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kcat
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 35
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 Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2005 2:37 pm Post subject: For MY information just in case because you never know |
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| Hi. I am considering taking a job in Thailand. I presently work in Korea. here, there are so many bogus schools that break rules that it is not uncommon for teachers to simply leave if an smplyer is not holding up their end of the deal. What happens if this is the case in Thailand (a contract has been signed but I pay for myself to live, ect-no loans involved?) Is there some kind of consequence or can people leave freely is they feel they must? I only ask as Ive been screwed over before...thank tou |
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Placebo
Joined: 19 Nov 2004
Posts: 80
Location: Bangkok
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 12:19 am Post subject: |
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By Thai law, every foreign teacher who does not fulfill his/her contract obligations can and will be made the subject of a deportation order or even worse. The immigration office pursues breach of contracts with a ruthless vengeance. Jail sentences are not uncommon.
Fact is,since your employer will be keeping your original degrees and passport until the end of your contract, there is no chance of leaving early. |
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kcat
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 1:03 am Post subject: |
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| Placebo wrote: |
By Thai law, every foreign teacher who does not fulfill his/her contract obligations can and will be made the subject of a deportation order or even worse. The immigration office pursues breach of contracts with a ruthless vengeance. Jail sentences are not uncommon.
Fact is,since your employer will be keeping your original degrees and passport until the end of your contract, there is no chance of leaving early. |
I'm sorry, this shocked me...I thought it was illegal for anyone to keep your government-issued documents-ANYWHERE, for political reasons? |
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Sheep-Goats
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 527
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 1:14 am Post subject: |
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| Placebo wrote: |
By Thai law, every foreign teacher who does not fulfill his/her contract obligations can and will be made the subject of a deportation order or even worse. The immigration office pursues breach of contracts with a ruthless vengeance. Jail sentences are not uncommon.
Fact is,since your employer will be keeping your original degrees and passport until the end of your contract, there is no chance of leaving early. |
^This is a joke, for those of you without a sense of humor.
Since your visa is tied to your work permit (meaning you have to leave the country within 7 days of quitting or else pay a really beefy fine when you eventually do), what happens to most people who quit early is that they go to Cambodia (6 hours) and get a new visa (10 minutes) and come back (for 30 days) to line up another job (10 minutes) and begin all that paperwork for the work permit, etc, all over again (5 months).
There are no real consequences, beyond the old school screwing you out of pay. They don't keep your original documents (but many keep your work permit and teacher's licence, if you get one, which they shouldn't do in my opinion but which there's really no rule or law about here). |
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kcat
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 1:31 am Post subject: |
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| Sheep-Goats wrote: |
| Placebo wrote: |
By Thai law, every foreign teacher who does not fulfill his/her contract obligations can and will be made the subject of a deportation order or even worse. The immigration office pursues breach of contracts with a ruthless vengeance. Jail sentences are not uncommon.
Fact is,since your employer will be keeping your original degrees and passport until the end of your contract, there is no chance of leaving early. |
^This is a joke, for those of you without a sense of humor.
Since your visa is tied to your work permit (meaning you have to leave the country within 7 days of quitting or else pay a really beefy fine when you eventually do), what happens to most people who quit early is that they go to Cambodia (6 hours) and get a new visa (10 minutes) and come back (for 30 days) to line up another job (10 minutes) and begin all that paperwork for the work permit, etc, all over again (5 months).
There are no real consequences, beyond the old school screwing you out of pay. They don't keep your original documents (but many keep your work permit and teacher's licence, if you get one, which they shouldn't do in my opinion but which there's really no rule or law about here). |
Thanks you for YOUR input, I'm very confused at the moment, I've worked in Asiam countries that have conveniently decided not to pay me when their enrollment went down and the idea of someonone keeping my PASSPORT equates (in my mind) to keep ing me hostage-my consular just confurmed that a passport is the property of my government, and not an employer. He did say he was unclear about consequences regarding contracts. I note that I would NOT be given anything at all save a place for me to work. I guess I have more research to do... |
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Ajarn Miguk
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 227
Location: TDY As Assigned
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 1:54 am Post subject: Nonsense |
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| Placebo wrote: |
By Thai law, every foreign teacher who does not fulfill his/her contract obligations can and will be made the subject of a deportation order or even worse. The immigration office pursues breach of contracts with a ruthless vengeance. Jail sentences are not uncommon.
