Job Discussion Forums

[Yu]

There are about 30 sections of Sophomore English where I teach. Students were given a midterm exam. My students had an average score of 60.05. 82 was the highest score. Most teacher said that their students did not do well on the exam. I think I may have graded my students too hard. I was not really given guidelines, and I tend to grade hard anyway. I have done some thinking, and feel an adjustment may be appropriate. Also, another foreign teacher (who is also teaching sophmore English) regraded one of my tests using her criteria. The student was given 5 points higher. Also, the writing section I graded especially hard. Part of the reason was that I did not really understand the students way of thinking as they wrote their answers, after talking to them I have reconsidered some of their responses.

Any input?

[vdrose]

same with my previous experience,after the examination the result was really unsatisfactory,what i did is asked the students and teachers as well and i realized that english is really difficult for them,simple words for us are really difficult even for the chinese teacher,so what i did is to adjust my criteria in grading, we can't expect them to get high marks and high english level,if the chinese english teacher is having a hard time much more the students

br

[Ace]

C'mon, they're just lazy slackers...read what Prince Charles said about the state of education today! England must be similar...

1. Find out the score necessary for 'scholarships' (and look for some redeeming features in your favourite or most deserving students' compositions and adjust their grades accordingly...expect about 7 or 8 in a class)

2. Establish a decent average - next time ensure you have at least one very easy multiple-choice (also easy to mark) section to assist with this...

3. Find out the pass mark - usually 60%, which is really challenging for a marker...but make sure everybody passes.

PS...I guess you know, the Chinese teachers get favoured or friendly students (or students who need credit of some kind) to assist them with marking...?

Don't work too hard!

[Roger]

This is the second thread on exams in China within the week; why don't we devise some way out of a dilemma imposed on us from on high?

For instance, those bloody so-called "exams" should be re-labelled. They aren't exams in the least little bit. They are an exercise in make-believe in pseudo-exams. Students know it, and the system knows it as well. I call this "sham exams".
An exam would test a well-defined ability or skill or knowledge to be attained step by step over the time of a semester or a year, using approved materials. It would have to be part of a syllabus.
We are not instructed on any objectives, nor on what level our students have, nor how to grade. Those grades are our personal yardstick, and yardsticks should not be personal but unfiorm and unified, that is, standardised. How can you achieve standardisation if you have to supervise your very own students in their exam, and grade their output??? This is stupid, full stop. In advanced countries, there is a national syllabus, and whether students fail or succeed is NOT the teacher's responsability - as it is in China! Students in advanced societies sit exams under totally different procters and teachers, and they get their grades from impartial experts who don't know them.
But in China, your rapport with your students is more important than their efforts...
If my students don't achieve the goals I set for them (usually after I found out where they stand in English!), then they clearly have flunked the test and get a fail grade!
Whether the school upgrades that is another matter; I for one want to vent my disappointment if I am entitled to feel disappointed...
They need to know that they won't get far in an anglophone country with their disfunctional, grammaticlly-challenged English!

[ymmv]

I don't have any answers for you, just a suggestion based on one point you should keep in mind, for what it's worth. (And let me preface this by saying that I taught in colleges back home and I have only taught in public universities in China. So it may not be suitable advice for those teaching at middle schools, "foreign language schools", or "private" colleges for the rich dregs.)

So here goes: You (Yu) said there are 30 sections of English students spread, I assume, across multiple foreign teachers.

Like western universities, Chinese universities keep running totals on students grades and it gets very competitive at the student level. Many awards, scholarships, prizes, positions (i.e class monitor) are based on these overall intra-section ratings. If one or two foreign teachers' sections' marks are significantly higher or lower than other sections, it skews the ratings and will cause great resentment among those affected (i.e. the students).

You are aware that your grades are skewed on the low end, obviously, since you posted your dilemma. It was also a good idea to ask a colleague to do a "trial-marking" based on his/her own criteria. Good for you. You are engaged in what you are doing.

I'm not always a fan of curves, but in this case, you might want to think about applying a curve so that you don't UNDULY affect the overall rankings among all of the English sections.

Actually, in my experience here, it's been the opposite problem: "xinlaide" (new) FTs and those with no previous teaching experience prior to China who come here and give everyone "A" because they are clueless on (a) teaching, and (b) teaching Chinese students. This happened 3 times with 3 different FTs at my school in the last two years. They turned in A's for everyone.

Now, granted in these three cases, they were all Spoken English courses. (Writing classes are much easier to generate input for marking purposes, admittedly.) When queried by the Dean, the teachers all had some form of the "Well, the students were all so nice and friendly, and they came to class every week, and so it would be a shame to ....."

I don't know how (or if) the Dean solved the problem in those cases - didn't want to ask nor get in the middle of it.

