Job Discussion Forums

[dearbarbie]

i know that its probably normal here. no, in fact I KNOW it is normal, but i have students on their mobile phones in class - you know, the types at the back of the class. most of my student participate well in group discussion and all other activities. i have explained to the students that i would like them to think of being in my class as being in england, and when they step out there door they are back in china? in england it would be perfectly acceptable at a university for a teacher to suggest that, if the students are not going to listen or pay attention or even get off their bloody phone, that they should leave the class or rethink why there are in that class.

but what about in china?

im teaching classes of male pilots who at first were keen to take me for granted as some blonde chick or something, but i seem to have won most of the class over. except these few guys. should i suggest that class participation will be part of their final grade? ask to see them after class? any ideas would be great. the students are about 19-20 years old.

[laodeng]

Not a helpful reply, I'm afraid, but why does the thought of undisciplined, inattentive 19-year-old pilots-to-be chill my marrow? Or, God help me, are they already pilots?

[7969]

male pilots? 19-20 years old? who are these guys?

i've discovered, as have many others that the mindset of the chinese student is a lot different than that of the western student. these guys are probably not as mature or as serious about their studies as you might expect them to be. that's one problem..... and i have no answer either. if they're disruptive, throw them out. the humiliation of being tossed out of class at your hands might be enough to fix the problem.

[Yu]

Be clear about your expectations as a teacher. I was a newbie here last semester and found that I had western expectations for my class. I tried to use western methods. They did not work. Are you sure you really understand your students? I know you did your research before coming here... I did mine too. But I was still troubled my first semester.

Give them a list of what your expectations are. Type it and give each student a printed copy. Something like a syllabus. Tell them exactly what they can and cannot do.

Mine says:
1. Students will arrive to class on time and ready to begin class when the bell sounds. Leaving Early/Arriving Late should be avoided if at all possible. However, if you arrive late please enter as discreetly and quietly as possible, taking the easiest available seat. (In other words, sneak into my class and try not to disturb others) If at all possible please notify me before class begins if you will be leaving early. Again sit in a place that will be conducive to a discreet exit.
2. If you are going to miss class, you must let me know in advance. If the absence is unexpected, you should e-mail me to inform me of your absence. You should get information about what you missed in class from a fellow student; however, if you still have questions, you may ask me.
3. Students should refrain from talking with classmates while another class member or the instructor has the floor.
4. You are expected to participate in all class discussions. In order to do this you will need to thoroughly read all assignments before coming to class. It is imperative that you bring your textbooks to class so that we can refer back to them during our discussions.
5. Student must turn off electronic devices during class. If you are going to be listening to your MP3 Player or sending instant messages by cell phone, you will be asked to leave my class. Doing these things during class is disrespectful to the instructor.
6. All assignments are due at the beginning of the class period on the day they are due. Late assignments will NOT be accepted for credit. If a student is going to be absent the day that an assignment is due, alternative arrangements for turning in the assignment must be made in advance. If you miss class, you may e-mail the assignment to me on that same day.
7. If you have any questions, comments, or concerns, contact me. You may do this through e-mail, MSN Messenger, SMS by cell phone, telephone, coming to my office hours, or making an appointment to see me. Coming to my office hours is my preference. Phone calls can be used for emergencies.
8. Copying from each other or Plagiarism of any kind is not tolerated. Students who copy the work of other will not get credit for copied work. I expect each student to do his/her own work.
9. This paper is your course syllabus. You have a written copy of this paper, and I discussed this orally on the first day of class. The purpose of this paper is to give you a good idea of what to expect during class. If you do not understand something on this paper, you will contact me and ask questions. You should keep this handy as a reference, and bring it with you to class because I will frequently refer back to it.

Tell them how that will be graded, throw them out of class for using mobile phone. Take away their mobile phone if you see them using it. Have all students place their mobile phones in a designated area before class starts.

Explain how things work back in England, how you were educated. What the relationship between the teacher and student is. Ask them for the same information about their education.

Good Luck.

[dearbarbie]

thanks for the ideas. i'll give them another week and see what happens first. i did a lot of research and dont want to offend anyone. but, ive come all the way from England to teach so the least they can do is show me a little respect!! i just dont want to wander into some cultural red tape!

