teach, the main reason for recommending a CELTA is that it is a well known brand in the field, employers recognise it. |
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Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 11061 Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:15 am Post subject: |
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All very true. Show me a learner who has mastered present simple third person singular 's', and I'll show you an advanced user of English.
Understanding this, and not misapplying pedogogy from other feilds, is just one of the benefits of a pre-service course. Although, if one depends totally on a local teacher to translate and/or do the bulk of the real teaching, then none of the above would matter much. Or, indeed, make sense. One might even labour under the sad misapprehension that one is speaking to other posters as an equal in the field. Simply not true if another teacher has to do your teaching for you... |
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happyinshangqiu
Joined: 20 Jan 2015 Posts: 279 Location: Has specialist qualifications AND local contacts.
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:09 am Post subject: |
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Sashadroogie wrote: |
All very true. Show me a learner who has mastered present simple third person singular 's', and I'll show you an advanced user of English.
Understanding this, and not misapplying pedogogy from other feilds |
What are 'feilds'?
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Or, indeed, make sense. One might even labour under the sad misapprehension that one is speaking to other posters as an equal in the field. |
And you are right Monkey, there won't be many you are the equal to in the world of TEFL.  |
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Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 11061 Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:22 am Post subject: |
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And another barrage of personal insults from a happy poster? How unexpected. |
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buravirgil
Joined: 23 Jan 2014 Posts: 967 Location: Jiangxi Province, China
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 8:52 am Post subject: |
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Barrage? Isn't that like a fusillade? Isn't a plurality implied? Granted two swipes are a plurality, but...
Perhaps the barb monkey, its crudity, toxicity, and lack of imagination, has led to an overstatement as any poster's taunt of so obvious a typo as "feilds" is laughable-- a hoist by one's own petard, as it were. Besides, words are less like artillery than swords: I like to say blame is a double-edged blade (err, sword). |
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Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 11061 Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 9:30 am Post subject: |
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Not an overstatement when one looks at the sock campaign and sees it comprises many threads. More crudity will follow. Then the inevitable will transpire. As is the way... |
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happyinshangqiu
Joined: 20 Jan 2015 Posts: 279 Location: Has specialist qualifications AND local contacts.
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 10:46 am Post subject: |
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buravirgil wrote: |
Barrage? Isn't that like a fusillade? Isn't a plurality implied? Granted two swipes are a plurality, but...
Perhaps the barb monkey, its crudity, toxicity, and lack of imagination, has led to an overstatement as any poster's taunt of so obvious a typo as "feilds" is laughable-- a hoist by one's own petard, as it were. Besides, words are less like artillery than swords: I like to say blame is a double-edged blade (err, sword). |
Hush now, sonny. The monkey can fight his own battles - with over 10000 posts whilst living in one of the worlds most exciting metropolises - he can stick up for himself, he gets enough practice around here.
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happyinshangqiu
Joined: 20 Jan 2015 Posts: 279 Location: Has specialist qualifications AND local contacts.
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 10:48 am Post subject: |
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Sashadroogie wrote: |
And another barrage of personal insults from a happy poster? How unexpected. |
Don't take it to heart, monkey boy. Just 'playing the feild' as it were, arf arf.
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Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 11061 Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 11:50 am Post subject: |
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Enjoy it while it lasts. This current sock, that is. |
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happyinshangqiu
Joined: 20 Jan 2015 Posts: 279 Location: Has specialist qualifications AND local contacts.
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 12:41 pm Post subject: |
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Sashadroogie wrote: |
Enjoy it while it lasts. This current sock, that is. |
Can you make the 10382nd post a bit more interesting?
Thanks Monkey boy!  |
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spiral78

Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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We were having a useful and interesting professional conversation here. Must yet another good thread be sunk by a poster with nothing to offer but silly insults? They're not even educated, well-written, or intelligent insults. |
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Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 11061 Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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This thread was about training options. The last few pages were about countering erroneous views about Celta posted by those who don't know the first thing about it. Now, we have the disgruntled and previously banned bad penny turning up to derail the thread.
Pity you are so sad. It belies your handle. Cheer up, though. Your misery won't last. |
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