But I know his dilemma because we talked about it before: those teachers skew the rankings up for their classes, thus causing resentment among the other students. Which is often why, as many have heard tell on this forum, some deans simply ignore the grades foreign teachers give. "You FTs grade too easy." I have heard this many time before. So the Chinese administrators often just "neuter" the role of FT grades by applying the most dasterdly of curves...everyone gets credit, but no grade for their FT class. It's simply ignored.

In these particular cases, I doubt that he did that. I know for a fact that they DO add the FT class grades to the students' totals. But other schools I know of, would have just ignored it.

Yu, I admire you in grading your way and grading hard. But keep in mind the very real effect it may have on your very own students within the very real construct of their university life. Perhaps applying a curve in this case will help - it will give you a semblance of having maintained your standards. It will give the students' a semblance of, "Wow, I have to work on my English writing." And it will give you a good reputation of being a tough but fair foreign teacher who cares about what she is doing, but also cares about the welfare of her students. Win-Win-Win

[laodeng]

Based on almost five years' experience in Chinese universities, I would say:

1. Grade on the curve.

2. Don't fail anyone.

3. Realize that bad marks are going to be "administratively adjusted" anyway. Even at Jiao Da.

4. Protect your own equanimity.

[Yu]

Thanks to everyone.

Roger your post rings especially true. I have been very frustrated by the entire test process. The exam students are given is not really an accurate measure of their English ablility. I have one student in my class who has only missed class once or twice, he actively participates in every class, and speak and writes well in English. He got less than 50 on the exam.

The test that they were given was not written by me, and I do not really beleive it is a good measure of their grades or English ability. There was a listening section. I heard part of it and had trouble to catch what was being said. How can NNS be expected to catch word for work. Another part of the listening section involved completing an outline. I read the section, and had trouble to complete the outline. The third part of the listening most students did fine. Also, there was a reading comprehension section which would be similar to TOEFL. Also there was a vocabulary and structure section. Finally, there was a writing section. I don't really think it accuratly measures their English. I also hate objective tests to begin with.

There are only 2 foreign teachers, the rest (about 12) are Chinese teachers. My avearage was 10 points lower than the other foreign teacher's scores. I don't think it is because I am a worse teacher or that she has substantially better students.

Recently I made a post complaining that I did not really have any goals or objectives to work with. I think this rings especially true with the exams.

Again, Thanks for the input.

[Roger]

My heart goes out to teachers like you, Yu, who actually compare notes and ask for someone's opinion. I was simply too afraid of making a fool of myself by asking my British and American colleagues; I then asked one of those senior English techers recruited locally. Later, I heard from many westerners that they felt being taken for a ride as their own judgement didn't matter one jota; they had to pass students no matter wha
I learnt my ropes later in Hong Kong where the teaching and examinations are more rigorously done, according to criteria set in cement.
It is a hell of a disservice to students themselves if we flatter them up with over-buttered grades; they often dream of enrolling at a university abroad - and then comes the awakening. For those older than 20, learning the language more effectively is almost impossible. They waste their time and funds on privatel tuition - only to be knocked back by a strict visa application procedure and very strict enrolment requiremPassing the TOEFL in China is not the same as passing it overseas.

[kev7161]

I teach in the Senior middle school level. Sadly, each and every one of my classes contains such a wide spectrum of English abilities that it is hard to really test them on their knowledge. For the students with high English skills, my tests are far too easy. For the ones with exceptionally poor skills, they generally fail my tests. The middle-of-the-road students generally make Cs and Bs. I only see each class twice a week for 45 minutes at a time. If I was with them every day (and some classes I would relish that opportunity, a couple of my classes that 2 x 45 minutes is more than enough, thank you), then I'm sure some of those middling students would improve. My tests are written and listening comprehension tests. Sadly, I have too many students to give oral exams. They (those that want to) get time in class to practice speaking and pronunciation.

Anyway, one or two classes before exam day, I give them a review worksheet. It reviews our vocab words for this unit as well as the grammar points. The vocab generally consists of scrambled words or fill-in-the-missing-letters variety. Also, fill in the blank using their vocab words. In addition, a variation of the test that is posted in the back of my teacher's book. In other words, a comprehensive review of the unit we've just finished with some sections being almost EXACTLY like their upcoming exam. The kids get 5 extra credit points if they finish this review sheet. Some kids just don't do it, or only do it partially. They get zero points. Others get it done right away. I always go over the review sheet just before the test, collect the review, then distribute the test. Very efficient, very thorough. I still have far too many students that fail the test or get a very low grade, such as a C- or D.

As an adult, I naturally realize that the more you study, the better off you'll be but I find it hard to convince some of my students this. I don't know what else to do for the students that find my classes too difficult or just don't want to bother trying. The remediations I have are also blown off (such as word search or crossword puzzles). I'm not truly convinced my class means anything anyway. I'm skeptical on whether the grade I issue is relevant.