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michel_renier
Joined: 10 Nov 2015
Posts: 12
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 Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 6:51 am Post subject: CELTA for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. - job prospects? |
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1) Is CELTA certificate going to increase chances of finding a teaching job for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. (Ukraine, to be more specific). I mean, outside C.I.S. - Turkey, China, Asia in general.
2) Do you know any Ukrainian\Russian\Belorusian citizens who got a teaching job abroad after getting their CELTA? Can you share their stories (or your own story, if you are that person)?
The reason for my asking is that all CELTA holders I know are either native speakers or they teach inside Ukraine.
3) Does anybody have fresh experience of doing CELTA in Ukraine? There are some related topics on the forum, but they are mostly old.
(UPDATE - question relocated to the Ukraine sub-forum. You are still welcome to share your information here).
4) Do you know anything about such teaching qualification as IHCTL\IHWO?
(UPDATE - i have created a separate topic for this question as it is a separate issue).
Last edited by michel_renier on Thu Jul 07, 2016 11:54 am; edited 2 times in total |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 7:28 am Post subject: Re: CELTA for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. - job prospec |
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| michel_renier wrote: |
3) Does anybody have fresh experience of doing CELTA in Ukraine? There are some related topics on the forum, but they are mostly old.
4) Do you know anything about such teaching qualification as IHCTL\IHWO? |
Best to post these two questions on the Ukraine discussion forum. However, I suggest you stick with the more recognizable CELTA or Trinity CertTESOL since you hope to teach in other countries.
Speaking of teaching elsewhere, your specific degree/major could be a factor depending on your target countries. |
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michel_renier
Joined: 10 Nov 2015
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 7:42 am Post subject: Re: CELTA for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. - job prospec |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
Speaking of teaching elsewhere, your specific degree/major could be a factor depending on your target countries. |
I have a Master's degree in teaching English and World literature (from a Ukrainian university). And I have also received TKT (3 basic modules) and CPE certificates.
I'll repost the question about experience of doing CELTA in Ukraine to the relevant board, thanks.
As for IHCTL, I think, i'll leave it here - or create additional topic. The problem is that nobody seems to have heard about it.
The trainer claims that it is CELTA under a different wrapping, and it's considerably cheaper (and available in my home town, which cuts expenses dramatically). But I have strong doubts about its further applicability.
Still CELTA is the main question. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 8:38 am Post subject: Re: CELTA for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. - job prospec |
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| michel_renier wrote: |
As for IHCTL, I think, i'll leave it here - or create additional topic. The problem is that nobody seems to have heard about it.
The trainer claims that it is CELTA under a different wrapping, and it's considerably cheaper (and available in my home town, which cuts expenses dramatically). |
You could always do the CELTA in one of your target countries. Sometimes that's a more budget-friendly option. Plus, your supervised teaching practice would be with the type of learners you'd end up teaching, which would make you more appealing to the local employers. |
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michel_renier
Joined: 10 Nov 2015
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 11:08 am Post subject: Re: CELTA for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. - job prospec |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
You could always do the CELTA in one of your target countries. Sometimes that's a more budget-friendly option. Plus, your supervised teaching practice would be with the type of learners you'd end up teaching, which would make you more appealing to the local employers. |
Thanks for the suggestion. Anyway for now Kiev remains the most budget-friendly solution for me. Still I'll consider doing CELTA in Turkey. |
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suphanburi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
Posts: 916
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| Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 3:04 am Post subject: Re: CELTA for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. - job prospec |
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| michel_renier wrote: |
1) Is CELTA certificate going to increase chances of finding a teaching job for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. (Ukraine, to be more specific). I mean, outside C.I.S. - Turkey, China, Asia in general.
2) Do you know any Ukrainian\Russian\Belorusian citizens who got a teaching job abroad after getting their CELTA? Can you share their stories (or your own story, if you are that person)?
The reason for my asking is that all CELTA holders I know are either native speakers or they teach inside Ukraine.
3) Does anybody have fresh experience of doing CELTA in Ukraine? There are some related topics on the forum, but they are mostly old.
(UPDATE - question relocated to the Ukraine sub-forum. You are still welcome to share your information here).
4) Do you know anything about such teaching qualification as IHCTL\IHWO?
(UPDATE - i have created a separate topic for this question as it is a separate issue). |
With your qualifications there would be no need of a CELTA in Asia.
The CELTA has no market appeal. Employers would be more interested in a white face with a degree, police clearance and a TOEIC (proficiency) certificate.
The CPE is not recognized by immigration for visa issuance but the TOEIC, TOEFL and IELTS are. You need one of the 3 for a visa.
That said, some cheap, generic TEFL cert is a requirement to legally work in China.
As a NNES there is work in China and SE Asia but the pay is poor (500-600 EUR/month with few benefits).