[Yu]

Maybe your definitions of respect differ. You know I thought my students would be really happy to have a foreign teacher, and many of them said they felt lucky to get the foreign teacher's class. I thought they will be really active in class and it would be a really good class. But things never seemed to go as I planned.
It seems students take the foreign teacher's class because they want something to be different or want pure English pronunciation. But at the same time they feel uncomfortable with different.
Also, you might ask a Chinese teacher at your school if you can observe a few of their lessons to see how they manage the classroom. As a FT we are given very little introduction to the teaching. I truly failed to realize just how big the gaps were.
Western teaching methods do not work the same way. Ask students how many hours they are in class each week? Mine have 40 hours of lessons. Find out as much information as you can about them.
Be flexible, I hate students using mobile phones... but I think it also happens in a US classroom. I hate that students sleep in my class... but I used to sleep in class too.
It is disappointing to have come all this way, and not feel a sort of respect in the classroom. How much respect is given to Chinese teachers? How do students show respect?
Be really clear about your expectations. Tell them mobile phone usage during class is disrespectful to you because (and give them your real reason). Don't assume they know what a classroom in England looks like... I am an American, and frankly, I haven't a clue other than I see a bunch of students wearing navy blue uniforms with a red tie and black shoes. I have no idea what the teacher student relationship looks like.
Ask questions to your Chinese collegues as well, they can be a great resource.

[dearbarbie]

hmm these are v good pointers. its a bit of a shame that i dont teach in the english department, and havent been introduced to any chinese teachers. i will email international affairs office and see if they can help me observe a chinese class. thanks again! i appreciate it!

[ymmv]

Students are given directives, rules, regulations, expectations, etc. up the wazoo in Chinese. Expectations in English (written or oral) aren't going to make much of an impact.

Here's how I 'impact' the mobile phone problem - the first time it happens, I walk over and snatch the phone. No, I don't do the obvious threat of "I'm keeping your phone until next week's class" or "I'm giving your phone to the dean and you can pick it up in his office".

I'm simply say, "Here's my rule on phones, if you are using your phone in my class, I get to call my Mom and Dad back home right now on your phone."

Here's a good Chinese expression to learn: "Yi qie xiang qian kan" - "These people think only of money" ... and that student is thinking "OMG, I have to pay for a long distance call overseas!" The student is somewhat aghast and the other students are interested but slightly nervous as to what will happen next.

Of course, I never go through with it. I just pretend I'm punching in the numbers and then I say, "Wei! Ba! Ma! Nimen Hao? Wei, wo zai zhong guo!" As if I'm having a conversation with my 70+ year old parents in Chinese. (N.B. Neither I nor my parents have any Chinese blood.)

The class cracks up, the students are relieved, and everyone switches off their mobile phones.

If it happens in the next class, just repeat the above steps. By week 3, you should have no problems.

[Madmaxola]

[tofuman]

Move the guys in the back to the front and don't let them sit together. Inform them that cell phone use will not be tolerated.
Tell them that if they continue, you will confiscate their phones and they can retrieve them from the principal, dean, or other authority figure. I did this and the Chinese teacher called the student's parents. I rarely, if ever, have a problem now.

You need to establish your authority in the classroom or you are going to have a miserable experience. Disrespect is contagious to those so inclined.

[ChinaMovieMagic]

It certainly can hurt if you feel it's a matter of them not respecting you.
BUT...that's not necessarily the case...
Accustomed to being passive in a teacher-centered class, they may be somewhat disoriented by your Good Vibes...and T-E-S-T-ing you...which is not the same as disrespecting you.

Qs:
* Have you discussed this w/your Chinese colleagues? The sincere/sensitive way you presented it in your POST...that can be persuasive.
* Does the class have a Class Monitor? The Monitor can/should be able to help.
*Peer Pressure can be more effective than what can be perceived as Top-Down Authoritarianism.
*Regarding the List of Rules...I'm wondering if that's translated into Chinese...or at least user-friendlt English.

Also...I wonder if folks are aware of the really-revolutionary movement...needed in basically every county/every class...

PDF] Convention on the Rights of the Child
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
... conscious of the extensive effects of the hidden curriculum, democratic class management and. participation of the students in the school administration ...
www.unhchr.ch/.../898586b1dc7b4043c1256a450044f331/ 30c421a4d48b6e36c1256cc2003be7f2/$FILE/G0245644.pdf - Similar pages

United Nations Human Rights Website - Treaty Bodies Database ...
... democratic class management and participation of the students in the school administration are among the measures employed to achieve the form of school ...
www.unhchr.ch/tbs/doc.nsf/ (Symbol)/CRC.C.8.Add.24.En?OpenDocument - 112k - Cached - Similar pages

In China, unlike the US, introducing UN-supported programs can be a "stamp of approval."

Hang in there, lady. And...even if they DO disrespect you...that's their loss
and you don't need to share their toxic vibes.

[tofuman]

CMM, I agree that at this early stage she is being "tested" but if she fails, that will degenearte into disrespect and ultimately, chaos in the classroom.

[Roger]