Job Discussion Forums

[AGoodStory]

Too bad! When I read the OP, I thought it might be the beginning of a really interesting and useful thread. I anticipated lots of suggestions and tips for job applicants. Instead we have a café style squabble about the first suggestion posted!

Okay, here's mine:

Do NOT send out a generic, all-purpose cover letter.

Do NOT simply put your CV into letter format and call it a cover letter. You've wasted the opportunity to tell an employer why she should interview you for this job.

DO use your cover letter to relate your skills and experience to the particulars of the advertised job. Be concrete and specific.

Do NOT blather on about your passion for teaching. Qualified applicants don't waste the limited space available talking about how passionate they are. (Well, okay, maybe this is just a pet peeve of mine, but believe me, describing your passion for teaching will not make you stand out.)

Personally I find "Job Objective" descriptions a waste of space. Skip it unless you have nothing better to put on your CV. A summary, or profile, on the other hand, is quite useful in quickly making sense of your application, and will be appreciated.

Proofread, proofread, proofread! Or have someone else do it after you think it is letter perfect. I am amazed by how often people will send a letter or CV riddled with misspellings and other errors. You don't want a prospective employer's first impression of you to say that you don't pay attention to details. That first impression is likely to be the last impression.

[fluffyhamster]

[AGoodStory]

[spiral78]

I did mean, 'in general,' as I'd written. There seem to be a few newbs around and other switching jobs at the moment, so no harm in a new thread.

And I'll make sure to archive this one, Fluffy, so that I can remind you of it the next time you hijack a certification course thread to server your own agenda of ratting on CELTA

[fluffyhamster]

The fact that most people responded in the way they did obviously means they read the question regarding offering general advice as mere rhetorical figleaf and thus rightly disregarded it. No misreading at all. Knock yourself out though if you feel your forte is offering CV and covering letter tips to no one in particular. Not sure what relevance "ratting (?) on CELTA" has to the current discussion, but now that you've brought it up yet again, hmm let's see, the last time teacher training (in the form of a "recommended" dictogloss clip) was being discussed, the establishment figures came out looking like fools (to the extent that at least a few people commented on it). Was that the sort of "ratting" you meant? If so, sorry for questioning dodgy contextualization, but I'd've thought that would be of more use than just venting about hiring duties.

[buravirgil]

Can I sell tickets to this shindig? fluffyhamster, why are you kickin' a dead horse and dancin' over another's grave?
Establishment figures? How are you excluded from that category?
Dictogloss? That's a stretch. A talking head with presentational software.

The real question here is: What have you done with Sasha? What's the ransom? And be fair!

[spiral78]

[johnslat]

I'm afraid that in the job market, applicants who are not qualified are going to apply for positions.

Let me give you a recent example. The position of ESL program manager here at Santa Fe Community College was posted recently (that's the job I've been filling - in addition to teaching - as the "Interim Manager" for about the last year and a half).

Human Resources sent over nine applications to the hiring committee. I'm going to state the obvious here by commenting that Human Resources is either lazy, incompetent, or, more likely, both. Seven of the nine applicants were thoroughly unqualified for the position. None of the seven had any managerial, grant-writing or ESL Civics experience, and most had Masters degrees in unrelated fields (philosophy. psychology, etc.). Most didn't even have any ESL/EFL experience. Of the nine, only two made the cut.

There was also some "pimping" of resumes ( ). Apparently a few thought that there would be no comparison made between their applications and their resumes.

So, while we may rage, rage against thoroughly unqualified candidates submitting applications for jobs, I can't see that even slowing down, never mind stopping.

I suppose some think of sending in resumes as being rather like buying lottery tickets. Hey, it costs so little, and you never know. I mean, somebody's got to win.

Regards,
John

[fluffyhamster]

@Buravirgil: The horse is never truly dead though if some money is still to be made by continuing to flog those scabby fly-blown zombie donkey rides along rubbish-strewn Bluster Beach to unwitting toddlers. I think that's where you'll find Sasha's grave, anyway.

[buravirgil]

[fluffyhamster]

[spiral78]

Forgiven, buravirgil. Except, the thread's neither useless nor dead either, clearly. Please read on.

Dear John

I know it's unlikely to ever really stop. But we can still make our small efforts when/where we can:-)

This thread's actually been useful, if one omits the rodents.

We've suggested
1. don't apply if you don't have at least a reasonable overlap between your quals and those stated on the advert. My original bit of advice, seconded by nomadsoul and johnslat later on.
2. tutoring 1:1 is not the same as teaching classes (santi, and thanks)
3. when applying for jobs where work with zero beginners will be involved, be clear whether you have applicable experience or are at least willing to learn (santi again).
4. don't try to argue with visa regulations, or culturally related criteria like age, race, gender, looks (nomadsoul)
5. research the employer before applying
6. research the region/culture before applying (more nomadsoul gems - these may seem obvious but we have consistent newbs here who don't do any of the above)

And from AGoodStory, a whole whack of great advice:

Okay, here's mine:

Do NOT send out a generic, all-purpose cover letter.

Do NOT simply put your CV into letter format and call it a cover letter. You've wasted the opportunity to tell an employer why she should interview you for this job.

DO use your cover letter to relate your skills and experience to the particulars of the advertised job. Be concrete and specific.

Do NOT blather on about your passion for teaching. Qualified applicants don't waste the limited space available talking about how passionate they are. (Well, okay, maybe this is just a pet peeve of mine, but believe me, describing your passion for teaching will not make you stand out.)

Personally I find "Job Objective" descriptions a waste of space. Skip it unless you have nothing better to put on your CV. A summary, or profile, on the other hand, is quite useful in quickly making sense of your application, and will be appreciated.

Proofread, proofread, proofread! Or have someone else do it after you think it is letter perfect. I am amazed by how often people will send a letter or CV riddled with misspellings and other errors. You don't want a prospective employer's first impression of you to say that you don't pay attention to details. That first impression is likely to be the last impression


And Johnslat has added a note on the undesirability of pimping ones resume.

I should also note that the posters who've noted that in some job markets, employers often take less qualifications than they are advertising for have also offered valid advice (even if it's not true everywhere, I'm sure it is in many places and situations).

This is clearly quite a lot of useful advice for newbies or those with just a few years of experience in the field.

The thread's justified, regardless of the sour seeds from the hamster and others.

Best,
spiral

[fluffyhamster]

Your time would surely be better spent replying to offending applicants and telling them what they probably already knew, no? That would nip your main problem there right in the bud, and one can only imagine the effusive thanks!

[spiral78]

[AGoodStory]

Too late now, but two parallel threads might have sorted it out. One thread for genuine advice about applying for EFL jobs--long since buried along with those abused equines. A separate thread just for those who want to vent about ridiculously unqualified applicants, and their imaginative presentation of their education and work history. My all-time favorite was from an applicant for a position that combined counseling and teaching roles. She claimed experience as a "family counselor" and as an "individual counselor" for children and asolescent clients. It turned out she was a baby-sitter!