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michel_renier
Joined: 10 Nov 2015
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 8:25 am Post subject: Re: CELTA for a non-native speaker from C.I.S. - job prospec |
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| suphanburi wrote: |
With your qualifications there would be no need of a CELTA in Asia.
The CELTA has no market appeal. Employers would be more interested in a white face with a degree, police clearance and a TOEIC (proficiency) certificate.
The CPE is not recognized by immigration for visa issuance but the TOEIC, TOEFL and IELTS are. You need one of the 3 for a visa.
That said, some cheap, generic TEFL cert is a requirement to legally work in China.
As a NNES there is work in China and SE Asia but the pay is poor (500-600 EUR/month with few benefits).
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Thank you for your suggestions, Suphanburi.
Cheap, generic TEFL - would an online one from Groupon do? Or which one would you suggest?
Will they recognize a C. I. S. degree?
What are those benefits you mention - do they pay your accomodation?
What about Vietnam? Or Turkey (this one would be more convenient for my first time teaching abroad, frankly speaking). |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| michel_renier wrote: |
| I have a Master's degree in teaching English and World literature (from a Ukrainian university). |
Did your teaching degree include an English language practical component? If so, what specifically did that entail? In other words, was it supervised and assessed? Who were your learners? What were the total teaching hours for your practicum? Did you teach English language skills or was the focus on English literature?
| and michel_renier wrote: |
Cheap, generic TEFL - would an online one from Groupon do? Or which one would you suggest?
Will they recognize a C. I. S. degree?
What are those benefits you mention - do they pay your accomodation?
What about Vietnam? Or Turkey (this one would be more convenient for my first time teaching abroad, frankly speaking). |
If your degree didn't include a practicum....
- A cheapo, online TEFL cert will limit you to countries that don't give a hoot about qualifications (like China). As mentioned, as a non-native speaker, your pay in those countries will likely be uninspiring, and you shouldn't count on much in the way of benefits, if any.
- A cheapo, online TEFL cert won't help you compete for jobs when other applicants are CELTA-holding native English speakers, regardless of the country.
Moreover, if you have to resort to a cheapo, online TEFL course (via Groupon), you apparently don't have enough money in your budget to consider teaching abroad at this time. Keep in mind you'll need startup costs to cover your airfare, lodging, food, ground transportation, visa fees, a medical exam, degree verification, etc. And that's in addition to an emergency fund in case things go wrong.
There are no one-size-fits-all answers to your questions and situation. I suggest you head to the China, Turkey, and Vietnam forums where you'll get answers on jobs and qualifications from teachers with experience in those specific countries. Ask about the best TEFL qualification for a non-native speaker and about start-up costs. Be sure to post your education and nationality and any teaching experience (including your practicum, if your MA program entailed one). |
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suphanburi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
Posts: 916
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| Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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i would beg to differ.
Most employers in the region place no weight on the CELTA (brand name) over any other brand of TEFL/TESOL cert. They are only interested in meeting the requirements for immigration and visa issuance.
With an MAT, a decent TOEIC score and a clear police check places China, Vietnam, Cambodia, Myanmar, Laos and Thailand are all options.
He may need to have his degree(s) authenticated for some countries but yes, degrees from CIS countries are recognized in SE Asia.
OP:
re: a groupon cert... the only place you will need it is China. The rest are more than fine with an MAT. and For China, even a cert from the Photoshop school of TEFL will suffice.
re: benefits... some may include housing (China), some do not (most of the rest) but housing is cheap. Other benefits may (or may not) include medical insurance, uniforms, visa, work permit, visa extensions, airfare allowance.
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michel_renier
Joined: 10 Nov 2015
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:22 am Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
| michel_renier wrote: |
| I have a Master's degree in teaching English and World literature (from a Ukrainian university). |
Did your teaching degree include an English language practical component? If so, what specifically did that entail? In other words, was it supervised and assessed? Who were your learners? What were the total teaching hours for your practicum? Did you teach English language skills or was the focus on English literature?
| and michel_renier wrote: |
Cheap, generic TEFL - would an online one from Groupon do? Or which one would you suggest?
Will they recognize a C. I. S. degree?
What are those benefits you mention - do they pay your accomodation?
What about Vietnam? Or Turkey (this one would be more convenient for my first time teaching abroad, frankly speaking). |
If your degree didn't include a practicum....
Moreover, if you have to resort to a cheapo, online TEFL course (via Groupon), you apparently don't have enough money in your budget to consider teaching abroad at this time. Keep in mind you'll need startup costs to cover your airfare, lodging, food, ground transportation, visa fees, a medical exam, degree verification, etc. And that's in addition to an emergency fund in case things go wrong.