Fact is,since your employer will be keeping your original degrees and passport until the end of your contract, there is no chance of leaving early. |
Nonsense. While I'm certain some of what is written in the first paragraph above could occur, the truth is you will be hard pressed to be able to find one verified instance of anything like he describes.
As far as the second paragraph goes, NEVER give your original diplomas and passport to your employer for "safe-keeping," etc. One is the property of your government, and the others are your personal property. Some employers will actually attempt to do this, and you should immediately find yourself other employment if they propose this to you.
None of this precludes the possibility of a Thai employer suing you in a civil action should you violate the conditions of a contract. The instances of this actually happening also appear to be quite rare, though. |
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Placebo
Joined: 19 Nov 2004
Posts: 80
Location: Bangkok
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 2:30 am Post subject: |
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Of course my post was utter nonsense...
Geez, you people are too serious! Unless you're doing privates with pashtun tribal leaders or teaching conversational classes in North Korea, nobody will keep your passport until the end of your contract.
Before accepting any job, you should always talk to the other teachers who most likely will tell you about the schools' administration.
Actually there are more "teachers" screwing schools over by ending their contracts after a couple a months to continue travelling....
Sheep-Goats comment about employers keeping the work permit is something everybody should be aware of. There is NO law that requires the employer to keep these documents. You should demand that the permit be handed to you! I know a couple of (non-teaching)foreigners who work in BKK and who all have their work permit at home....
If you really want to leave a school nobody is going to stop you but as Sheep-Goats already said you'll have some visa trouble because of your work permit. Having said this, by the time your application for your permit is pending, you should already know if your school 'is for real' or just another dodgy scam.
I've never heard of any farang winning a court case in Thailand. So forget that. Besides that, you couldn't even afford a lawyer... |
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kcat
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 2:50 am Post subject: |
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| Placebo wrote: |
Of course my post was utter nonsense...
Geez, you people are too serious! Unless you're doing privates with pashtun tribal leaders or teaching conversational classes in North Korea, nobody will keep your passport until the end of your contract.
Before accepting any job, you should always talk to the other teachers who most likely will tell you about the schools' administration.
Actually there are more "teachers" screwing schools over by ending their contracts after a couple a months to continue travelling....
Sheep-Goats comment about employers keeping the work permit is something everybody should be aware of. There is NO law that requires the employer to keep these documents. You should demand that the permit be handed to you! I know a couple of (non-teaching)foreigners who work in BKK and who all have their work permit at home....
If you really want to leave a school nobody is going to stop you but as Sheep-Goats already said you'll have some visa trouble because of your work permit. Having said this, by the time your application for your permit is pending, you should already know if your school 'is for real' or just another dodgy scam.
I've never heard of any farang winning a court case in Thailand. So forget that. Besides that, you couldn't even afford a lawyer... |
I live in a country that is a joke to it's own government and openly admits to its law being "individually interpreted" but people leave and no one stops them. STILL, people can be naive and unsure and there are some countries that are not stable places-I just asked in seriousness because I genuinely didn't know. I might not like how Im being treated. I might get sick. I just like to know I have options. |
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GreenDestiny
Joined: 27 Nov 2004
Posts: 88
Location: International
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 2:52 am Post subject: |
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Can you help a bloke out with 4 questions? Thanks!
1. What is the definitive law re paying taxes in Thailand? Perhaps I'm mistaken, although it seems I read that farang's don't pay the first 2 years. Of course, this is separate from one's (homeland) taxes.
