Job Discussion Forums

Robjben33 · Joined: 14 Jun 2016 Posts: 5 Location: Brooklyn, New York

Hi, first time poster. I'm hoping to get some guidance from all the seasoned vets on these boards.

A little background info: I graduated with my BA in psychology last June. I don't have a TEFL or any other teaching certification. I was a counselor and tutor with a company for two semesters while I was in school. I've also been tutoring informally for a bunch of elementary students since 2013 (not sure how applicable this experience is for my purposes of landing a FT job). I am a white, male, native English speaker, living in the US.

Now my concern: am I only qualified to teach at a training center such as EF? After extensive research I would prefer a public university, but have been told by a recruiter I'm working with, that the guidelines have gotten much stricter for expats coming into China to teach, and for that reason and my qualifications, or lack thereof, I am limited to private training centers. In your humble opinions, how accurate is this statement?

With that asked, is it really so bad IYHO to work for a training center such as English First? I have done my homework on these types of companies and I'm not jumping at the chance, but just wanted some expert opinions, more importantly some current, up to date opinions.

I also understand the stigma of recruiters. Has anyone worked with Topview International (Top Intern) before? I found a recommendation online from someone I've come to know as a reliable, knowledgable expat, but everyone has ties to someone, so I can't be sure. I understand I don't need a recruiter to be a FT, but any help I can get, being completely new to this, makes me feel more comfortable. Not sure if that is a reality or just a warm, fuzzy feeling I get knowing I'm not all alone in this process.

Lastly, if I shouldn't be working with a recruiter, where is the best place for me to land a teaching job in China, with decent pay and benefits with the qualifications I have? Best city/school for a newbie?

Any insight is appreciated, thanks in advance. Very Happy

LarssonCrew · Joined: 06 Jun 2009 Posts: 1308

Do you like to make 1500 USD a month with a shared house and having to be at the center from 1-9 5 days a week plus a few hours on another day, no weekends etc.

Sometimes the pay is even less, like 8 or 9000. Nutty. The only advantages I can see would be:

1)Straight into it i.e. you can have people to help you once you arrive.
2)No visa problems[even if you have a problem EF can probably fix it]
3)Other foreigners for support etc. can show you around.

Bad things

1)Pay
2)Really long hours. I HATE being stuck in the office. If you teach 1-4 then 7-9 you just have to kind of hang around.
3)Short holidays. They make most money from holiadys, whereas public schools and universities take long breaks.
4)Probably shitty apartment

Anyways, you are supposed to have 2 years of experience, can you 'twitst' your tutoring to look like 2 years?

kona · Joined: 17 Sep 2011 Posts: 188 Location: USA

I've never worked in China, but have a few friends that taught in Korea that moved there, and have considered it as my next teaching destination for a couple years now. Some folks on dave's say that certain provinces mandate 2 years experience (like Guangdong), so if you're dead set on a uni job, you may have to take a position in a 2-3 tier city further north/west, which is not desirable for a lot of people (I wouldn't do it, but that's me; ymmv).

I'm sure others will chime in with more up to date information. Seems there's been a downturn in the market (re:stagnant wages + inflation), and with the high pollution and recent crack down on VPNs, I'm less inclined personally to take the dive.

Robjben33 · Joined: 14 Jun 2016 Posts: 5 Location: Brooklyn, New York

LarssonCrew · Joined: 06 Jun 2009 Posts: 1308

I honestly think if a university wants you enough they'll get you the visa. Competition is stiff in the big cities like Shanghai Beijing Guangzhou Shenzhen because if you can stand the pollution it's 'more comfortable'. Availability of foreign foods, places to hang out, coffee shops, other foreigners. Some people in those cities only hang out with other foreigners [don't really know why] so they couldn't fathom living in a smaller place.

Advantage for you in a smaller place would be less competition. Around this time universities are trying to fill their foreign teacher places. You'd be paid much less, probably about 5000 RMB, but you'll have alot of free time. Obviously working in a small town makes it really hard to make any extra cash, although your FAO might help.

If you're a beginner to the ESL work, at least EF should pay full and ontime, they might tax that 9000 so you'd get like 8300.

creeper1 · Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2016 1:42 am Post subject:

It is probably the two year experience thing that is getting you.

Rules are one thing, following them is another. I have met tons and tons of FTs here in Beijing without a jot of experience and tons and tons of non-native speakers from places such as Finland, Romania etc

I think if an employer wants you they will simply get you your foreign expert certificate somehow (probably by lying)

If it is something that seems to blunting your efforts to get the job you want then you can always get the two years of experience in Korea.

Finally never, ever, ever sign a contract with EF.

Robjben33 · Joined: 14 Jun 2016 Posts: 5 Location: Brooklyn, New York

Thank you Larsson and creeper. Cool

So why no EF ? Laughing

Bad experience?

Robjben33 · Joined: 14 Jun 2016 Posts: 5 Location: Brooklyn, New York

7969 · Joined: 26 Mar 2003 Posts: 5782 Location: Coastal Guangdong

asiannationmc · Joined: 13 Aug 2014 Posts: 1342

creeper1 · Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:17 am Post subject:

22Yossarian · Joined: 20 Jan 2013 Posts: 68

I know somebody with similar qualifications who teaches A.P. Psych at a for-profit private high school. She is looking to move up to a Beijing public high school, and had a couple of interviews this year for such jobs.

If you can teach a subject, rather than English, it is vastly superior. You will get paid more money, you will be more valuable to your school (it is harder to quickly fire you because they actually have to find somebody qualified to teach your course, rather than hiring any foreigner who meets very low qualifications), and you will be more respected by Chinese people you meet personally.

Sinobear · Joined: 24 Aug 2004 Posts: 1269 Location: Purgatory

Look into IB training...get qualified and teach at IB schools. Chinese students love psychology but think it's just about labeling people whose experiences are different than theirs.
IB...it's the best way to avoid the "English Teacher" pitfall.

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

Don't conduct your job search on Dave's.
List on seriousteachers.com and do some responses to ads. Follow up with cold calls on likely unis and vocationals.
Look at 2nd tier cities preferably coastal - Qingdao comes to mind. These are harder to staff and as someone has mentioned if they want you the FAO will find a way.

OhBudPowellWhereArtThou · Joined: 02 Jun 2015 Posts: 1168 Location: Since 2003

A+ Non Sequitur

Your experience will make you attractive to universities in smaller cities if you can get a couple of former professors to write letters of recommendation for you. Even if it has been a decade or more since you graduated, you may find that some professors will enjoy writing letters of recommendation, even if they have only a dim recollection of you.

For tutoring experience, if it was connected to any organization, have a brief letter written on the organization's letterhead.

Get going on getting your degree authenticated.