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Are the students of 2018 better or worse than years gone by? |
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20% |
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80% |
[ 12 ] |
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Total Votes : 15 |
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theoriginalprankster
Joined: 19 Mar 2012 Posts: 895
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:18 pm Post subject: Calibre of Chinese students getting better, or not? |
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I'm heading into my 16th year of teaching in greater China - referring to the fact that I spent my first three years in the ROC/Taiwan, and I'm getting the feeling that the Chinese (yes, I am generalizing) are losing interest in learning English/improving and building their English skills.
However I should explain I've taught/trained different age groups and levels. In Taiwan I taught 6-12 year olds on a daily basis, and some private adult students. The kids were excellent - they'd learnt English in kindergarten. The privates were pretty good too.
Moved over to Xiamen, taught at a vocational college - absolutely useless, lazy bums. Moved onto Xiamen Uni - excellent students. Taught IELTS to pilot cadets at Xiamen Airlines - hard working, motivated, driven.
Then moved onto a quasi international HS in Guangdong - horrible horrible students - lazy, spoilt, unmotivated and malicious. I was glad to leave after a couple of months.
Now in Yangzhou, in the "international department" of a HS. Students are quite lazy, but seemingly not malicious. All are addicted to their phones.
Am I just unlucky, or are the students of 2018 of lower calibre than previous years? |
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The bear
Joined: 16 Aug 2015 Posts: 483
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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As you yourself acknowledged it's a big generalization, and another thing not to discount is the fact you've taught at different types of institutions. Hard to make comments on trends when the variables change.
That said, one thing that's often noted is that the poorer the student's background, the better the student. I'm sure we've all had the experience of the rich kids who are too cool for school, knowing their family will set them up for life. |
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theoriginalprankster
Joined: 19 Mar 2012 Posts: 895
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: |
That said, one thing that's often noted is that the poorer the student's background, the better the student. I'm sure we've all had the experience of the rich kids who are too cool for school, knowing their family will set them up for life. |
EXACTLY! Nail. Head.
I think teaching in the countryside could be quite fun and rewarding (not in the monetary sense).
I guess that's also why I love the Philippines so much - they are the 'poor student', and urban China is 'too cool for school'. |
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Modernist
Joined: 03 Jan 2016 Posts: 72 Location: Routing
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 12:14 am Post subject: |
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I can't claim to have notched 15 years around here, but it seems to me that you are letting your personal experiences bleed too much into generalizations about life overall, for everyone.
For example, I also teach in an international department, not a real international school. However, this school bans phones and even Internet connections. So the students can still ignore their classes, but they have to do it the old fashioned way, via doodling, reading other books, or sleeping. We have some quite bad kids here (lazy, spoiled, obnoxious, etc) as you say, but overall the kids are actually very good. The highest level kids are outstanding, on track for Top 30, or even Top 10 in a few cases, US universities. Of 4 groups I teach, 3 of them are perfectly fine in terms of effort overall, and often outstanding. Only 1 group is difficult.
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I think teaching in the countryside could be quite fun and rewarding (not in the monetary sense). |
If you are happy to be stared at and pointed at and the subject of idle gossip about everything you do, buy, wear, eat or don't eat, talk about, or person you spend time with, by every farmer and villager for 10 kilometers around...then good luck with the Chinese countryside life!
As for phone addiction, I would note that considering the resources poured into apps by giant companies with the express purpose of maximizing screen time, you can't exactly blame teenagers for being drawn into them if they aren't restricted. Everyone is.
