Job Discussion Forums

A.K.A.T.D.N. · Joined: 12 Jun 2004 Posts: 170

TS, it looks like you're on a real love crusade here, making everyone who opposes your so-called knowledge and experience in Asia having to give one great big kiss on your behind in deference to otherwise.

Your experiences here don't seem to be all that knowledgeable, nor your comments about the Taiwanese. Plenty of advice, and comments, could be offered to the contrary.

It makes me feel you're just on a love crusade here, kissing Chinese butt at every turn. You leave out a lot of the negativities of living and working here that are just downright dumb, like having to act that you're a teacher without the provisions to be one here in the first place, an aspect that should be your first priority. This also makes me wonder if you overlook the lies and deceptions and dubiousness of dealing with(and oh yes, it's the Chinese,) regarding most business transactions.

People I've met here after having lived in Taiwan for five years or more at least know that when a school is supposed to pay you on Friday, but then tell you that "Oh, we can't pay you until Monday because the president isn't here," or give you someother lame excuse, also know that something is afoot with the Chinese like one South African gal said concerning her experiences in retrospect, "You can't trust them."

This lack of trust usually has to do with money-matters. Another South African guy, after also having lived here for five years said "The Chinese just want to see how far they can go without paying you." Is this being prejudiced to say such things?

Sorry if you think I'm being prejudiced or biased, but I think it's the other way around in regards to the majority of Chinese bringing this opinion and negative attitude upon themselves and your biased, positivistic approach to things. This is just a judgment, not a prejudice. When and if I find the right job, perhaps I'll change my mind. But this problem appears to be too prevasive in this society, as many foreigners here may well know.

Love on.

TaoyuanSteve · Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan

FYI, newbie, I never claimed to be all knowing. However, I am certainly more knowledgeable than you. Few would dispute that fact.

Yes, people could offer alternative opinions and advice; and they are free to do so.

Your opinions about Chinese, as racist and prejudiced as they are, don't form the main part of my criticism of your posts here. You come here, take a dump on your keyboard and post it. Most of what you post are inconherent ramblings or angry rants about your situation here, when all you've got is yourself to blame. I'm not the only one who has grown tired of your nonsense and victim mentality. You reveal a lot about yourself in your posts here. I, without ever having met you, already know you have a long history of failures in the Asia English teaching scene. You eventually got booted from Korea. You've come and simply started repeating your pattern here. That much is obvious. You sound as if you dislike the Chinese. I'm quite sure the feeling is mutual.

The greates irony of all is that your anger at my online persona has produced your most intelligible, grammatically correct post ever. Contratulations. Perhaps I should keep making you angry, so that your posts here make some kind of sense.

wombat · Joined: 18 Jun 2004 Posts: 134

A.K.A.T.D.N. · Joined: 12 Jun 2004 Posts: 170

These two guys aren't worth my breath in a smoky, internet cafe!

Look at 'em, both back to back, two scared kittens up against one little dog, a dog they presumed just got lost here.

This is the attitude I get from this guy TS. And Wombat just seems to be his alter ego. They both want to protect their little ego's, or the status quo. Could it be they don't want this board to be what they fear? That is, do they fear this board might shatter their egocentric worlds, making them thus less special here?

The main gist of my comments are directed at the Chinese to some extent, but more or less to the Chinese mentality. This is all because I'm in China, after all. Therefore, for me to say that my experiences here as a teacher have been negative, a fact which they have AS AN ENGLISH TEACHER, doesn't imply I'm being racist against all of Taiwanese people or of the culture itself. These two dogmatic apologists, Wombat/TS, have some serious rethinking to do about their understanding of critical thinking, societal evils and of words themselves. But again, this is probably a waste of breath.

The majority of peoples experiences with THE CHINESE MENTALITY, is that when money is involved, they are often tight, dishonest, and in business matters, untrustworthy.

