Job Discussion Forums

Ilja · Joined: 02 Dec 2003 Posts: 23 Location: Taichung

What are my prospects??? No working visa, a BA and a TESOL and a few years experience in Asia..but fluent in both Dutch and English... Anybody have any contacts?? It's a shot in the dark especially in this bureacratic country but hey, doesn't hurt to ask....
Thanks in advance..
ilja

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

Got a citizenship in an EU member country? If so, you've probably got a chance. Bigger cities have private language schools (mostly for immigrants) or you might get lucky and get into the public sector - though with your quals, that would be in a small town, probably.
I'm assuming that since you say you speak some Dutch, you may have citizenship or legal connections - if not....
you've got little to no chance. You're right, the laws are extremely tight. I'm speaking from long-term personal experience; it's not just hearsay!!

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

Sorry - maybe I've confused the citizenship issue. Of course, if you are a citizen of any western EU country, you'll have no legal problems. From outside the EU..........that's a different story.

Ilja · Joined: 02 Dec 2003 Posts: 23 Location: Taichung

unfortunately, i have a Canadian citizenship. I grew up in Holland and speak Dutch fluently, but alas, no dutch id. am i screwed? what about anything else in another field...ie. not teaching...under the table work perhaps....accomodation is no problem i have plenty of space for myself...but it would be darn nice to earn a little money while i'm here......

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

Yikes. I'd say your chances are extremely slim.
For what it's worth, here's my own story (briefly).
I moved to Nederlands for my spouse's job with a big international company.
The local university wanted to hire me, and the DOS was actually willing to go to court in Den Haag to plead for an exception to EU hiring laws in my case. He spent six months preparing a case: no one suitable had responded to their ads for the position for 18 months and numbers of students had formally requested at least one North American speaker on staff for their language development.
The DOS was told in writing not to bother - the court would refuse to hear the case, because exceptions are absolutely not granted.
I was subsequently able to acquire a work permit, when my spouse's company negotiated a special program for non-EU spouses of its employees. So, only the pull of big business got me through.
This was back in 2001, so it's possible that the legal climate has changed in terms of hiring nonEU workers - but I doubt it!

As you noted, there is under-the-table work, but in my three years living in Nederlands, news of 'busts' were fairly frequent.

Sorry to be so negative! Maybe it's not an impossible task, but the obstacles are really high.

Ilja · Joined: 02 Dec 2003 Posts: 23 Location: Taichung

thanks for your input....i knew it was going to be hard, but i didn't think it would be impossible!! i may end up now doing some babysitting or cleaning tables, etc.....teaching doesn't seem to be an option anymore..=(

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

I suppose you can pick up some private students in among your babysitting and table-serving stuff, but to get a job in a real school.....well, you can try, but unfortunately, you probably can't count on that.

How did you manage to grow up in Nederlands without any rights to citizenship? I guess your family are military or worked for an international company? It seems a little sad to have memories and ties to a country where you can't have even a legal work permit.
Well, good luck in any case.

Ilja · Joined: 02 Dec 2003 Posts: 23 Location: Taichung

Yes, my mother is Dutch, my father is Canadian and so am I. Because of the tough Dutch law and my mother never applying for my citizenship when I was younger, I never will receive Dutch (or dual) citizenship. It is sad, because I grew up here for 12 years!

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

Sincere condolences! So near, and yet so far.......that's really just bad luck!

dreaming_saturn · Joined: 25 May 2004 Posts: 37 Location: Netherlands

Hi Ilja,

I'm just completing (2 months to go) my teacher training in the Netherlands to work at secondary schools, and I'm a Canadian living in Den Haag as well -I found after doing the business circuit with a TEFL certificate there's not really a good chance of a steady income without tons of travel. the reason I was able to get working papers was the fact that I have a Dutch husband/sponsor. I'm not suggesting you get your papers this way, but if you live with a Dutch national or an EU national with a steady income getting a working permit isn't a problem.

Besides that, the fact that you speak Dutch fluently should open a few doors for you. I know that there are temp. permits/one year working visas available to Canadians - a person I know at the British school was able to get one before leaving Canada. However, once your year is up, that's it. Check into it.

daily chai · Joined: 16 Nov 2003 Posts: 150 Location: Brussels

More condolences. I have friends here in Taiwan (coincidentally, including a dual Dutch-American national) who grew up here and can't live here once they reach their majority. They miss their school friends and they way of life they came to know.

I'm so sorry your Mum didn't apply for citizenship for you. You should contact immigration lawyers about this periodically. The NL has recently eased immigration rules because too many people are leaving the country. It's worth it to check the political temperature periodically and see if your situation can be fixed.

Saturn, congrats on living your dream with your husband. My husband is Dutch and I'm *still* not entitled to live or work in the country. He has to get at least a one-year work contract first. (There's also a minimum income requirement, but most jobs fulfill that.) The job market is recovering, but for now those are still thin on the ground for new hires.

Edited to congratulate Ms. Saturn!

daily chai · Joined: 16 Nov 2003 Posts: 150 Location: Brussels

More stuff from the Dutch immigration department (IND):

Check out the Residence Wizard from IND:
http://www.ind.nl/EN/verblijfwijzer/

Also, IND has rules for Skilled Migrants:
http://www.dialogistiek.nl/ind/edit/portal.htm This one is in Dutch

In English http://www.ind.nl/en/inbedrijf/actueel/StartKennismigrantenbeleid.asp

I promise you: you need to get an immigration lawyer to help you put your papers in order. In Noordwijkerhout I knew an American woman who had to leave and lodge her paperwork all over again because she didn't have health insurance; one of the requirements. Immigration is a byzantine process, and it's cheaper to hire a lawyer than make a series of restarts.