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A troll list
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Is a troll list a good idea or bad?
Good idea
36%
 36%  [ 12 ]
Bad idea
51%
 51%  [ 17 ]
Not sure
12%
 12%  [ 4 ]
Total Votes : 33

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merlin



Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 582
Location: Somewhere between Camelot and NeverNeverLand

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 1:35 pm    Post subject: A troll list Reply with quote

Good idea or bad?
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Gordon



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem is that they change names so often , usually just after they are spotted. They hate to be recognized or ignored.

Maybe a few trolls could tell us what makes them tick.
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valley_girl



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 272
Location: Somewhere in Canada

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I belong to another website and people are always accusing others of being trolls and aliases (of another, more familiar nickname). How do you define a troll? Moreover, who casts the final judgement on who is a troll and who is just an overzealous poster with unusual views? Seems a bit like a kangaroo court, if you ask me.

How do you know you won't be accused of being a troll yourself? All you have to do is tick one person off and you could have your name on somebody's list. If that person has power, off with your head. Wink
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Buraimi



Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 9:07 pm    Post subject: I hope I'm not the only one Reply with quote

Am I the only one who isn't sure just exactly what a troll is? Hope not. A definition would be helpful.
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GeminiTiger



Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 999
Location: China, 2005--Present

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Buraimi wrote:
Am I the only one who isn't sure just exactly what a troll is? Hope not. A definition would be helpful.


A troll as I understand is someone who makes personal attacks to
attempt to make a point or spams or something like that.. Now days
it is just another name-calling device people use regardless of what
your intention/act are when someone disagrees with you.

valley_girl wrote:
I belong to another website and people are always accusing others of being trolls and aliases (of another, more familiar nickname). How do you define a troll? Moreover, who casts the final judgement on who is a troll and who is just an overzealous poster with unusual views? Seems a bit like a kangaroo court, if you ask me.

How do you know you won't be accused of being a troll yourself? All you have to do is tick one person off and you could have your name on somebody's list. If that person has power, off with your head. Wink


Well said lady.
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Will.



Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 783
Location: London Uk

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 12:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not sure if it is the troll under the bridge that eats anything it catches or the trolling method of fishing where you catch anything you can which is a better descriptor

Will.
Gemini. Dog
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GambateBingBangBOOM



Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some posters are extremely knowledgable and helpful in many, many ways, but are just totally against anything that has to do with certain issues to the point of supplying detrimental information.

To me, that would make an ordinarily very, very helpful poster into a troll with regards to that single issue.

Plus, other than obvious trolls (that thankfully are few and far between on this board, but are very common and annoying on other boards), what constitutes a troll to one person may not be what constitutes a troll to another. People constantly giving incorrect information may actually believe it themselves, and not believe others who say they are incorrect.
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Dr.J



Joined: 09 May 2003
Posts: 304
Location: usually Japan

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it refers to the "trolling" method of fishing. The aim is just to make other people angry/unhappy.

It's kind of like a heckler during a speech; sometimes they say something clever, but usually they just like the sound of their own voice.

As for a banning list, well, the best thing is just to speak to them once normally, and if they persist then ignore them and they go away. I do this with ignorant people all the time and it works just fine.
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Lynn



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 696
Location: in between

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A troll is not just someone who makes personal attacks. A troll is someone who is uninterested in ESL, rather he/she is just here to get a rise from others and watch what type of reaction he/she can get. Often times he posts something he doesn't even beleive in, just to get a reaction.
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merlin



Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 582
Location: Somewhere between Camelot and NeverNeverLand

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was deliberately vague in my first post to see what others came up.

To me a troll is someone who posts disingenuously. Someone who posts crap genuinely isn't a troll. I think Lynn's description is a good one. Of course an argumentative person could say "How can you possibly know if a person is genuine?" Well, sometimes it's hard to tell but quite often it's obvious.

Other 'net terms:
Flame/Flamer - someone who is extremely negative towards others' posts. Some forums prohibit flaming so as to avoid "flame wars" but the nettiquette guide I prefer states that some posters soemtimes deserve to be flamed.

I was also thinking of a list that only moderators could post to. Again, I didn't state this right off so as to free up the discussion. The purpose would be to give us all a kind of "heads up" first thing every morning before we start the day off wrong reading a disingenuous post while still half asleep.
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dmb



Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would a troll ever admit to trolling?
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kev7161



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 5880
Location: Suzhou, China

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A troll is only as powerful as the number of people who take the time to respond to him (or her).
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Ben Round de Bloc



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1946

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's the first part of an article of one person's take on trolls, what they do, why they do it, etc.
Quote:
An Internet "troll" is a person who delights in sowing discord on the Internet. He (and it is usually he) tries to start arguments and upset people.

Trolls see Internet communications services as convenient venues for their bizarre game. For some reason, they don't "get" that they are hurting real people. To them, other Internet users are not quite human but are a kind of digital abstraction. As a result, they feel no sorrow whatsoever for the pain they inflict. Indeed, the greater the suffering they cause, the greater their 'achievement' (as they see it). At the moment, the relative anonymity of the net allows trolls to flourish.

Trolls are utterly impervious to criticism (constructive or otherwise). You cannot negotiate with them; you cannot cause them to feel shame or compassion; you cannot reason with them. They cannot be made to feel remorse. For some reason, trolls do not feel they are bound by the rules of courtesy or social responsibility.

Perhaps this sounds inconceivable. You may think, "Surely there is something I can write that will change them." But a true troll can not be changed by mere words.

http://members.aol.com/intwg/trolls.htm
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Chris_Crossley



Joined: 26 Jun 2004
Posts: 1797
Location: Still in the centre of Furnace City, PRC, after eight years!!!

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 12:03 pm    Post subject: Troll's "comment" about Schindler's List Reply with quote

Dr.J wrote:
I think it refers to the "trolling" method of fishing. The aim is just to make other people angry/unhappy.


A few weeks ago, I watched the movie "Schindler's List" on DVD with my Chinese wife. She found a lot of the scenes quite moving, as you can imagine. Anyway, afterwards, I decided to look at some movie web sites with forums like this with a view to seeing what people thought of the movie.

One person allegedly dismissed it as a "cheap remake" of another movie from ten years before, and made somewhat cheap comments about the location, the acting, even the many ordinary people involved as extras.

kev7161 wrote:
A troll is only as powerful as the number of people who take the time to respond to him (or her).


Predictably enough, snide comments made about a film like "Schindler's List" generated angry responses from people who basically attacked him for being a "troll" (and that was putting it mildly) and for being prejudiced, ignorant, and all the rest. Not only that, but the movie the poster had referred to was actually made ten years after "Schindler's List", not before.

Eventually, after a lot of heated comments made, the OP came back to say that what he did was a total wind-up, and he basically laughed at everyone who had got so hot under the collar. For him, watching people get angry was entertainment for him - he didn't need any DVD to do it for him.

Some people had commented along the lines of "Don't get angry with him - ignore him." However, people continued to take the OP's bait, much to the latter's delight.

Lynn wrote:
A troll is someone who is [...] just here to get a rise from others and watch what type of reaction he/she can get. Often times he posts something he doesn't even [believe] in, just to get a reaction.


Lynn is certainly right, given that the reactions to that OP's comments about "Schindler's List" were so scathing. Those others probably only succeeded in getting the proverbial egg on their faces.
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merlin



Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 582
Location: Somewhere between Camelot and NeverNeverLand

PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wise words, Chris.

I think I'll leave the tar babies to 'ol brer fox from now on.
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