The Chinese society, in one respect, has an innate tendency to crave money above all moral and legal restraints thinking money itself, and wealth, are what make for success and image, instead of the good old principles of honesty and character in lieu of success and personal image. You may construe this as just good old human nature in all of societies. This much I agree with. But to defraud people in deceptive ways in order for dishonest gain yourself, which is a SERIOUS PROBLEM HAPPENING HERE AMONGST THESE SCHOOLS, is just a simple reflection of this society's norms and values.

Then to say that I'm being RACIST is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. This you do by debunking all arguments by saying that SOME PEOPLE ENJOY IT HERE. . .OTHERS DON'T!! THE LATTER ARE THE ONES THAT PACK UP THEIR BAGS AND LEAVE etc.

This isn't the point. Point is, is there proof to the contrary that THE CHINESE "DON'T" HAVE A TENDENCY TO BE DECEPTIVE TO THE POINT OF DISHONESTY, ie lying, when it comes to business matters, PARTICULARLY AT THESE ESL SCHOOLS!!!

Prove this wrong, and then come and call me a racist again. I'd like to hear the truth, other than, WELL BOB. . .YOU HAVE TO TAKE THE GOOD WITH THE BAD, YOU KNOW. . .KEEP POSITIVE. . .IT'S NOT ALL TAIWANESE. . .and so on. Indeed it isn't all Taiwanese. But it is an aspect of Taiwanese society that gives most Chinese a bad reputation in this regard. Heck, I've even heard a comment on this board or elsewhere, that "It's expected of you to lie in Taiwan." To lie? Is lying something you condone?

Hey, it's like Bush in Iraq, right? But I'm not shouting F#$CK YOU TAIWAN! That, my friends, would be racist.

I do like it here. But see, money isn't my sole motivation here. It's to live as a full human being too, in light of making some money. I find this aspect lacking in some people on this board, and on the Korean forum, AND IN TAIWAN!! They lack this understanding in order to assuage their consiences that something really and truly, is wrong, making the other guy feel guilty for opposing them for their opinions. As for the Chinese. . .well, there just is no real guilt of consience when it comes to making money, from what I see.

TaoyuanSteve · Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan

AKATDN, do you really think you have support on this forum? It's near unanimous. We're all sick of your drawn out rants and unintelligeable writing style. You know nothing about Taiwan or Chinese people, yet you talk in broad sweeping generalizations. If you did say "f%ck you Taiwan, it would be by far less racist than your descriptions of the "Chinese mentality," as if 1) you really know what that is and 2) all Chinese people are exactly the same.

You talk as if Wombat and I are the only two who oppose you. C'mon. Take a look at your (excessively abundant) past posts and threads to see just how many users have either opposed your views or complained about your behaviour here.

kait · Joined: 17 Jun 2004 Posts: 93 Location: Lungtan, Taiwan

AKA (I've never bothered to learn the rest of your name),

Perhaps everyone would find it enlightening if you dedicated an entire post to explaining what you love about living and working in Asia. I, personally, haven't been clear on why you are still here -- in Asia that is. It seems that you've been having a miserable time since you arrived. Of course, it's possible that you would be miserable wherever you were.

It reminds me of one of those humorous lists that are passed around the internet. This list was of things people had supposedly said on job applications. For reason you left your last job, someone supposedly said, "I was made a scapegoat, just like at my last 4 jobs."

wombat · Joined: 18 Jun 2004 Posts: 134

A.K.A.T.D.N. · Joined: 12 Jun 2004 Posts: 170

Like I'm going to really read this Wombat? And some of you call my comments rantings and ravings?

Check out this rude and racist remark by TS: "Do you really think you have support on this forum? It's nearly unanimous." And how many users do you have on this forum, TS? You, Wombat and Taylor? Maybe Katie and Colin? Hmnn, makes me wonder if they're related.

Listen, but if you don't mind me being straightforward, aren't you, TS, a little bit of a pompous ass and someone who has to rebuff every person who makes a statement contrary to yours?

It's nearly unanimous. You get my vote 100%!!

But if you're talking about a board that's pretty much dominated by a view blind followers, people who just recently hopped on board, ie., Kait, with 51 posts, Colin with 21 posts, and good old alter ego Wombat/Taylor, and call this UNANIMOUS, then I must laugh.

