| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Phil_b
Joined: 14 Oct 2003
Posts: 239
Location: Back in London
|
 Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 10:14 am Post subject: News? |
 |
|
There's an article on the BBC news site about English will soon be a 'truly global language
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4080401.stm
Not sure if it's news to many people, but you might find it interesting. Apparently German will also become more important, will that lead to a rising TGFL market? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ls650
Joined: 10 May 2003
Posts: 3484
Location: British Columbia
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 1:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Too bad you didn't give this thread a more eyecatching title; I found it interesting but I think that most people will miss it.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shmooj
Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 1758
Location: Seoul, ROK
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 1:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Do you think we will live to see English replaced by some other language as the global lingua franca of cross-cultural communication? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dmb
Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Phil_b
Joined: 14 Oct 2003
Posts: 239
Location: Back in London
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 5:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ls650 wrote: |
| Too bad you didn't give this thread a more eyecatching title; I found it interesting but I think that most people will miss it. |
Yeah, that might be a good point.... I found it interesting, but I don't think it said that much that wasn't obvious. The numbers are pretty staggering. Something that I hadn't seen mentioned much before is how EFL teaching will become more and more concentrated on Primary age school kids... Would that lead to more "maintainence" courses for people trying to keep up the level they had when they were 7? Will it lead to much wider emphasis on literature in order to widen people's knowledge of English? Will subjects like Business Studies, Economics and IT be taught through English-medium classes? Some of this is happening already in some places but how far do you think it could go.....? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Phil_b
Joined: 14 Oct 2003
Posts: 239
Location: Back in London
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 5:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| shmooj wrote: |
| Do you think we will live to see English replaced by some other language as the global lingua franca of cross-cultural communication? |
I guess anything's possible... maybe some forward thinking Romans asked similar questions about Latin....
Personally I think that English has gone too "deep" to be replaced easily. Sure, Latin and French were international languages, but in the days before there was an international popular culture. Then the elites could get by in French or Latin but the 'common people' spoke only their own languages. That situation is still the case in some places, but I think English has penentrated further into global society then any language before it...
I think it is unlikely that any European language could ever challenge English, seeing as English has become the lingua franca of many of Europe's international dealings. However I do find it interesting that the report sees German as becoming more important...
Of course, we all know that the most widely spoken language in the world is Chinese. As China grows in influence I expect the Chinese language will also become more influential, especially within the Asian sphere. However, which is more likely: China learning English to deal with the rest of the world or the rest of the world learning Chinese to deal with the Chinese?
More likely is probably an increasing influence of China on international culture through the medium of English; or 'Chinglish'. To a certain extent this can be seen with Spanish, as the number of Spanish speakers in the US grows so does its influence on US popular culture (loan words etc.) this then has a knock on effect through US influence on global popular culture. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shenyanggerry
Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 619
Location: Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 6:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Phil_b wrote:
| Quote: |
shmooj wrote:
Do you think we will live to see English replaced by some other language as the global lingua franca of cross-cultural communication?
I guess anything's possible... maybe some forward thinking Romans asked similar questions about Latin.... |
Since Latin was the language of science and educated discourse for over 1500 years, I don't think we will have to worry about English being replaced anytime soon. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
moonraven
Joined: 24 Mar 2004
Posts: 3094
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 8:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
False analogy. Logic is not the strong suit of folks on this site, but this has surpassed previous illogical antics.
shenyanggerry wrote: "Since Latin was the language of science and educated discourse for over 1500 years, I don't think we will have to worry about English being replaced anytime soon."
Rome and the US are frequently compared--and not in terms of their positive qualities, but they are not the same thing. Latin's having been "the language of science and educated discourse" implies absolutely NOTHING about how long English will be in common use. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mouse
Joined: 24 Dec 2003
Posts: 208
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 9:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| moonraven wrote: |
| False analogy. Logic is not the strong suit of folks on this site, but this has surpassed previous illogical antics. |
Moonraven, why do you have to begin so many of your comments with a general comment on the lack of education, intelligence, etc, of the majority? You're obviously well-informed and eloquent, and it's a pity that you're diluting the effect of your contributions. This may be hypocritical of me, of course, and I'm hardly an especially communicative or well-received member of this community, but it just seems a pity.
| shmooj wrote: |
| Do you think we will live to see English replaced by some other language as the global lingua franca of cross-cultural communication? |
Personally, I doubt it, although I suspect that we may live to see (or are already seeing) English evolving into something more suited to the role of lingua franca.
I had a very interesting discussion with a class on this topic (global languages) only last week and many of them said that they would like French to be the lingua franca (  ). If you had to choose another language to replace English, what would you go for?
I choose Welsh. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Josh Lyman
Joined: 12 Oct 2004
Posts: 98
|
| Posted: Thu Dec 09, 2004 10:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Klingon. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Stephen Jones
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 10, 2004 12:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
The figures are staggering and totally meaningless. Even if every primary school kid in the world had English classes the proporition of them that will go on to master even basic English will be incredibly small. What proportion of the UK population can get by in French despite nearly all of it having studied French at school?
The truth is that English usage only becomes widespread in countries where there is a need for a bridge language between two different languages. This explains why the person who answers the phone in Malayasia will speak excellent English, whilst in Hong Kong it is more than likelly they will only speak Chinese, despite the fact that Hong Kong is on the surface more affected by British culture than Malayasia. It also explains why English is more widely spoken in the South of India than in the |Hindi belt. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
AsiaTraveller
Joined: 24 May 2004
Posts: 908
Location: Singapore, Mumbai, Penang, Denpasar, Berkeley
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Good observations, Stephen! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Joachim
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 311
Location: Brighton, UK
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 10, 2004 4:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
Obviously English has managed to permeate a great many mindsets and cultures to become the langauge to learn, almost everywhere.
While I acknowledge that more people speak Mandarin, they are practially all in China!, and Chinese has a unique script and is tonal, a major challenge for speakers of other language (one slight pronunciation error and you are saying something sompletley different or nonsensical).
And the ESL industry is so much better evolved than similar industries for other languages, there is constant media in English (music, film etc) in other countries which permits people to learn key words and phrases subconciously.
And while I think that Mandarin will become more and more important for Asian speakers of other languages, to suggest that it will encroach into English is a little far-fetched in my opinion. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shmooj
Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 1758
Location: Seoul, ROK
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 10, 2004 12:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Stephen Jones wrote: |
| , whilst in Hong Kong it is more than likelly they will only speak Chinese, despite the fact that Hong Kong is on the surface more affected by British culture than Malayasia. . |
Not sure I follow you here. Mandarin and Cantonese are both widespread in Hong Kong and English is used as a bridge language there too. This is especially true in business where, to be honest, you could be dealing with anyone in the world when you pick up the phone.
I also think that this thinking has a weakness in that Hong Kong is a relatively isolated and small location to compare with a country like Malaysia. Perhaps it would be more in your favour to compare KL with Hong Kong but I would think it may in fact weaken your argument. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Stephen Jones
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 10, 2004 3:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I once worked for a finance company and our job was to cold call throughout the world. Two calls in three to Hong Kong businesses and professionals had to be aborted because the person answering the phone didn't understand enough English, but the figure was only about one in twenty for KL.
A Spanish colleague of mine slammed down the phone and exclaimed in disgust "Ex-British colony my foot! They speak better English in Barcelona". |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
