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Jianxi Nanchang Anyone?

Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> China (Job-related Posts Only)

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arioch36

Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 3589

Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2003 7:02 am Post subject: Jianxi Nanchang Anyone?

I am idly considering some schools in Jiangxi. Nanchang seems like a pit to me. Anyone??? Jiujiang Institute and Jianxi Xinya Vocational college seem to be in nicer spots. Comments welcomed and handsomely rewarded

ESL Guru

Joined: 18 May 2003
Posts: 462

Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2003 8:13 am Post subject:

Jiangxi Normal is a fairly decent uni according to a friend of mine who worked there. They are currently recruiting on Chinatefl.com Jiangxi Agricultural has some really great people, working and living conditions. I visited the campus and met the people before taking a different position which I came to regret. Should have gone with them. Know nothing about the ones you mention. Sorry. No reward sought nor accepted. Good hunting!

Wolf

Joined: 10 May 2003
Posts: 1245
Location: Middle Earth

Posted: Sun Jun 22, 2003 1:29 pm Post subject:

ESL Guru wrote:

Jiangxi Normal is a fairly decent uni according to a friend of mine who worked there. They are currently recruiting on Chinatefl.com

Jiangxi Agricultural has some really great people, working and living conditions. I visited the campus and met the people before taking a different position which I came to regret. Should have gone with them.

Know nothing about the ones you mention. Sorry.

No reward sought nor accepted. Good hunting!

It's a small world after all... Very Happy

If you're sick of Evil Employers, man I suggest the Agricutlural Uni. The unexpected surprises include free maid service and trips for the teachers every semester (on the uni's yuan.) The new FE bulding has private, massive apts. Wow, I was this close to being the co-worker of the esteemed ESL Guru! They won't make you rich, but you'll have almost nothing in the way of living expenses. Sorry, but I don't know if they filled all their positions yet or no. The Agri Uni (as well as the Economic Uni - which I know hires foreign experts too) are kind of outside the city, and the ride into town to shop etc can be wearing.

I also have a friend at the Normal Uni. Sounds pretty sweet there too. The Normal has a good location, from what I can tell.

There's also Nanchang (City) University - have 2 FE friends there. It seems equally cool.

From what I know, all places are looking for people for Sept, but they've already started their hiring process. I have never heard a boo about bad working conditions, etc etc.

The're also an English First in town. Enormous horay. So what if they pay better. If you want money go to Shenzen. Work for a uni. You can get enough part time gigs in Nanchang to make up the difference I'm sure. (Lots of start ups looking for FEs.)

Arioch, I also don't know those spots. But there are so many schools of one sort or another everywhere (not all hire FEs.)

I've gone ballistic on Nanchang before, I know. But I'm beginning to settle in a bit more (hard to do out here grr to the commute.) It isn't a horrible place. There are a lot of nice people. . Nanchang is a test of character - but I think I'll be happy here.

BAD:

This is the edit: Yes Arioch it's a pit. As my family so lovingly described it, it's "third world." Um ... this is inland China ... how many cities are not so? I know some poeple (Chinese mationals if it's important) who have come here from Guangzhou, Beijing, and Zuhai - arguably 3 of the best places that a z visa for the PRC will let you work. They all say that it's better here than a few years ago. This did take some getting used to for me. If it helps conditions here improve quickly.

There's not a lot here in the way of culture. Museums, movie theatres, art exhibits, etc etc. My students all tell me to go to Beijing for that. This for me has been a personal bummer.

There is much staring and helloing.

Western food = Some KFCs, 2 Pizza Huts and a McDonalds. Full stop.

Clothes for big people are hard to find but not impossible.

Legal copies of movies are impossible to find. I think I, personally, own all the legal DVDs that exist in the Nanchang municipality. Illegal copies
are particularily dicey in quality, what moive it is etc.

It can be a bit boring. If you make friends you'll have a blast. If you don't you'll suffer.

GOOD:

My students a) can speak English (well many of them can) and b) are willing to work hard to learn more. PS lots of places give freedom for you to plan lessons. As long as you don't hold an in-class pledge drive to raise money for Taiwan to buy nukes from the US, the unis I know will let you go (esp if you stand up and insist/have some good ideas.)

There is no Starbuck's. No, this goes in the good section. Yes, I know I'm being immature and subjective.

