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Being treated well is half the battle!
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getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 712
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:20 am    Post subject: Being treated well is half the battle! Reply with quote

Hello all,
I just felt like making a positive post as I'm about to enter my 5th year living in China. I have worked at a Public Primary School for the majority of my time here.
A lot of horror stories exist all over the web but I must say that my experience teaching in China (Shanghai) has been very positive:

1. I've been treated with a great deal of respect by management, staff, work colleagues, etc. in both schools that I've worked in. Fairly well behaved, incredibly friendly and enthusiastic students for the most part.

2. I have always been paid in full and on time, inc housing and airfare.

3. Fully paid hols, 3.5 months.

4. When I was very sick for two weeks, I was still paid a full month's salary and got medical costs refunded.

I just hope that this continues and I'll happily stick at it for another year or two at least! Have I just been incredibly lucky?
I'm sure many of you must have positive stores about your working life here?
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rioux



Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 880

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

delete
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getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 712
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rioux wrote:
delete


Haha, all the negative posts on here are enough to do one's head in Smile
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7969



Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 2:07 am    Post subject: Re: Being treated well is half the battle! Reply with quote

getbehindthemule wrote:
Hello all, I just felt like making a positive post as I'm about to enter my 5th year living in China. I have worked at a Public Primary School for the majority of my time here. A lot of horror stories exist all over the web but I must say that my experience teaching in China (Shanghai) has been very positive:

1. I've been treated with a great deal of respect by management, staff, work colleagues, etc. in both schools that I've worked in. Fairly well behaved, incredibly friendly and enthusiastic students for the most part.

From your history on this forum I'm guessing that's because you're a competent and decent individual who has earned that respect. My experience here has shown me that if you treat others well then you'll be treated in kind (and vice-versa).
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getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 712
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 4:45 am    Post subject: Re: Being treated well is half the battle! Reply with quote

7969 wrote:
getbehindthemule wrote:
Hello all, I just felt like making a positive post as I'm about to enter my 5th year living in China. I have worked at a Public Primary School for the majority of my time here. A lot of horror stories exist all over the web but I must say that my experience teaching in China (Shanghai) has been very positive:

1. I've been treated with a great deal of respect by management, staff, work colleagues, etc. in both schools that I've worked in. Fairly well behaved, incredibly friendly and enthusiastic students for the most part.

From your history on this forum I'm guessing that's because you're a competent and decent individual who has earned that respect. My experience here has shown me that if you treat others well then you'll be treated in kind (and vice-versa).



Thanks 7969, that is true, respect didn't come without it being earned first! That can be said in any position in any country though I guess.
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cormac



Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 768
Location: Xi'an (XTU)

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:46 am    Post subject: Re: Being treated well is half the battle! Reply with quote

getbehindthemule wrote:
Have I just been incredibly lucky?
I'm sure many of you must have positive stores about your working life here?


Yes and no.

I've been lucky too. My first year in China was a nightmare but a good learning process. My six years since have been close to perfect.

Saying that, I personally know 10-15 foreign teachers who would consider China hell, and have gained a deep resentment towards Chinese people.

It mostly comes down to luck, and avoiding certain types of jobs.
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getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 712
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:14 am    Post subject: Re: Being treated well is half the battle! Reply with quote

cormac wrote:
getbehindthemule wrote:
Have I just been incredibly lucky?
I'm sure many of you must have positive stores about your working life here?


Yes and no.

I've been lucky too. My first year in China was a nightmare but a good learning process. My six years since have been close to perfect.

Saying that, I personally know 10-15 foreign teachers who would consider China hell, and have gained a deep resentment towards Chinese people.

It mostly comes down to luck, and avoiding certain types of jobs.



Yeah, I reckon so Cormac, interesting to hear thoughts on this. I would have zero interest in going to work at a language mill for example. I like my weekends free and wouldn't want to deal with the politics involved with many of those places.
It's not only FTs, but many other expats, that have gained a deep resentment towards China & Chinese ppl! I try my best to avoid these people!!
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cormac



Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 768
Location: Xi'an (XTU)

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's nothing wrong with language mills, per se. It depends on your agreements with them, and that you go in with your eyes wide open.

My first school was with Kids Castle, and they had my visa. Kindergarten school. The abused the contract and eventually I made a deal with them in order to be released (after 8 months). I could have avoided that if I'd done better research, but we're all very green coming over the first time.

Since then, I've always had my visa with a university, and if I worked outside, I wouldn't trust the external school. There's no point signing a contract, never give your photo (or take publicity photos), and generally get paid on the date specified without any deviation. Anything dodgy arises and I walk, even if I'm leaving money behind.

The important part of China is to be independent. Public Universities, for the most part, hire and forget you. You've got the visa covered, and the university won't bother you much as long as the students are happy with you. Which is really easy to do.

