Job Discussion Forums

KidfromBrooklyn · Posted: Fri May 15, 2015 5:18 am Post subject: Not so New Chinese Labor law.

I was just looking at the job posts on Dave's and realized that none of the schools, that I can see are including the foreign teachers in the Chinese Social Security program which is required by law since Oct. 15th. 2011.

The schools are still offering the almost useless "accident" insurance policy.

According to the new law foreigners that are working legally in China can be included in the social security program which is really quite good. Hospital insurance, unemployment coverage, and a retirement wage after 15 years of service.

My observation is that Chinese employers are breaking their own laws when involved with foreign workers and not being held accountable for it as they would with Chinese employees. Any one else with insight to this thoroughly racist situation?

7969 · Joined: 26 Mar 2003 Posts: 5782 Location: Coastal Guangdong

Most people are not going to be in this country for 15 or more years so there's never going to be any pension to collect, and it's still 11 years at least before anyone does. Second, if you're suddenly unemployed your residence permit is likely getting cancelled, and I don't know how anyone is going to collect unemployment benefits if you're not able to stay in the country. And if you get fired and don't find a new job or have to leave the country quickly, how certain are you of getting your 11%/month contributions back? I haven't seen any information on how that happens.

Too many unanswered questions - how much is the pension, the unemployment benefits, why has it only been implemented in a few locations, all the relevant details - that don't seem to have been answered. This social security plan is a half decent idea on paper but the way it looks right now it was cobbled together without any real thinking. At best it looks like a fairly crappy forced savings program. Some people may be happy paying for these benefits, but if you read past threads on this topic most people were complaining and wanted nothing to do with it. I've never been asked to contribute and am happy to keep my 11% thank you.

The_Kong · Joined: 15 Apr 2014 Posts: 349

jimpellow · Joined: 12 Oct 2007 Posts: 913

I am not sure how exactly you are determining that, save the wording for the insurance provided. I would assume that in a fair amount of those cases the person who posted the job description is simply using one from the past.

7969's response about them not wanting to pay the 37% is sound. I think actually though the figure varies from 33% to 40%, unless they have standardized it across jurisdictions. If the school is above board there is only so long they can avoid paying the tax.

From an economic standpoint any tax on the employer is also going to be paid at least partially and indirectly in the form of lower wages/benefits. I am sure that is true for this social tax, and is one of the main reasons why salaries remain rather stagnant despite inflationary pressures and supply-demand fundamentals that are tilting more and more heavily in the teacher's favor.

I think there have been a few threads about on these boards about teachers finding out that there 11% contribution was in fact going to the employer. I think more would be complaining if they actually attempted to get their refund when they leave. Very little about the success of doing so. The ability to do so seems mixed even when the employer has been above board with paying the taxes.

Ir seems that when a teacher is not successful, it is the result of having a very small time window to accomplish it, and a process which is open to failure in the event that the teacher, school, or individual with the government dallies too long or screws up.

I think a lot of teachers simply don't know or care about it, or get intimidated by the process of obtaining the refund.

Some people are just bad with their money. I have had a web service since 2001 that charges clients monthly for access to information. Some clients use it daily, others have not accessed it for years but continue to get charged and seemingly could care less. Baffling, but works in my favor. Very bad for the ESL teacher who does not assert his right to get his money back, especially since most do not have any real wealth.

KidfromBrooklyn · Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 2:47 am Post subject: Racist Chinese Government Policy

I say racist to Kong, the troll popping up everywhere to comment in behalf of the Communist idealogy. Go home. Please do not waste our time with stupid drivel.

I say Racist because exclusion to the Chinese Social Security system openly shows that only foreigners are exempt. When the law was written to benefit foreign workers in China. Employers cannot choose for themselves to omit an employee.

For those not concerned, the benefits are quite good even if you are not planning a long stay. The hospital benefits, and the unemployment compensation are enough for me. Payroll deductions are standard policy for Americans they are used to it. The companies and schools are in violation of their own Chinese law if they choose to comply. Its a situation all foreign workers should be aware of.

So you naysayers justify noncompliance because employers do not want to kick in their part of the pie? You guys are actually backing the graft in play here?

KidfromBrooklyn · Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 2:52 am Post subject: The Slow Screw......

@jimpellow,

So what your saying is that you know for sure you will be taken advantage of by your Chinese employer, so why try?

jimpellow · Joined: 12 Oct 2007 Posts: 913

kungfuman · Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 4:36 am Post subject: Re: Not so New Chinese Labor law.

kungfuman · Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 4:40 am Post subject:

Make the chinese labor law work for you. I have worked at the same school for three years. the school said they are not going to renew me. A friend is a Chinese lawyer. She told me under the new laws if an employer doesn't renew your contract or fires you then you are entitled to two months for every year you have worked there. So then I should be able to collect 6 months of wages!

My boss - of course - said Chinese labor law doesn't apply to foreigners.

When my contract official ends I will ask her to request these lawful wages and see how that works. Of course I will do this AFTER the last pay check is deposited.

KidfromBrooklyn · Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 5:48 am Post subject: Chinese Labor Laws

You see there it is...."chinese labor law doesn't apply to foreigners" the cheat, the lie that it is.

I can see how easy it is to take advantage of you guys. This specific law was written precisely with foreign workers in mind.

Not only do the Chinese exploit you, you like it.

go figure that one.

KidfromBrooklyn · Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 5:51 am Post subject: Ignorance in the expat community

From being attacked by expats due to my desire to bring a legitimate wrong doing to light, I rest my case, good luck to you noob Aholes.

kungfuman

nomad soul · Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Posts: 11454 Location: The real world

The_Kong · Joined: 15 Apr 2014 Posts: 349

Markness · Joined: 30 Dec 2009 Posts: 738 Location: Chengdu