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troy_westpoint
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
Posts: 8
Location: middle of Canada for now
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 Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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| so let me get this straight, if you have an STD you will be deported or denied entry if they catch you? i might not be a doctor but i was under the impression that some viral STD's cant be tested for so how do they deal with those people. |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056
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| Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:35 am Post subject: |
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| troy_westpoint wrote: |
| so let me get this straight, if you have an STD you will be deported or denied entry if they catch you? i might not be a doctor but i was under the impression that some viral STD's cant be tested for so how do they deal with those people. |
Despite Aristotle�s claim to the contrary, not all STD�s are tested for. Although not a comprehensive list, my best guess is that they are looking for HIV, hepatitis (not sure which ones), and syphilis. I don�t think that herpes or gonorrhea are considered.
Now, back to the Chocolate matter:
Let me start by saying that I don�t know the guy and therefore I am working off what has been said and published about the case. My guess is that neither Aristotle nor Killian know him either, so at least we are all on the same plane.
| killian wrote: |
| he had been in taiwan for decades. he got sick in taiwan. he was deported for his illness. his life was uprooted based upon hearsay and race bias. he was cured of his illness by the time he was deported. |
As I said before, one way of looking at the case is as Killian presents it above. In my opinion this is rather simplified and supports an agenda that both Killian and Aristotle have, and that is to try and paint Taiwan as being some renegade and lawless country.
Let me ask a question Killian. Is it not correct that he was living in Taiwan on an APRC, which is in most cases a residency permit based upon marriage to a local (there are some exceptions such as long term residents who can apply for such, and other special cases)? Is it not true that his wife was his most vocal critic, and the one that brought the whole case into the public view as she was requesting a divorce? Is it not true that she claimed the marriage was a shame for the purposes of obtaining an APRC? Everyone who knows the guy, knows that he is gay, and none of the people who actually know him and spoke up about the case at the time even attempted to suggest that his marriage was genuine, nor that he was even bi-sexual. As I stated, I don�t know the guy, but I do trust the accounts given by his friends who were very sympathetic to his situation, but were unanimous in the fact that he brought it all upon himself.
Maybe the authorities should have waited it out, let him first become divorced, and then let him be deported for the fact that his residency status had changed. The complicating factors were that:
a) He had a communicable disease that just so happens to make it illegal for foreigners to remain in Taiwan. Sure this may be unfair, particularly considering the fact that he may well have contracted the disease here in Taiwan, but that is the law in this country, and we all agree to it when we obtain visas to come here. Then again he could have contracted it on a trip out of the country only to be found out during his next health check. No body knows these facts. He wasn�t imprisoned for this, he wasn�t penalized monetarily for this. His right to remain in the country was revoked and he was given a week or so to leave. Unfortunate for him � definitely. Illegal or a breach of civil rights � most certainly not.
b) He was being accused of committing some serious crimes here in Taiwan. These were never proven as the case never got to court. Once again though, I noticed that none of his friends stood up and said that it would have been impossible for him to have committed the offences that he stood accused of. Had the case gone to court, and had it led to a conviction, then my understanding is that he could have faced the death penalty here in Taiwan. It seems to me that Chocolate was more than likely relieved that he could in fact leave the country, and thereby leave this potentiality behind. |
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Aristotle
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1388
Location: Taiwan
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| Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:37 am Post subject: |
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| Despite Aristotle�s claim to the contrary, not all STD�s are tested for |
It doesn't matter what diseases are tested for. If you go the doctor and get diagnosed with an STD you may be deported, it has happened in the past and will happen again regardless of the type of visa you have or what the law says. As a public health issue anyone who goes to the doctor claiming to have an STD is treated for one even if the test come up negative.
There is no rule of law on Taiwan, only the rule of the most corrupt.
Foreigners have no rights on Taiwan regardless of what the laws or regulations say because the democratically elected government routinely ignores the human rights of non Chinese on Taiwan!
Welcome to Taiwan.
A.
Last edited by Aristotle on Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:52 am; edited 1 time in total |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056
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| Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Aristotle wrote: |
| If you go the doctor and get diagnosed with an STD you may be deported, it has happened in the past and will happen again regardless of the type of via you have or what the law says. |
That's correct, if the STD is on the governments list of contagious diseases that foreigners will get deported for. It doesn't matter whether they find out upfront during your first medical or during the course of your stay with additional medicals. This is actually stated in the laws.
| Aristotle wrote: |
| There is no rule of law on Taiwan, only the rule of the most corrupt. Foreigners have no rights on Taiwan regardless of what the laws or regulations say because the democratically elected government routinely ignores the human rights of non Chinese on Taiwan! |
Yes you have said this many times but you have never shown it to be the case. |
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killian
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 937
Location: fairmont city, illinois, USA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:07 am Post subject: |
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she married him. she was a small part of any machinations, yes? she was a very vocal critic- when such served her. was she vocal during the good times? no. was she punished for the alleged scam of a marriage? not that i know of.
anyone who has been in country any amount of time knows firsthand horror stories. there was a south american woman i knew. had been in taiwan 20+ years. the mother of two sons (one in college, one in high school). she was fluent in chinese to the point she could read the daily paper and novels. one day her husband tells her they are getting divorced. despite her ties to her children she is stripped of residency rights and was sent back "home"- a place she hadn't been for almost a quarter century. her crime? her offense?
i don't think i try to paint taiwan in an unjust light. i honestly try to be partial. please don't scroll through my old posts and cherry pick the lines that favor your position. such a tactic has been all too common here lately. a good many of my posts were deleted when the site was updated a few years back.
taiwan is OK. it used to be better. i left when the negatives outweighed the positives- as most everyone else who uses this forum shall also do in their own good time. enjoy the journey.
best wishes. |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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| killian wrote: |
| she married him. she was a small part of any machinations, yes? she was a very vocal critic- when such served her. was she vocal during the good times? no. was she punished for the alleged scam of a marriage? not that i know of. |
I am sure that she was party to whole thing and as such just as guilty. The fact is though that the discussions that are had on the subject on boards such as these largely limit themselves to discussions about the poor foreigner.
As I have said, I didn't know the guy, but I haven't seen any clear evidence that he was treated unfairly or unjustly. Possibly it may have been better for the authorities to have deported him solely upon the loss of marriage/loss of residency thing, but alas they chose the STD problem. Either way this would not have changed the current position.
Why wasn't she prosecuted? Well possibly because there was no complaint lodged against her I guess. The way things legal seem to work here in Taiwan is largely a case of you having to initiate proceedings. In many cases you need to actually request that the authorities look into something or take action against someone. When you do, they are normally pretty quick about this.
Your comments about the women losing citizenship due to the loss of her marriage are certainly unfair, but it is my understanding that this has recently changed. I don't know a lot about this, but my understanding is that if you lose your JFRV now and you have kids or other commitments in the country then you can change to an APRC. This gives you basically the same entitlements as far as being an open work permit. |
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