2. Is there a provision which can be added to a contract which allows one to teach (privates) after hours? S. Korea allows one to legally work privately IF a statement is included in the teacher/school contact.
3. I know appearance is important in Thai business-culture. [My past Thai-Chinese was always on a never-ending quest for more chopping. Sorry!]  Anyway, my friend is thinking of coming to Thailand as well, and wonders if his short ponytail will have to go. Nothing major...he's not a backpacker/need a bath hippie. What should he do?
4. Let's suppose a teacher lives in BKK, although teaches approximately 1 hour (by bus) from BKK in the suburbs. Would it okay to date women IN the school's geographic area, or would that causes problems? Example: Instead of going back to BKK after work, I explore the community and its restaurants, pubs...you never know when the most beautiful (subjectively speaking) woman will appear...Advice?
All the best,
GreenDestiny
Last edited by GreenDestiny on Fri Mar 04, 2005 6:18 am; edited 1 time in total |
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kcat
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 3:11 am Post subject: |
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| Placebo wrote: |
Of course my post was utter nonsense...
Geez, you people are too serious! Unless you're doing privates with pashtun tribal leaders or teaching conversational classes in North Korea, nobody will keep your passport until the end of your contract.
Before accepting any job, you should always talk to the other teachers who most likely will tell you about the schools' administration.
Actually there are more "teachers" screwing schools over by ending their contracts after a couple a months to continue travelling....
Sheep-Goats comment about employers keeping the work permit is something everybody should be aware of. There is NO law that requires the employer to keep these documents. You should demand that the permit be handed to you! I know a couple of (non-teaching)foreigners who work in BKK and who all have their work permit at home....
If you really want to leave a school nobody is going to stop you but as Sheep-Goats already said you'll have some visa trouble because of your work permit. Having said this, by the time your application for your permit is pending, you should already know if your school 'is for real' or just another dodgy scam.
I've never heard of any farang winning a court case in Thailand. So forget that. Besides that, you couldn't even afford a lawyer... |
In all honesty, the next time an uniformed person asks for help in a genuine nature I imagine they would appreciate it if you actually HELPED them instead of laughing at them for being naive. I have been detained for trying to leave a country I will not name that is not well governed and I left because laws were being broken and my boss had enough status to feel he owned me. I didnt laugh. I feel your humor is in poor taste. I came here for information, not sarcasm I don't understand because unlike yourself, I genuinely do not know the facts. Thanks. |
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kenkannif
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 550
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 7:43 am Post subject: |
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Actually if you do walk from a school on bad terms they can make it very, very, very difficult for you to get a WP in future, if they want to!
| GreenDestiny wrote: |
1. What is the definitive law re paying taxes in Thailand? Perhaps I'm mistaken, although it seems I read that farang's don't pay the first 2 years. Of course, this is separate from one's (homeland) taxes. |
I've heard the same about the first two years....in reality you'll pay them (if you have a WP, and sometimes even if you don't) as soon as you get your WP!
| Quote: |
| 2. Is there a provision which can be added to a contract which allows one to teach (privates) after hours? S. Korea allows one to legally work privately IF a statement is included in the teacher/school contact. |
No not as far as I know. It's hard enought just to get a WP, let alone get another job or location on it...although it is possible, but privates wouldn't fall under this so to go it legit you'd really need to set up your own school.
| Quote: |
| 3. I know appearance is important in Thai business-culture. [My past Thai-Chinese was always on a never-ending quest for more chopping. Sorry!] Anyway, my friend is thinking of coming to Thailand as well, and wonders if his short ponytail will have to go. Nothing major...he's not a backpacker/need a bath hippie. What should he do? |
He'll be okay IMO and IME! Not a biggie as long as it's a 'smart' pony tail.
| Quote: |
| 4. Let's suppose a teacher lives in BKK, although teaches approximately 1 hour (by bus) from BKK in the suburbs. Would it okay to date women IN the school's geographic area, or would that causes problems? Example: Instead of going back to BKK after work, I explore the community and its restaurants, pubs...you never know when the most beautiful (subjectively speaking) woman will appear...Advice? |
Yes, that would most likely be acceptable (it's not quite that strict here). |
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GreenDestiny
Joined: 27 Nov 2004
Posts: 88
Location: International
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 8:13 am Post subject: |
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| kenkannif wrote: |
1. I've heard the same about the first two years....in reality you'll pay them (if you have a WP, and sometimes even if you don't) as soon as you get your WP!
