Job Discussion Forums

Nauczyciel · Posted: Wed Dec 01, 2004 12:18 pm Post subject: How NOT to write your CV

I don�t claim I know how to write a perfect CV. I just have come across a few applications for the job at a language school today and some of them are really beyond hope.

Most of the applicants just don�t know how to sell themselves. A case in point is a guy with a BA in American studies, teaching now at a university in China. Do you think he expands on his academic qualifications and current professional experience? Forget it. A few words about his education and a handful of vague remarks about his job at the uni seem enough to him. Instead, he boasts about his jobs in the backwaters of his homeland: (verbatim)

Mouse · Joined: 24 Dec 2003 Posts: 208

Not wishing to dig too deeply into the mire of professional conduct, but do you think it extends to cutting and pasting parts of a person's CV onto a public forum? If that'd been my application, regardless of what you thought about what I'd written, I'd give you more than a piece of my mind (possibly rather a large slice of my shoe, as well). Did your disapproval of his CV writing style extend to sending this applicant a courteous mail explaining that you weren't interested, but with some suggestions on how to improve his future submissions -- that might be a better way of improving standards.

Ben Round de Bloc · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 1946

Nauczyciel,

Although I see your point about the importance of a good CV, I'll go along with Mouse on this one regarding using parts of the guy's CV as an example to make a point on a rather well read forum. Obviously, he doesn't have much for experience teaching EFL, so he chose to expand on the ideas that he's had a variety of work experiences and that he's responsible and trustworthy.

marblez · Joined: 24 Oct 2004 Posts: 248 Location: Canada

"I raped xmas presents"

- An ACTUAL quote from a resume I received once. Bad spelling is one thing... but this?

dmb · Joined: 12 Feb 2003 Posts: 8397

I'm sticking up for newbies here. Think back to your first ever CV. What job experience did you have? When I left University what job experience did I have? Mostly bar work, factory work and the post office during Xmas holidays. Did I put my job experience at that time on my CV? I think I probably did. The reasoning? I may be in full time study but I also work during the holidays and work part-time- I have a work ethic. We all have to start somewhere.

Nauczyciel · Posted: Wed Dec 01, 2004 8:43 pm Post subject:

You�re just wrong, guys. There is not a single word in my post about this guy�s name, nationality, location etc. I cut all the info that could reveal his personal data. Mouse, why did you take it so personally? Your emotional reaction makes me think what your CV looks like. Yes, you�re right, I�m going to contact the guy to actually help him use his qualifications to find a teaching job in the future. Ben Round de Bloc, I actually believe this guy has some proper experience, but he just doesn�t know how to use it. He holds a BA in American studies and has been working at a university � if he only focused on this part of his career instead of boasting about his kitchen-supermarket-cinema experience, he could do far better. dmb, this guy hasn�t just left his uni, he graduated from it some time ago and has been teaching EFL, so he simply does not need to resort to part-time cleaning jobs to prove he knows what work is all about!

Think before you reply to any post. We will save some space on this forum.

Mouse · Joined: 24 Dec 2003 Posts: 208

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

I've commented on this subject countless times. Feel free to do a search with my name and the word resume to see.

I've seen dozens of resumes from several countries and from people with a variety of backgrounds, from totally newbie and inexperienced, to PhD in linguistics, to doctors and lawyers, all wanting to get into teaching EFL. Every one has needed some serious rework on his/her resume, even the experienced teachers.

So many of them make the initial mistake of writing for a western audience. Know your audience, people, even if it means coming to sites like this and asking blatantly obvious questions. There really aren't any free sites that deal with resumes for every country, and unless you are willing to pay hard cash for someone to format and put the right spin on your CV or resume (US$100-300 seems to be the going rate), this is as good a place as any to test the waters.

Misspellings are usually but not always found with today's spell checker programs (as evidenced by "raping Christmas packages"). So, for goodness' sake, have someone look at your resume before you send it. Someone you trust to have a good sense of English if nothing else.