There are no one-size-fits-all answers to your questions and situation. I suggest you head to the China, Turkey, and Vietnam forums where you'll get answers on jobs and qualifications from teachers with experience in those specific countries. Ask about the best TEFL qualification for a non-native speaker and about start-up costs. Be sure to post your education and nationality and any teaching experience (including your practicum, if your MA program entailed one). |
Thanks for the suggestions, Nomad Soul, I'll head to the country-specific forums.
As for my Ukrainian teaching degrees, there have been three practical components (all had to do both with English language and Literature). Though in Ukraine they teach so-called "World Literature" (giving insight on several national literatures - usually English, German, French - rather than specifically on the English literature).
The fourth year of studies typically includes five-week practical component at a state school teaching 11-15 y.o. students (that corresponds to the 5th-9th years of study). As for English, you are to give at least six 45-minute lessons (for three of them you need to provide a lesson plan). Usually all lessons are observed by the school teacher, whose class you are practicing with. And 1 or 2 lessons are observed by your University tutor.
The fifth year's practical component is similar, but you deal with 15-17 y.o. students (9th to 11th year of studies). Everything else's the same - minimum six lessons, three lesson plans reviewed by the University tutor, observation conducted by senior school teachers.
The Master's degree included teaching first-year students (usually Practical Course of Speaking and Writing and Practical Course of English Grammar). Again 6 (more) 80-minute lessons supervised and assessed by the corresponding University professor\tutor (who is in charge of the class you are dealing with). Additionally Master students are asked to read one lecture in World Literature and assist in preparation of teaching materials (both for English and Literature courses).
Thanks for the directions concerning which questions to ask at the forum. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:58 am Post subject: |
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| This is what I suspected. Forget about completing a TEFL cert. You need to indicate your supervised/assessed English language teaching practicum on your CV and note it in your cover letter. For example, I didn't need to pursue a CELTA or other TEFL cert because I have an MA in Teaching (MAT), which included a practicum --- stated on my CV as: "MA in Teaching, TEFL emphasis with 135-hour ESOL practicum, X University..." I suggest you figure out a way to include your info in a somewhat similar manner right under your degree. Maybe list your English language practicum only since it's relevant to teaching EFL. |
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michel_renier
Joined: 10 Nov 2015
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 12:43 pm Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
| "MA in Teaching, TEFL emphasis with 135-hour ESOL practicum, X University..." |
Nomad Soul, thank you for the idea.
135 hours - can I ask, whether it were just teaching hours or teaching+preparation of teaching materials? Well, what exactly did those 135 hours include?
The reason I'm asking is that my diploma supplement states "324 hours of scientific and educational practice in higher educational establishment" (but not all of that is TEFL). (The translation of the diploma supplement is kind of strange - i might want to replace it). |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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| michel_renier wrote: |
| nomad soul wrote: |
| "MA in Teaching, TEFL emphasis with 135-hour ESOL practicum, X University..." |
135 hours - can I ask, whether it were just teaching hours or teaching+preparation of teaching materials? Well, what exactly did those 135 hours include?
The reason I'm asking is that my diploma supplement states "324 hours of scientific and educational practice in higher educational establishment" (but not all of that is TEFL). (The translation of the diploma supplement is kind of strange - i might want to replace it). |
My MAT is from a US university. The practicum was a separate, 3-credit course over a 16-week semester. I was formally observed (teaching classrooms of real students) 6 times for a total of 12 hours. The remainder of the 135 hours entailed pre- and post-observation conferences with my cooperating teacher and supervising teacher, observing other teachers' classes, writing observation reports, co-teaching with my cooperating teacher, designing lesson and unit plans, creating materials, attending presentations and workshops at my state's TESOL conference, and lastly, compiling my teaching portfolio. The practicum allowed for flexibility, so I was able to tailor it to my specific teaching goals.
Hopefully, that can help you determine how to clearly state your practicum on your CV. You can then elaborate on details during interviews. |
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michel_renier
Joined: 10 Nov 2015
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:25 am Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
My MAT is from a US university. The practicum was a separate, 3-credit course over a 16-week semester. I was formally observed (teaching classrooms of real students) 6 times for a total of 12 hours. The remainder of the 135 hours entailed pre- and post-observation conferences with my cooperating teacher and supervising teacher, observing other teachers' classes, writing observation reports, co-teaching with my cooperating teacher, designing lesson and unit plans, creating materials, attending presentations and workshops at my state's TESOL conference, and lastly, compiling my teaching portfolio. The practicum allowed for flexibility, so I was able to tailor it to my specific teaching goals.
Hopefully, that can help you determine how to clearly state your practicum on your CV. You can then elaborate on details during interviews. |
Thanks, it will surely help. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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I'm curious to know how you finally decided to indicate your teaching practicum.  |
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