I do not think I've ever been overcharged - not for big stuff anyway (compared prices with Chinese students.) Lots of stores have adopted price tags, and realize foreigners can read them. Taxis use metres.

Great place to buy procelin - and by that I mean vases. (note - because this is the tourist thing this is where you would be overcharged.)

Cost of living would make even many of your cry when you hear what I get away with.

Cuz it's so far away from Big Bad Beijing it is possible to meet people who will, shall we say, express opinions - at least to you in private.

Oh, and if you want to be an amatuer linguist you've got Mandarin (sort of) in Jiangxi, Cantonese just to the south in Guangdong, and Fujianese/Taiwanese just to the east in Fujian.

ESL Guru

Joined: 18 May 2003
Posts: 462

Posted: Sun Jun 22, 2003 1:44 pm Post subject:

Wolf - You forgot the best part about the Agr uni. They have a reputation for extending FE contracts two or three years.

Wolf

Joined: 10 May 2003
Posts: 1245
Location: Middle Earth

Posted: Sun Jun 22, 2003 1:54 pm Post subject:

ESL Guru wrote:

Wolf -

You forgot the best part about the Agr uni.

They have a reputation for extending FE contracts two or three years.

Yep. I got me a 1.5 year contract. Nong Da, our long term friend.

Michael T. Richter

Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Posts: 77
Location: Wuhan, Hubei, PRC

Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 5:16 am Post subject: Re: Jianxi Nanchang Anyone?

arioch36 wrote:

Jiujiang Institute and Jianxi Xinya Vocational college seem to be in nicer spots. Comments welcomed and handsomely rewarded

Stay the Hell away from Jiujiang "Institute" (proper name: Jiujiang Financial and Economic College). I teach here now; thankfully the contract expires at the end of July. This place is a hell-hole. The students are great. The accomodation is above average. For that the management ranks somewhere slightly lower on the evolutionary scale than slug slime.

The President of the college--having bragged once to the foreign teachers last Christmas Eve that he was "considered a general in the PLA" (he isn't)--is fundamentally delusional. He is uncivilised by Chinese standards, not to mention western standards. My students have frequently pleaded with me not to judge the Chinese people by him and his coterie. (Luckily I have actually met civilised Chinese people so I don't hate the country.)

The "leadership" of this college basically thinks they run a military camp. (The fact that it was once a PLA college confuses issues.) They expect instant obedience to every half-baked, cock-eyed order they give without any consideration whatsoever being paid to such niceties as "contract" or even "decency" for that matter. If you come to this pile of dog vomit, your sole role will be to give 黄保强 (Huang Baoqiang) face when he talks to the leaders of other colleges. And, of course, to help him fulfill his master plan of having his toy college renamed from the Jiujiang Financial and Economic College (it's not really Jiujiang Institute yet, but they're allowed to use the name -- complicated story) to Jiujiang University.

On that front, they do actually call themselves Jiujiang University -- in English. When faced with the fact that this was a blanket, straightforward lie, the excuse given by the head waiban was, and I am absolutely not making this up!, "we want to become a university, so the president has said we can call ourselves a university." (OK. I want to get my Ph.D., so I insist that you all start calling me Dr. Richter....)

Here is their current ad: http://www.chinatefl.com/jiangxi/teach/jx_jj.html. It's been a great joke around here in the foreign teachers' community of the college. Consider, for example, the following lies (with attendent rebuttal):

Quote:

The staff includes over 32 teachers who hold PhDs and over 371 with master's degrees.

As far as anybody can tell, this is a flat-out lie. Huang ordered all his teachers to upgrade their degrees to Master level within three years or they'd be fired (contracts notwithstanding -- note the persistent theme!), so this "371 with master's degrees" sounds to me (and other foreign teachers) an awful lot like "we want them to have master's degrees so we'll say that they have master's degrees".

Edit: I just grilled one of my students. She has not, in two years in being in this college, met a single teacher with a master's degree.

Quote:

The college also employs foreign teachers year round, and currently enrolls over 22,073 students.

This is a flat-out lie. It has 15,000 students tops.

Edit: Same student says that the college has 13,000 students.

Quote:

The college library possesses a collection of over 1,800,000 books, of which over 40,000 are in foreign languages.

Where? Certainly not in any accessible part of the library. All the visible rooms have lots and lots and lots of shelves -- all devoid of books. The majority of the library floor space is taken up by "study rooms" -- also devoid of books.