In my time in China, I've worked for 17 language mills Laughing . Most didn't have the license to hire foreigners, and only two tried to screw me. One tried to blackmail me, but since there was no paper trail, he couldn't prove that I'd worked for him, or received monies.

I've also worked for 5 universities or colleges, and had no real problems with them, beyond the housing. Minor issues really. So, I only work for universities now.

As for resentment, I think it's important to acknowledge that China isn't that different from the West. You'll meet plenty of dodgy employers in the west, it's just that having a contract means so much more. The FLIP side though is quite often FTs are doing illegal work... That's worth remembering. That would put you outside of most protections in the West too.

I have my own resentments/anger towards Chinese people from being here so long. It's natural. I just don't let the resentment show, and get on with my life. Overall, China is a fantastic place to live as a Foreigner.
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getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 712
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@cormac
I have no experience with the language mills personally but you've been through a few haha!
You hit the nail on the head with your last sentence btw. We're only human and it can be a very different place and rub us up the wrong way at times. But the positives far outweigh the negatives in my experience thus far. Cheers on this holiday eve!
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nimadecaomei



Joined: 22 Sep 2016
Posts: 605

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Getting close to my 10 year anniversary with China. I majored in Chinese at uni so came with a reason of learning. I have learned a lot, but not in that particular direction. I get on fine with people, not understanding this resentment/anger towards Chinese vibe. Occasionally, someone will be a jerk, but out of the billion and a half that is very small in numbers. I agree it can ruin a day/week/month, but that is not anything I see coming from Chinese people in general.

I got baited on my first job. Met the "boss" personally in the US, but she had no clue how things worked where her sisters ran the company. Met my wife in that time (also 10 year anniversary coming) and she had a little bit on the game they were playing (she was not connected to the company, just general knowledge of how such companies work). That job ended swiftly, I said I cannot work for you, then I finally, after a few months of no work, found a stable job.

My previous job got me 9 years experience plus helping with development. The work environment changed and I was not so happy with how things were going. I was let go, and I think that was not the worst thing in the world. It caused me to scramble, as I have a wife and child, but never in need. I have good backing here now after all the years. Family, and yes, the Chinese family is my family, and friends are awesome help.
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getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 712
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@nimadecaomei
Good on you and I wish you and your family nothing but the best!
I can relate a little bit as I've been recently married and feel that I really have a Chinese family (and a big one at that) after only two years of knowing them! The way they have treated me since the first time that I visited will stay with me for the rest of my life. Chinese people are great people from my experience bar the idiots that you will get in any country. One thing that is for sure, generally speaking, Chinese people have been (and probably continue to be in some cases) treated a lot worse in Western countries recently than we are in China!
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Non Sequitur



Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah if you are accepted in can be very heart warming. I Skyped a former student at Chinese NY and my face on her tablet was passed around the dinner table.
My former student translated for the people who didn't speak English but I communicated well enough with her nephews.
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Markness



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 738
Location: Chengdu

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers to hear that others also have positive experiences in the land of the middle kingdom.

I've shared some negative experiences around here in the past, but I have to say on the whole my experiences here in China have been solid, but that is a little bit because of luck and perserverence.

Firstly, I'd say that people that have poor experiences here generally have them because they end up in the sticks or "real china" and they discover it isn't as mystical as the movies make it out to be. Living in a big city or the suburb of one is quite important because you'll be able to access first-world medicine, first-world food, and first-world education/educated folk. This will lead to less resentment towards the locals that may or may not treat you like a zoo animal.

Secondly, I've gotten myself in a good situation with a lovely wife and a good job(s). This has made my experience a lot better. It saves me from having to go out all the time and hang out with folk that drink for a living. Those people are usually not here for the long haul so they'll make you not enjoy living here so much.

Thirdly, because my missus is now pregnant, I've discovered that having a little one is quite expensive so we've had to upgrade our living situation to be more accomodating for a little one. This has lead us to one of the fancier areas in the city that I could not dream of living in back in my hometown.

A final point: my missus, her family, and my co-workers all have my back. I think having a good relationship with all of these people is paramount.

Overall, I'd say China is what you make of it. If you want the good stuff (education, food, medicine, home), then you need to be willing to pay for it. After taking all of this in mind, I've been working like a madman, but it has been absolutely worth it. It grants me some happiness knowing that I have a wife and a little one or two that need me to provide for them and give them a good life. China has allowed me to have this so I am grateful.

TLDR: Move to big city, work a lot, and you'll avoid 99 percent of the problems that people commonly complain about here. Have a nice day!

Mark
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Non Sequitur



Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Mark
Glad things are turning out well for you.
Best
NS
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getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 712
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to echo NS
Great to hear. I have always enjoyed your posts over the few years that I've been on here.

'a little bit because of luck and perserverence.'
Agree, and with your take on living in a big City for your first year or two is a must imo! Although not all will agree, I'd say a very large percentage of newbes didnt last very long when their first stint in the middle kingdom was in a backwater Smile
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