Put the time into the format, too. I've just looked at a handful of resumes that appear to have been typed on a 50-year-old typewriter (no, these were not hard copies; they were email attachments.). Not only should you play around with style and font and indentation, but you might also want to consider making TWO types of resumes: one to send by email or regular post (that will be read as is), and one that will be sent electronically and read by scanner (thus eliminating the need for any fancy fonts, underlines, boxes, etc.). And, just for the sake of neatness and orderliness, LOOK at your resume when it's finished. Did you indent each major section in the same way, for example? Did one line wrap around the margin when it shouldn't have?

Look at those search results (perhaps we should make links to them a sticky) for more details that I and others have offered.

TEAM_PAPUA · Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 1679 Location: HOLE

Ben Round de Bloc · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 1946

justcolleen · Joined: 07 Jan 2004 Posts: 654 Location: Egypt, baby!

Another thing to consider is the applicant (?) does not know exactly what you'll do with the resume (CV) once you have it. By that I mean it's entirely possible you will scrutinize and verify every detail. Many, many employers do this - up to and including a drug screen, credit check, and backgroud investigation. It's impossible to know. Perhaps this person was simply being honest.

Colleen

spidey · Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:01 am Post subject:

There have been many good points made concerning both the orignal OP and the person to which it refers.

I'm having a little trouble figuring out the reason why Nauczyciel made this post in the first place. Is it to show that you should tailor your CVs to fit the appropriate job? Is it to show that he or she is just plain fed up with these so called "crappy" CVs?
As a person who has been involved in hiring, I myself would put more value in the individual behind the words rather than just the words themselves. This being said, the person whos CV was presented, seems to me to be a person of integrity and honor. Yes maybe a little inexperienced, but that is something that he or she will gain. We can offer someone experience, but can we give integrity or honor?

Nauczyciel...if I was to take your post at face value, I would be forced to consider that you are a person who is quite shallow and of limited openmindedness. Is this true or am I prejudging you based on what you have written?

S

cujobytes · Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:25 am Post subject: >

The first thing one should do is throw 1/2 of all aplications in the bin, sight unseen. It's not a good idea to hire unlucky people.

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

Look at it from Nauczyciel's standpoint as a person involved in the hiring process. That resume fell far short of explaining his/her ONLY teaching related credential. Honesty and integrity are admirable qualities, but when someone says (and I will trust Nauczyciel for saying this) a "few words about his education and a handful of vague remarks about his job at the uni", you have what I think Nauczyciel is actually driving at.

If you have something of note or interest in your background, play it up, don't bury it (and yourself). (Maybe Ben Round de Bloc is correct in his skepticism of that guy in China, but if we are fair and open-minded enough about it to give the guy a benefit of the doubt, where is the ATTEMPT to play up what he has?

"set my own Teaching schedule" is pretty lame.

"Throughout my higher education career I have learned much about literature, the media, history and politics." A CAREER, eh? OK, more benefit of the doubt. Please ELABORATE on this career and state specifically WHAT you have learned about those things.

"The writing and preparing of essays and projects gave me the required skill to collect my thoughts... " Wait. YOUR thoughts? This means he is talking about his life as a student, not a teacher. Off base at best.

Spidey wrote:

Nauczyciel · Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2004 8:52 am Post subject:

First of all, I believe the right people will know what I meant and stop filling their CV�s with detailed descriptions of part-time jobs that most of us had at some point in our life.

Second of all, this is about respect for your employer. If you apply for a teaching job and you have some experience in this field, why 75% of you CV should comprise of jobs that have absolutely nothing to do with teaching? Instead of elaborating in numerous paragraphs on the details of your positions as a porter, cleaner, or attendant, it should be enough to say, �from 199� to 20� I did many jobs involving customer service and maintenance and enjoyed trust of my managers�, period. Don�t tell me guys, that you make it easier for your would-be employer to hire you if s/he has to struggle through you CV to actually find something about your relevant experience!

Third of all, what I think is that the guy simply took his old CV that he had used when applying for the university post in China, added 1 short paragraph about his latest experience and sent it again, not realizing that in fact something had changed. Don�t do this, guys. I know what reaction those botched CV�s provoke.

Lastly, I have a good deal of compassion for this guy. I remember very well my CV when I applied for my first job. The only thing is, something has changed and my CV looks different now. In fact, I would like this guy to be employed at the school where I teach � we could share our experiences in China � but, having seen his unnecessarily pitiful CV, I doubt my boss will seriously consider hiring him.