Job Discussion Forums

limits601

Hello

I need some advice. My school hasnt been trustworthy and im going to be leaving when i find a new teaching job. I have NOT signed any contract here with them. I even saw my contract and my signature space is still blank. I have all the paperwork on me. Now me leaving the school is totally legal cause i have no obligation to them with a contract. But should i leave china or the the city or the province to get a new teaching job. Anyone with experience with leaving the school would be very helpful. Im totally desperate here and low on money and need to leave. Please respond. I do have a return ticket home on me but i dont really want to leave china.

badtyndale · Joined: 23 Jun 2004 Posts: 181 Location: In the tool shed

The contract isn't really important. When you say that you have all the paperwork, do you mean visa/resident book? If you have a Z visa and are registered as resident with the local PSB you will still need a release letter from your school in order to transfer employment etc. (at least, that's what I understand but I don't have direct experience of this situation). If you have any different paperwork, the situation will differ. Please provide more details.

limits601 · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2004 4:20 am Post subject:

I have my passport with a work visa inside it which is now expired, i have the foreign experts certificate book ( its red), a temporary residence certificate. Its just a single piece of paper. And i have the medical book. How can the school get these documents if i have no signed the government contract or the school contract and doesnt it permit me to leave ? Im really confused cause most foreigners tell me i can leave whenever i want. I hope this information helps

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

You have been misinformed so far, buddy!

Since your employer has obtained for you your residence permit, FE cert and work visa you are THEIR staff, and you should do their bidding, no less than that.
You have no legal right to walk out retaining all these documents. They have been paid for, and they were available only to a bidder who had to meet legal requirements to sponsor a foreign national.
Quitting your job? You need a good excuse, man!

I don't believe you have never signed any document with them; to get you a work visa they must have provided a SIGNED contract for the PSB to approve!

The least you can do is to reimburse their outlays and be a little cooperative in their difficult times ahead.

Your documents are nil and void if you intend using them elsewhere!

badtyndale · Joined: 23 Jun 2004 Posts: 181 Location: In the tool shed

You can leave whenever you want but, as Roger implies, you technically 'belong' to the school and they may (probably will) want some recompense if you go. The FE book isn't important and neither is the visa in your passport. The resident permit takes priority. If you decide to leave the country you will need to hand it over at passport control. If you decide to move somewhere else you will need to get it amended and therein lies the difficulty if you want to stay in the country. In order to do the latter you have to get permission from your present employer (signed and sealed). As for not signing a contract, who knows? Maybe they did it for you. Are you allowed pens?

Good luck.

limits601 · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2004 7:29 am Post subject:

Well roger, i dont wish to be called a liar. I have NEVER signed ANYTHING with the SCHOOL so i have no idea how they got these papers. What i say is the truth. I HAVE SIGNED NOTHING ! So tell me what the hell is going on !

I saw the contract 2 days ago. It has my *beep* headmaster signature and some kinda red stamp and where i was suppose to sign is BLANK. And the witness spot is BLANK. I will ask to see it again and ill take a picture of it and send it to you if you like.

Also, one of the clauses in the contract is that the contract only comes into effect when both parties have signed and I HAVE NOT SIGNED IT. So therefore the contract is VOID and i can just leave. Right ?

Im so confused now.

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

Look, limits601, I don't know the truth, and if truth be told I happen to know that lies come in all colours - from black to white. I am not saying I can't trust you; your story sounds too fishy for me.
It may be true that there is a "contract" in the principal's office that is waiting for you to sign it. How could you get your documents without having signed it yet? Let's assume you have come here at your expense, and your current visa has not been issued by the local PSB or the Chinese embassy in the country where you come from; in that case you can abscond with no legal hurdles in front of you.
But if your "employer" has sponsored you, the visa was stamped in your passport by the local PSB, then you cannot walk out of it unless you satisfy your employer's expectations. You will have to pay a penalty, help him recruit a replacement and work until that replacement arrives - probably for free.
I hope my answer contains enough helpful information this time; if you have to cancel your current visa you will need your boss' release letter stamped by the psb.

Good luck!

limits601 · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:38 pm Post subject:

Thats exactly what im trying to say. I dont know all these papers were obtained without a signed contract. I have no idea but i tell you, i have NOT signed a single thing. Not one document with the school.

dajiang · Joined: 13 May 2004 Posts: 663 Location: Guilin!

Did the school pay for your airfare though?
Did they arrange the residence/visa for you?
If so, then you might owe them.

If not, I don't see a problem.
Which city is this btw?

regards,
dajiang

lagerlout2006 · Joined: 17 Sep 2003 Posts: 985

I'm not sure the contract is necessary to get the other docs. At my first China job my school (a decent and legal College in Zhejiang) gave me my red and green books BEFORE we ever sat down and signed a contract. Did I sign anything? Yes-many things. I signed when I did the medical and I'm sure I signed other things-can't remember. I also gave them my degree and passport while they did the paperwork.

I always did wonder about the contract part. But they employ many FE's and know what they are doing. Sorry Limits this may not help much in your situation. As Roger says it depends on if these docs really are legal. (Only in China.) You did post before about not having a green book so I wonder. A Chinese friend would be a big help to you now.

I have never been in that situation. I've behaved myself here (not like me.) A co-worker walked from my last school and ran into trouble when he tried to work in Shanghai. The PSB said Wait A Minute---you are living in Jinan. They gave him 2 choices-go to Jinan and get a release letter or go home.

Another option might be go to Macao and get a new visa and start over.

badtyndale · Joined: 23 Jun 2004 Posts: 181 Location: In the tool shed

limits601 · Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:43 pm Post subject:

How did the PSB know he was working in Jinan ? If i just have my passport. Does the PSB have good information systems or was it the work visa in the Visa that said he was living in Jinan ? Say i 'lose' my passport and get a new one from the embassy. Then i have a clean passport, i get a new work visa from my new company and everything is peachy ? Can this work ?

lagerlout2006 · Joined: 17 Sep 2003 Posts: 985

Good question-I know his Z visa was still active so maybe that did it. He was attempting to register for an apartment at the time. Another thing is the school were pissed and may have red-flagged him somehow. Then again he might have just told the truth---he thought it was OK to do...

Don't think the passport thing would work-it will have the old number on it anywaay...

limits601 · Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2004 5:53 am Post subject:

So there is pretty much nothing i can do. Ive been taken advantage of in China and there is nothing i can do about it

Can i take this matter to court and try and get my 270 Yuan back. I mean, from the Government of China as a foreigner expert, am i not allowed so many sick days ? I have been told i am. Can i take this to court ?

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

limits,
I have to say it more clearly this time: you are dodging the thrust of this thread by asking too many questions while leaving too many things covered.

I wish to know: how long have you been working for your current employer?
Airfare?

And, what's that claim about RMB 270? What for?

As for "courts": you can forget that even if you should be exonerated of any accusation by your employer (not likely)./