Job Discussion Forums

[Yu]

My students were required to do essays. Many of the same problems occured in their essays, so I think it might be British English...

Using learnt where I think they should use learned....

Using maths instead of math....

If learnt is correct, what is the correct usage?

Thanks.

[Larry Parnell]

It is British English. 'Learnt' is the same as 'learned'.

[Old Dog]

leap leapt,leaped
learn learnt,learned
smell smelt;smelled

and so the list goes on

While I hate to rely on web sites for my info, at a quick glance, these are the alternatives in English taught in China, Hungary, Poland, Denmark, ....

I had not realized that American English does not permit of both alternatives. But if an American insists that "learnt" is not part of American English, then we must accept the word from the horse's mouth.

[badtyndale]

Yu should stop worrying about it. Inconsistencies in spelling are trivial unless they affect the reader's comprehension. I've been offered that much incomprehensible gibberish by transliterating dictionary and thesaurus driven kids that I no longer wince when I see such alternative spellings.

[Yu]

It is just that these mistakes are so consistent, I just wondered if they were British. I am intersted in the differences between different forms of Englishes. I think it is useful to point out to students there are these differences.... then again maybe I shouldn't as they may think if there are different acceptable forms of Englishes, then Chinglish should also qualify.

[badtyndale]

They are not 'mistakes'. Spelling and usage merely varies. If a student is consistent then I see no problem. You appear to be approaching this matter from a Chinese perspective, i.e. assuming that there is but one (correct) way of communicating in English. Relax. As for informing your students about the differences - it depends on their level. Higher level students might find it interesting, otherwise I'd leave well alone. As I said before, if it doesn't affect comprehension it really doesn't matter. Most reference books that deal with English usage have something about alternative spellings etc. Under no circumstances would Chinglish qualify as an acceptable form of English language.

[Kurochan]

[quote="Yu"]It is just that these mistakes are so consistent, I just wondered if they were British. I am intersted in the differences between different forms of Englishes. I think it is useful to point out to students there are these differences.... quote]

Yes, they're not really mistakes, they're just British English. They do say learnt, where in the US we've mostly dropped using -t as a past tense ending, except for "burnt." There are quite a few other differences as well. I think in most of the occasions when we'd use "gotten," they just say "got." Maths just means math, going to hospital is the same as going to the hospital, going on holiday is the same as going on a holiday, and so on. The IELTS prep book I use in my class was written by an English man and includes sentences like, "On a weekend I like to relax," whereas of course we'd say "on the weekend." British English also has different rules for addressing envelopes. There are differences in punctuation as well, apparently. I didn't know about that until I read "Eats, Shoots and Leaves." In American English, a comma or period always go inside quotation marks, but apparently it's not a hard and fast rule in British English. Really, it's worth looking up the differences, and making your students acquainted with them.

[Ace]

Did I miss something? I'd be more worried about an English teacher who came up with a word like 'Englishes'...

[Chris_Crossley]

[Yu]

How about Firstly, Secondly, and Thirdly.... Are these used in British English, How about American English. I had never seen them until I started correcting students papers so I am wondering where they came from.

Ace... what is wrong with Englishes? As Chris said it refers to other types of Englishes.

I am being serious about Chinglish being able to be considered a form of English tough... I mean could that argument be made? BEV is considered an acceptable form of English. How is this different from Chinglish?

[Nauczyciel]

Guys,

I am not sure, but I remember reading somewhere that there are differences between these alternatives in meaning, not only in spelling, e.g.:

"I learned some new words yesterday" vs "I learnt yesterday that he's dead"

"I dreamed about her last night" vs "I dreamt of becoming rich when I was a child" (or vice versa, I am not certain here)

Do I remember correctly?

[waxwing]

Err why not just check in dictionaries?
Both Oxford and Webster's (the latter I checked from dictionary.com) say that learnt is an acceptable second and third form of the verb, and that it doesn't depend on British/American English.

so
learn, [learnt/learned], [learnt/learned]

and Maths is indeed the British term.

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

Just tell your students that there is British English spelling (which is followed by England, Scotland, Ireland, Wales, Northern Ireland, Isle of Man, Jamaica, Nigeria, Cameroon, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Zimbabwe, India, South Africa, Sri Lanka, Pakistan, Hong Kong, Singapore, Guiana, Belize, Burmuda, etc. etc...) and there is American English spelling, which is followed by America.

Neither is right nor wrong.

Just remember the old song:

You say tuh-may-toe, I say toe-mah-toe........you say puh-tay-toe, I say poe-tah-toe.....

[Ace]

is it in the dictionary Yu, or are you too of the 'English as she is spoke' school?

[Brian Caulfield]

Non count nouns can be used with the plural form of adding an s when describing the different classifications or subspecies of the thing . An example is ,;The fishes of the seas are dieing . Or the monies of the world are depreciating .
What I find more important for my students to recognize is not the small differences in spelling but differences in pronunciation between the two languages. I also want them to able to understand other foreigners using English . So If they are talking with a Korean or Taiwanese person they will have to understand some of these nuancesBetween British and American English . Two contries divided by a common language .