Job Discussion Forums

[missionsonmind]

I have somewhat searched the posts ...but haven't found answers to my questions so please I apologize if this is a repeat.

What do you think about a job that the recruiter told you 4000rmb but on the internet you see the same job posted and paying 8000rmb with a 3000rmb end of the year bonus - both jobs offer shared accomodations and all meals paid.

The only possible difference is the posting on the internet states TEFL/TESL certificate which I do not posses.

I questioned about this early on but was told the job posting was old and due to SARS scare - lots of teachers left. The only problem with that is this posting I second and third postings were within the last three months.

Your input and insight is greatly appreciated!

I am so grateful to have run across this site ...I have learned so much just by reading!

My contract is so vague...I was feeling so uncomfortable! Now I am armed with great questions to ask my recruiter.

Many Thanks!
Missionsminded

[tofuman]

MM,

First thing I'd do is lose the "missionary" schtck. You came to China to work and your contract probably forbids "religious" activity inappropriate for an FT, whatever that means.

Chances are that your recruiter is giving you half of what your salary should be. He may even be getting 10,000 to serve you up as a "living sacrifice," while you console yourself that through suffering you must enter the kingdom of God.

In your "missionary" guide, those who used what sometimes appear as questionable business ethics are commended. I would say your recruiter is profitting nicely and you are getting a good lesson why it is often a good idea to avoid recruiters.

[missionsonmind]

How narrow thinking....that I am "religious" ....you see the mission on my mind could be lots of things! not religion....not meaning to offend but just straight talking

Thanks for the comment though! I am not sure you addressed the fact that I don't have the TEFL/TESL certificate ...does that count for 1/2 the salary? I although have the credit hours for a degree...because I switched majors I don't have a degree...

I guess I am asking if those two things equate to 4000rmb of the offered salary. Also I forgot to add $1000usd for flight home.

Thank you again for the comment and I hope I haven't scared anyone off with my rather pointed comment

[tofuman]

If you have no degree and no TESOL, you should change that before you come to China. One of the few ways that China has of keeping incompetent, immature, and unqualified individuals out of the country is to have minimum expectations to assure some level of competency.

Obviously a degree is no proof of maturity, but wouldn't you like to have something to offer?

You may find a job with your lack of credentials, but it could be a job with a flaky company that is going to "rip you off."

[Girl Scout]

Dump the recruiter and apply for the job direct. It does not sound like you have commited yourself to anything yet. You have to choose a school that is a good fit for you. There are a lot of jobs in China. Pick one that makes you feel comfortable. After all, you are about to go half way around the world to a totally alien place for at least one year.

[missionsonmind]

just fyi...I have taught school for three years and taught seminars and taught and trained most of my career so the teaching and the creativity and the language is NO problem...my experience equals more than several degrees or certificates....so I am not at all challenged by your remarks or scared into not coming because I know I will do well.....

My question was just surrounding the salary equal to certificate. In America a degree makes a big difference in salary however many times based on your experience you could get the same salary or even higher but getting you in the door or even interviewed oftentimes depended on your degree. There are certain vocations that only degreed people are allowed to work based on the liability of those positions. It is becoming apparent to me that China is different.

Thank you Girl Scout for your input also....its appreciated!

[tofuman]

"You may find a job with your lack of credentials, but it could be a job with a flaky company that is going to "rip you off."

Unless you have something unique to offer, which would be rare without a degree, you may have difficulty getting with a reputable, trustworthy firm that you can depend on to pay you, reimburse your air fair, provide decent housing, etc.

By people with unique qualifications, I refer to individuals competent in specialized fields such as health care, law, business, etc. These individuals have an understanding of specialized vocabulary and are often of greater interest to reputable schools.

The Chinese do not understand that a person without a degree can be quite successful in the West; consequently, some attach an inordinate amount of importance to the degree. Neither a master's degree, nor a bachelor's is required to teach oral English to students who would rather be hairdressers.

You should be thinking of the quality of the students with whom you will be spending your time. Kids are screened before high school and the better students go to better schools. If you land in one of the schools with students who have been side tracked because of their intellectual shortcomings, you could have a difficult time. Think babysitter for obnoxious brats rather than teacher.

Luckily, my student's are well behaved and respectful, but that is not always the case.

I'd like to know what kind of school you taught in without a degree.

[go_ABs]

tofuman - I'm sure I'm not alone in appreciating the experience, honesty and wisdom you bring to these boards. But you seem to've jumped to conclusions about this person.

She (I'm just taking a guess here) said she had educated others for more than three years - don't you think that would count as something unique? She'd probably be miles better than a qualified-to-the-hilt newby straight out of college. And I bet that's the angle she's pushing in order to find a job.

She's taught at a school, and she doesn't have a degree. But there are many types of school. For all we know, she's a 40 year old electrician who has been doing the same job for twenty years, and in the last three starting teaching night classes at the local community college. 'School' often has a variety of meanings, as I'm sure teaching in China has taught you.

missionsonmind - I agree with Girl Scout. Dump the recruiter. Or challenge them up front and say that you found the recent ad offering 8,000, but you can understand that they want the TESOL cert., so 7,000 would be reasonable.

What you've said about the States rings true here also, in my experience. While the degree and TESOL cert are no assurance of quality, they help you get a foot in the door.

In my opinion, the difference between what you make for doing the same job as someone more qualified than yourself should be big, but not as big as you're talking about.

Cheers,
And sorry if you're a guy after all.

[missionsonmind]

I feel like the princess who was just rescued from the fire breathing dragon.....I owe you.... prince go_ABs ....what a gentleman and a scholar! Yes its true I taught in a private institution where they had to meet a quota of degreed teachers for accreditation. In the business world I conduct training seminars all the time. I do believe I have something to offer I love the Chinese and more than that I love teenagers. I hope to inspire these young people to do great things in their life. I suppose