Job Discussion Forums

[Sweetsee]

While teaching beginning level English conversation to large groups, say 30 plus high school students, how important is it to verify the students' ability to use the target language?
Is it enough to present the material, encourage participation and assist those requesting assistance?
Also, how about students who elect not to participate?

[distiller]

I'd say it is important as how will you know what to teach if you don't know their level? Just because they are of a certain age and in a certain class, unless they have been placed there by those familiar with them, doesn't mean anything. They may be at a higher or lower level than assumed by the administration. You also need it to work out how you are going to work in some differentiation as there may be vast differences in levels among the students in the class. All of this will demonstrate itself in time but a quick, even informal, assessment of their level would be advisable.

[Glenski]

The question may be moot in high schools. You are asked to teach a specific subject (reading, writing, speaking, listening), often with specific materials, and there may be nothing you can do to change that.

Verifying levels of classes of 30 or more is practically impossible without a one-on-one interview of each kid anyway. Best you can do is find out what they may be keen on and weak on, then customize your lessons accordingly.

Case in point. I teach second year HS kids that have not gone through my school's junior high program. There is another teacher who teaches the same grade kids, but who HAVE gone through the program. Their levels are quite different, so they are taught with different books. Oddly enough, our first year HS kids who have gone through the JHS program are higher level than the ones I teach in 2nd year! Still, they use the SAME textbook. Teachers have to gear the same lessons toward lower level kids in my classes!

Another case in point. I teach a select class of higher level kids, too (first year). Some are returnees. I did the same thing last year, but this year's kids are a bit lower level, yet I'm supposed to teach them the same thing as last year's kids. You can imagine what challenges this poses. And, next year, I'm told the kids destined to join this course are even lower still. Geez.

Of course, if you have no set materials to follow, you will have to go on instinct coupled with any recommendations from teachers who know the students from previous years in order to make your lesson plans.

[Sweetsee]

I didn't mean the individual students' levels, which by the way is rock bottom, I meant their ability to master the day's lesson?
Case in point, you have a class of 30, 26 are busy and so are you. What do you do about the difference?

[kev7161]

Sadly, I have my kids for only 45 minutes 2X a week. In most of my classes, their levels are all over the board. My "official" class title is "Spoken English", but some simply won't (or can't) speak. We do a variety of activities including reading aloud, workbooks, listening and repeating (for pronunciation skills), watching DVDs, listening to music, simple grammar, etc. It seems that 80 to 90% are skilled in one area or another or enjoy one activity more than others (I actually see kids reading while I show a DVD - - if we have a worksheet that goes with the movie, then I don't let them do that - - - if it is just for "fun", then I don't much care).

If I had the kids on a daily basis, then I could gear my lessons more towards individual strengths and weaknesses. I don't think my school really cares one way or another, thus many of the students don't care, thus I (sometimes) don't care. Isn't that horrible?

[shmooj]

[moonraven]

I need to know what you mean by Beginning Level Conversation--sounds like a contradiction in terms.

If they are beginners the conversations are going to have to be very basic--and you are going to have to give them the tools to converse with.

If the class is really a mix of levels, I have them work in groups to present opions and information on agreed upon topics--so that the students who really have no English infrastructure can participate in presenting a little bit in English in front of the class. It isn't Conversation, but students like it and the school that cooked up the idea of Conversation for non-English speakers didn't know what it was doing anyway.

[Glenski]

Sweetsee,

You present the best lesson possible, monitor as many as you can, learn who are the lowest and give them as much additional help as possible, and do any evaluation that you like. Homework lets you see what each student is doing, and gives you a chance to provide feedback, although this is time-consuming. Quizzes and tests do the same, and feedback is more general to the whole class instead of to the individual. Your school should be giving regular exams anyway, so they will examine the overall scores and decide what to do.

You can't please everyone.

[moonraven]

No you can't please everyone.

However, what Glenski describes has even less to do with a Conversation class than what I wrote. Exams? Homework?

[carnac]

Listen to Glenski.

[shmooj]

[Twisting in the Wind]

[quote="shmooj]as well as you've got your work cut out anyway, I'd simply forget about those who choose not to participate.[/quote]

I'm not sure about that, Shmooj. It depends on their reasons for refusing to participate. If they are bratty, loud high schoolers, I might invite them to "take it to the student break room" and open the door and wait for them to walk through it. That method has quieted down many a teenager in my past.And that way, you're not being perceived by them as the "heavy" or putting a damper on their fun, you're just telling them to take it elsewhere. I'd learn how to say those words "Take it to the break room" in the ss's L1.

If they are just lost and not participating for that reason, I'd use peer tutoring. I'd get a few ss who are sharp and reseat them next to the lost ones and have them help them in the ss L1 if they need it. Catch them up in the L1 if they need it. You have to do what you have to do.

If that is not possible, I'd take them to the office and have them retested. This depends on the policies of your school of course. In mine, secretaries with no language training experience generally did the testing and so a lot of false placements took place.

I would be very aware of whether or not my school does "spot" evaluations or frequently evaluates staff. I would never deliberatly leave ss out of it in classroom activities. I'd always try to include them, both for the ss's sake and yours. You never know who might be monitoring you.

[guest of Japan]

This thread has gotten confusing. If the class title is "English Conversation" then I'd go with Shmooj and Moonraven. If the class title is "Oral Communication", which I'd bet it is, then I'd follow Glenski's advices with some of Shmooj's thrown in for good measure. Moonraven's activities are great, but are not conducive to a Japanese High School environment. There is no such thing as showing respect for the work of your peers in an average Japanese high school.

And moonraven, I really like this line:

[shmooj]

[moonraven]

Guest of Japan:

The OP gave us the course title: Beginning Level Conversation.

Either we assume the OP is telling the truth about the title of the course, or that the OP is lying.

I chose to assume that the OP was telling the truth.

I based my comments on that premise.

If I am given a class in Beginning Level Chemistry to teach, I will probably start with the Periodic Table of Elements--not with the Hundred Years War.