Edit: Same student explained where the 1.8 million books came from. They add the textbooks the students bought to the total number of books in the library. Note that: the students bought the textbooks, but the books are accounted for as being part of the library.

Quote:

The College has been actively developing its international education and culture exchange program, enrolling foreign students, establishing long-term cooperative relationship with Australia, U.S.A, Canada and U.K etc.

There has never been a foreign student on this campus. Never. Not once.

Quote:

Jiujiang Institute was established in March, 2002 by combining Jiujiang Financial and Economic college, Jiujiang Teachers'College, Jiujiang Medical College and Jjiujiang Educational college [...]

The combination has not been completed yet. First the Teachers' College put up stiff opposition and, just as it looked like it was about to lose, the Medical College started up. The merger has not yet been completed and it doesn't seem like there's any end to the process in sight.

Quote:

So far, at least 100 foreign teachers have worked at Jiujiang Institute, they come from various countries such as America, Canada, England, Ireland, Australia, and Germany.

This is another flat-out lie. The total number of teachers that have taught at the main campus (Jiujiang Financial and Economic College) is 16. That's all the teachers they've ever hired in their entire history. Add in the medical college and you get maybe ten more. (I'm being very generous with this estimate.) Now add in the teachers' college and you get, on the outside, a dozen more. That means, by using a generous set of estimates, that the total number of foreign teachers employed by any element of what might someday become the Jiujiang Institute is 38. Round it to 40 to take care of any stragglers I may have missed. "At least" 100? Not even half-way true this one.

Quote:

We recruit teachers who are well qualified, who are interested in teaching at university level, and really care about students and their needs, and who relate to them not just as teachers, but as friends and companions in the pursuit of knowledge.

Well-qualified. Right. Like six non-native English speakers teaching English, three of whom could barely make themselves understood to the native speakers. As for wanting teachers to be "friends and companions" -- this seems to fly directly in the face of continual exhortation that students are not permitted to visit their foreign teachers' apartments (despite being permitted to visit their Chinese teachers' apartments!). This exhortation is, of course, given to the students in Chinese only. The teachers are told by Huang that "foreign teachers are treated the same as Chinese teachers"....

The ad also used to advertise "4 hours free Chinese lessons weekly" (which got a huge laugh from the current foreign teachers) and "free meals" (gales of laughter again). When the waiban found out that we had seen the ad, however, the ad was very suddenly changed. Let's be generous and call that a "mistake".

Oh, and they pay pretty damned low as well. You, as a foreign teacher, with expenses much higher than any Chinese teacher, will wind up getting paid less than most of the Chinese teachers in their second year. They pay their Chinese teachers very well (it's the only way they can keep them -- the Chinese teachers hate this place as well!), but they don't pay their foreign teachers well at all given the competition.

Edit: Several young teachers are simply quitting their positions. The student I've grilled can name three who are leaving and one who has persistently stated that she wanted to leave off the top of her head. I suspect it would take only a little bit of work to compile a list of 30 teachers who are actively seeking other positions despite the elevated pay of this place.

*****

Now that I've finished slagging the so-called "Institute", let's talk about Jiujiang the city. Any criticism you have of Nanchang can be easily applied to Jiujiang. The only difference is one of scale. Nanchang is a huge, polluted, smelly, grimy industrial city. Jiujiang is a tiny, polluted, smelly, grimy industrial city. You have all of the negative aspects of Nanchang put together with none of its benefits. Basically living in Jiujiang is like living in Nanchang, only without the convenient shopping, the airport and the railway hub. If you're into the night life scene, Jiujiang has none for all practical purposes. If you're here for Chinese history and culture, well, you can see a couple of nice spots -- but they're all within a day-trip of Nanchang (or a weekend trip from Wuhan) if you're interested. So don't let Dongling Si or Lushan tempt you into coming to Jiujiang -- they're all within reach of many more civilised places.

arioch36

Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 3589

Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 6:40 am Post subject:

Thanx for the good info all Chris

ESL Guru

Joined: 18 May 2003
Posts: 462

Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:25 am Post subject:

A truly momentus time at Dave's ESL Cafe! An original poster gets what he sought and without a single flame! CONGRATULATIONS PEOPLE - THERE IS HOPE AFTER ALL!

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