Job Discussion Forums

[Miguelito]

Has anyone tried to become fluent in spoken Mandarin while teaching English in China? Is it realistic to accomplish this in a year? A number of schools (eg, AES) seem to offer "free Chinese lessons provided by a qualified Chinese teacher". Does anyone know exactly how these lessons are in terms of quantity (how many hrs per week) and quality? If I am at a relatively high intermediate level, will these be to slow for me? Are there any other ways to study Chinese (eg., language exchange, Chinese schools) that have worked for people while teaching? It sounds possible in theory, but just wondering what peoples' actual experience has been.

[dwisner]

It really depends on yourself. We have two employees at AES, Stuart Frye and Pat Miller, that have picked up Chinese relatively quickly. Stuart Frye ([email protected]) has been here a little less than two years and can speak fluently. Pat Miller ([email protected]) has been here one year and is almost fluent. Please feel free to e-mail them with questions about our (AES) Chinese classes (and if they were helpful).

David

[kimo]

[taiwan boy]

I agree with Kimo. If you are high intermediate level just get out and talk to people. Try to speak to people of different backgrounds and in different situations and you will find yourself picking up lots of new vocab. If you can find a special partner and have some "intimate" lessons this will help too

[MonkeyKing]

I agree with the others...getting out there and socialising with Chinese people is the key..it's not that easy 'cos a lot of people will INSIST on speaking English to you, so you really have to persevere if you want to practice,or find some friends who cannot speak any English...oh yeah, the local bf/gf thing helps a lot too, at least with lerning some choice insults, haha. Pinyin is a godsend, but get stuck into learning the characters early too, becuase there will come a point when you will need them to improve and study by yourself...

[klasies]

Hi there

I have been here for two years and can hardly speak any Chinese! I have at many "teachers" but there insist on the correct tones and have no patience!!!! They soon lose interest and then try to steer your lessons into English! There are no free lunches here by me. Most of the so-called 'teachers' really only want to be exposed to your English and they have no structure to their Chinese lessons. Perhaps because I am in the sticks. My daughter whose has been studying at a Chinese middle school is fleunt in the langauge. She can read speak, read and write very well. Perhaps because she has had real Chinese teachers or perhaps it is because she is young and the young learn the langauge quicker than us oldies. The locals say that if they close their eyes when she speaks they do not know that she is western when she speaks Chinese. Go figure?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Andre

[Roger]

The way Chinese teachers teach you CHinese is not very effective - see the posts above. FIrst thing, it is a two-track approach - thinking in your mother tongue while translating into Chinese, the same as CHinese English teachers who teach Chinese to say things in English while translating word by word from CHinese.
Most people that have a good command of Mandarin had a good grounding in it from their study at a Western university.
Another downside seems to be the somewhat patronising attitude of Chinese to non-CHinese who are trying to speak their language. You hardly get any sincere encouragement - either it is flattery pure and simple, or they make fun of you!

[klasies]

Yep Roger

Mostly, they just laugh at my Chinese!

Andre

[Steiner]

Hear, hear! I've posted about this somewhere else, but our original Mandarin teacher here refuses to speak to us in Chinese. She's an English teacher at our school and when we ask questions in Chinese, trying to start simple conversations, she always replies in English. She also laughs at our mispronunciations. If we did the same to our students we'd pass out after the first two minutes of every class.

We just started with another teacher who doesn't speak English. She's teaching us out of her daughter's first grade Chinese book. She doesn't laugh at our mispronunciations, she laughs at the stupid jokes I make up when she's having us create sentences with new vocabulary. We're learning characters and kiddie rhymes and after a few weeks we've learned five times what we have in four months with the other teacher.

My advice--make sure your teacher doesn't know English and doesn't care to.

[william wallace]

nothing to say.

[wOZfromOZ]

Some good points made here.

but
Be very wary about people who say they are fluent in any foreign
language. There are levels of competancy. Many people here compliment me on my Chinese but I know it's not so good. I've studied the language at post grad level and had a go at teaching it back in Aus at highschool level with very mixed results. I first got serious about learning Chinese over a decade ago but I've let my writing ability really slip. There are some excellent writing programs out that can help you but hand written characters are very important especially in understanding Chinese culture. My Chinese language teacher from 11 years ago is now my wife! Beware - they'll get you if you're not careful. LOL

Mate
It is all in your own attitude - but I dont need to harp about that though do I -we're all in that mindset here aren't we!!!

There are a number of things you can do to enhance your 'Chinese language skills' and 'language acquisition'.

First,
get a good teacher who is focused on your language development not their own English.

Second
Get a good text with tapes and set yourself goals.


Third,
As other posters have said get out and socialise with the 'natives' - going shopping, travelling, catching buses, etc etc. Here in Shanghai back in '92 I learned a hell of a lot by taking photo albums of my family with common use sentences written on strips of paper beneath each photo in Chinese characters and pinyin or my own phonetic form of the pinyin.
(comprehensible input hey guru)
You can do this - there's an unlimited supply of supportive and interested people out there dying to gobble up your culture and life experience. In the countryside even more so (if you can cope with the body odours!)

Forth
Get a progress character book and start copying down every new character you come across. You can do this alphabetically according to the english meaning if you like but only do this if it's convenient, meaningful and fun.

Fifth
Keep your eyes and ears open - check out maps, street signs, building names, menus, TV guides, - make the Chinese you take in relevant to your own life experience.


Good luck
It's so relevant to be able to understand the difficulties your own students experience in the acquisition of their own L2.


Happy Days!
wOZfromOZ

[ESL Guru]

Some really great posts here, post to be really proud of.

Could you humor an old man?

wOZ said "Good luck
It's so relevant to be able to understand the difficulties your own students experience in the acquisition of their own L2."

Would you please reread the posts and role play for your teacher please? Pretend that you are your Chinese student trying to learn English as a second language. See how important that learning environment is?

Now please remove yourself from that innocent child role and go back to work with just a speck more sensativity to your Chinese student's needs.

And, please remember that I wear glasses. No hitting an old man wearing glasses!

[Chairman Roberto]

Great posts...I too am struggling to learn this language from a well-meaning, but generally incompetent teacher that was foisted upon me. Still, we make the best of a bad situation two times a week. Any Chinese is good Chinese, I guess.

What ends up happening is that I have to write my own lesson plans for each session! I also get laughed at for mispronuciations, though that has diminished somewhat over time as the sheer hilarity of my mispronunciations got old. But that doesn't stop random teachers and students from coming into the office to gawk and laugh at our sessions.

Another peeve that DRIVES ME BATTY: Generally speaking, why can't the Chinese WRITE CHINESE?? I'm talking about their handwriting...it's atrocious!! Invariably, I have to make people (including my teacher) rewrite their "grass calligraphy" renditions...would you please make your characters LEGIBLE, if it's not too much to ask! I'm not a pharmacist! Of course, they have the gall to tell me how bad my English handwriting is. Perhaps my writing leaves something to be desired, but least you people can make out the letters! (I write pretty clear, block letters).

bit of venting before hitting the Hanzi saltmines,

Roberto!