And, as for your fetishizing of the Philippines as some sort of paradise, I guess I just don't agree. It's a fine country, I was just there 6 weeks ago, but it's not some ideal society. Filipinos are polite and welcoming, yes, but if you think Filipino students aren't addicted to phones and social media and all the rest of it, and that rich Filipinos aren't AT LEAST as spoiled and lazy as rich Chinese, then I question just how much experience you actually have in that country. |
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geosmiley
Joined: 25 Jan 2016 Posts: 62
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:02 am Post subject: Spock Kids |
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China has several generations of Spock kids, i.e., Benjamin. Hence, the one child policy was revised upward to two. I don't think the sad state of children in China is all about economic level, it's all about grandparents being overly involved while Chinese parents try to get rich as fast as they can. |
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Blistering Zanazilz
Joined: 06 Jan 2018 Posts: 180
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:19 am Post subject: Re: Spock Kids |
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geosmiley wrote: |
China has several generations of Spock kids, i.e., Benjamin. Hence, the one child policy was revised upward to two. I don't think the sad state of children in China is all about economic level, it's all about grandparents being overly involved while Chinese parents try to get rich as fast as they can. |
Like anywhere else, most parents here are busting their asses just to make a decent living for their family. Very few are getting rich or even contemplate that. |
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theoriginalprankster
Joined: 19 Mar 2012 Posts: 895
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:39 am Post subject: |
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And, as for your fetishizing of the Philippines as some sort of paradise, I guess I just don't agree. It's a fine country, I was just there 6 weeks ago, but it's not some ideal society. Filipinos are polite and welcoming, yes, but if you think Filipino students aren't addicted to phones and social media and all the rest of it, and that rich Filipinos aren't AT LEAST as spoiled and lazy as rich Chinese, then I question just how much experience you actually have in that country. |
Um, ok. I don't do fetishes.
Been six times - spent plenty of time there, know the realities of the country. Wouldn't teach as a career there, but rather to give back to the community I live in.
As a rule the average Filipino is a far more gracious, polite, endearing, well mannered, gentle and kind individual than say, um, Old Wang next door. I can authoritatively say that, with full confidence, having lived in both countries. |
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cormac
Joined: 04 Nov 2008 Posts: 768 Location: Xi'an (XTU)
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:40 am Post subject: |
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I found most of the students in the technical colleges to be motivated and hardworking. Then I moved into the "better" language universities, and found most of the students to be lazy and not particularly interested in their majors.
Chinese students with other options (family connections for work) tend to be less interested in their study. Saying that, on average, I find Chinese students to be more clued into their studies than I was at their age.
I'd consider the levels of English and the interest in English to have dropped considerably in my time here.
However, there are still plenty of students here who are an absolute joy to teach. |
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Modernist
Joined: 03 Jan 2016 Posts: 72 Location: Routing
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Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 2:34 am Post subject: |
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As a rule the average Filipino is a far more gracious, polite, endearing, well mannered, gentle and kind individual than say, um, Old Wang next door. |
I was under the impression you posted this topic to discuss students, not the population as a whole. Yes, Filipinos say 'sir' a lot, and smile frequently. So what?
I've spent time dealing with students in both countries and my impression is that they are just about the same on average. I don't see any evidence that Filipino students are 'better.' Filipinos may work a little harder (not smarter, but at least harder) but Chinese tend to be more skilled. And high-level Chinese students blow high-level Filipinos out of the water (in non-English subjects, obviously). There's a reason China is a per-capita world power in just about everything and the Philippines is a per-capita world power in virtually nothing. The Philippines, if it was a Harry Potter house, would be Hufflepuff. Kind, loyal, friendly, yes. Smart, no. A bit dim, is how I'd put it.
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Been six times - spent plenty of time there, know the realities of the country. Wouldn't teach as a career there, but rather to give back to the community I live in. |
16 years in 'greater China' and you've been there 6 times? Um, OK. I've been there twice in the last 10 months. So sorry, of course I shouldn't presume to exceed your knowledge of the place.
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I can authoritatively say that, with full confidence, having lived in both countries. |
Unless you don't have to show proof of onward departure before you board the plane like I do, then you have never 'lived' there, either.
To me, the quality of the students here is all in where you teach them and how you connect to them, or don't. In my school, I have a class of 11Gs who I relate well to, and another one that I fail consistently with. Whatever the approach that would work with the latter might be, I haven't found it. With 10Gs, I have a group that does very well, and a group that does less well, and it's not based on their relative intelligence but on my approach. In the first couple months, I handled the first group better. The second group had a few bad incidents with me, and those get remembered, and impair my efforts to work with them now in some cases. None of this is because they are Chinese, or because they do or do not hate English. It's down to the relationship you are able to build with them, if you can. Students are students everywhere. |
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Mr. Kalgukshi Mod Team


Joined: 18 Jan 2003 Posts: 6613 Location: Need to know basis only.
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Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:46 am Post subject: |
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This thread needs to get back on topic quickly.
If you wish to discuss matters related to the Philippines, please do so on the Philippines forum found on this board. |
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theoriginalprankster
Joined: 19 Mar 2012 Posts: 895
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