Job Discussion Forums

[myprofe]

Whether you believe that the education our children receive in today�s schools should include a wide range of subjects or whether they should be allowed to specialize early on in a specific field, you can�t deny the importance of second language skills. The failure of the government and the educational system to take the proper steps to address this issue has given rise to an ever increasing number of people being refused entry into the job market because of a lack of language skills. Having lost the opportunity to pick up a second language at an age and in an environment conducive to learning, these young adults are forced to put their profession careers on hold in order to study on their own what they should have been taught in school. The politicians claim that they have everything under control and that the next generation of children will be bilingual.
Gordon http://www.myprofe.com/tandem

[Stephen Jones]

[myprofe]

[leeroy]

I don't know anything about the Spanish employment situation.

But on a wider level - it seems quite often the case that English language ability is a prerequisite for jobs that seemingly don't really need it. English, for many people, implies "educated, rich, globalised, western, modern" etc... For many, people are learning English not through a genuine desire to communicate in it but for the prestige in saying they are able to.

[jr1965]

I agree with you, Gordon, that being able to speak/read/write in a second lang is an extremely valuable skill to have. I don't think, though, that not being able to speak English has prevented many Spaniards from getting work--at least in the past.

I have family and friends in Madrid. My friends are in their 30s, and all of them studied some English in high school and college. They all now have good jobs--one is in education (a math teacher); others are civil servants; two are in technology, and one is in sales (works for Toyota). Only those in tech and sales need to use English on a (somewhat) regular basis. The others have never really had to in their work or daily lives, and so their level of Engish, not suprisingly, is much lower. I studied German in high school and college, and lived in Austria for a time, but the fact is, my level is now pitifully low b/c I haven't really used the lang in any way for almost 12 years.

Still, the world has changed a lot in the last 10-15 years, so I understand the Spanish govt.'s urgent desire that all children in the next 10 years be fully fluent in English and Spanish. Let's see if THAT happens.

[Roger]

Maybe some of you guys ought to take a long and hard look at a map that shows Spain; now do tell me: wbhy on Earth are you convinced the Spaniards badly need English to get jobs???
Those who migrate go to France or Germany or Italy - where none of them will ever need English.
In the past Spaniards used to study French more often than English. I guess this has changed by now. But still, a Spaniard has hardly any convincing reason to study English rather than any other European language.
Still, I also feel "there are more English speakers in Barcelona than in Hong Kong". And, might I add, Gibraltar has absolutely nothing to do with this!

[myprofe]

[jr1965]

Roger said "But still, a Spaniard has hardly any convincing reason to study English rather than any other European language."

Actually, I think this is true for many Spaniards. Honestly, the only people I know who really *need* English are in sales or technology, and are working for companies like Yahoo Espana, Terra, Toyota, etc. On occasion, they have to converse via email and phone or meet with clients who do not speak Spanish (interestingly, most of my friends and acquaintances who are in sales are using English to communicate primarily with Japanese and Korean clients).

[Stephen Jones]

Roger you're way behind the times with Spanish emigration. The emigration fo tow-thirds of the population of villages in Galicia to Northern France, or whole villages in Andulucia upping sticks and going off with the priest at the head to find employment in Catalonia or Germany are long gone.

English is definitely needed as a second language within Spain in order to liase with businesses in other non-English speaking countriesn,partly for tourists though German, Japanese and to a lesser degree French are important there, and for scientists and IT specialists to keep up to date with the literature in their field.

However this does not apply to the whole population. The shop assistant, factory worker, plumber, petrol station attendant, lorry driver, taxi driver or farmer do not need English. Indeed there has been a great improvement in the standard of English in Spain in the last twenty-five years. Most language schools used to have a majority of adult students at the beginner and lower-intermediate levels - now there are large numbers of students at upper-intermediate and post First Certificate level.

This improvement has of course been the result of a vast financial investment by the middle and skilled working classes in private teachers and language schools. The school system has had no more success in turning out English speakers than it has in most of the rest of the world. Indeed I have only ever met one student who reached a passable degree if fluency in English through his normal school lessons.