I laugh because you're guilty of just what I suspected all along. You're guilty of THINKING YOU'VE GOT THE RIGHT TO CLAIM YOU'RE THE EXPERT HERE!! DOESN'T THIS SOUND EGOTISTICAL!!!!

And then Wombat says I'm using generalizations. Perhaps he doesn't understand quotes, or examples, or personal experiences that not only I've had, but others as well.

I like your so-called knowledgeable comments, because you really come across as a know-it-all, of sorts. No one is looking for that on this board. You seem to think you're that person, however, always criticizing others' comments that differ to disagree with things here, and this without facts other than the fact you might be married to a Chinese lady to make you FEEL otherwise.

That is, unless you're just trying to come across as the antagonist in order to stimulate this board here so that teachers would think, Wow, Taiwan's not so bad. . .TS says so. . .I can be part of the club here too!!

Get real and read up on Chinese cultural norms.

As for Aristotle's comment about lying-if it was him- I actually found this out to be quite true when I gave you the example of the employer trying not to pay me on time by saying "The president isn't here today. We'll pay you on Monday." THIS, AS YOU MAY NOTE, WAS A BLATANT LIE so as to not pay on time.

If you know anything about the Chinese culture. . .oh, I'm wasting my time here.

wombat · Joined: 18 Jun 2004 Posts: 134

markholmes · Joined: 21 Jun 2004 Posts: 661 Location: Wengehua

Fortigurn · Joined: 29 Oct 2003 Posts: 390

Great posts wombat. And I agree with you also Mark.

TaoyuanSteve · Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan

Mods please delete AKATDN remark about the "pompous ass." It's personally offensive and inappropriate behaviour on these boards.

As for Chinese culture (or your insinuation that I know nothing about it), I don't claim to be an expert. However, to my credit I have: 1) my residence here 2) my ability in the language. I will not call myself fluent, but I am conversant to a fairly high degree. I also am fairly literate and can read most of what I see around me. 3) I grew up among Asians (I come from Vancouver) 4) I am in a long term relationship with a woman of Chinese ancestry and have constant contact with her local family members. As for reading up on Chinese culture, I have done so quite extensively. Have you? No. So, as far as Chinese culture is concerned, while I'm not claiming to be an expert, I'm a professor when compared to you.

I'm not a know-it-all sort, nor am I a "pompous ass" (I'll thank you in advance for deleting those comments. They cross a line that shouldn't be crossed on the net). That's just more childish mudslinging on your part. Can't deal with someone on the level of debate? Resorting to namecalling is the tactic of choice for those less intellectually endowed. You do that a few times in your last post. It doesn't reflect on you very highly, not that anyone here likes you anyway.
Grow up AKATDN.

BTW. I gather from one of your other posts that you are attempting to return to Korea. Let me be the first to say: don't let the door hit you in the rear on your way out of here!

Dr_Zoidberg · Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:57 am Post subject:

I'm new to ESL cafe. I haven't read many posts by AKATDN, probably only those in this thread.

AKATDN, the best thing you could do for yourself is to get back to Western society. It doesn't make sense anyone feeling the way you do about Taiwan staying there, whatever the reason for feeling that way.

Seriously, you are one angry dude.

Pax vobiscum

MTurton · Joined: 10 Mar 2004 Posts: 107

TaoyuanSteve · Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan

I certainly would not be one to claim everything is done on the up-and-up here. It is important to protect yourself. Scams and dishonest people are everywhere. However, I agree with the essence of what Wombat wrote. A lot of the teachers who complain of mistreatment brought the problem on themselves. Perhaps we English teachers are living in a foreigner bubble, but that can only be a good thing. Most English schools will treat their foreign staff pretty well, possibly better than some deserve. Only one person I've met has ever had a serious problem with a legal employer. That employer was, however, not Taiwanese and, once the incident got reported to the authorities, it was resolved to the former employee's satisfaction.