2. No not as far as I know. It's hard enought just to get a WP, let alone get another job or location on it...although it is possible, but privates wouldn't fall under this so to go it legit you'd really need to set up your own school.
3. He'll be okay IMO and IME! Not a biggie as long as it's a 'smart' pony tail.
4. Yes, that would most likely be acceptable (it's not quite that strict here). |
1. Check! Teacher wages incur a 6% tax, no?
2. I'd like to teach privates, although there aren't any sites (e.g., Japan has many teacher/student classifieds) to advertise...that I know of...suggestions? Telephone lessons?
3. Fairly longhair, although he's a smart guy.
4. After reading some of the S. Korea forums, it lead me reconsidered what is okay.
Thanks Ken! You've been helpful with ajarndotcom forum topics as well.
All the best,
GreenDestiny
Last edited by GreenDestiny on Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:31 am; edited 2 times in total |
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kenkannif
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 550
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 8:49 am Post subject: |
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It depends on how much you earn or how much they say you earn!
Generally IME it's around 3%, either way it's a pittance though compared to what we pay in the West. I get a fair bit back each year 'cos I'm married with child!
To teach privately you have to do so 'illegally' (which is as common as), there's no websites as far as I know advertising private classes you need to find them yourself by networking, advertising etc.
He'll be okay I reckon, I've met a fair few teachers with long hair.
I think they frown upon you (generally) dating students and sometimes fellow teachers (although I know quite a few people that met their g/f or wife through working with them). And don't take woman of unsavoury character to where you work if you get what I mean! |
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GreenDestiny
Joined: 27 Nov 2004
Posts: 88
Location: International
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 8:54 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks! |
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kcat
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 10:42 am Post subject: |
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| kenkannif wrote: |
Actually if you do walk from a school on bad terms they can make it very, very, very difficult for you to get a WP in future, if they want to!
Thank you for your input, appreciated.
| GreenDestiny wrote: |
1. What is the definitive law re paying taxes in Thailand? Perhaps I'm mistaken, although it seems I read that farang's don't pay the first 2 years. Of course, this is separate from one's (homeland) taxes. |
I've heard the same about the first two years....in reality you'll pay them (if you have a WP, and sometimes even if you don't) as soon as you get your WP!
| Quote: |
| 2. Is there a provision which can be added to a contract which allows one to teach (privates) after hours? S. Korea allows one to legally work privately IF a statement is included in the teacher/school contact. |
No not as far as I know. It's hard enought just to get a WP, let alone get another job or location on it...although it is possible, but privates wouldn't fall under this so to go it legit you'd really need to set up your own school.
| Quote: |
| 3. I know appearance is important in Thai business-culture. [My past Thai-Chinese was always on a never-ending quest for more chopping. Sorry!] Anyway, my friend is thinking of coming to Thailand as well, and wonders if his short ponytail will have to go. Nothing major...he's not a backpacker/need a bath hippie. What should he do? |
He'll be okay IMO and IME! Not a biggie as long as it's a 'smart' pony tail.
| Quote: |
| 4. Let's suppose a teacher lives in BKK, although teaches approximately 1 hour (by bus) from BKK in the suburbs. Would it okay to date women IN the school's geographic area, or would that causes problems? Example: Instead of going back to BKK after work, I explore the community and its restaurants, pubs...you never know when the most beautiful (subjectively speaking) woman will appear...Advice? |
Yes, that would most likely be acceptable (it's not quite that strict here). |
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