Job Discussion Forums

Babala · Joined: 28 Jan 2005 Posts: 1303 Location: Henan

Your idea is to wait to and see Shocked

There are lots of sexual assaults where the girl is too ashamed to report it. In Asian countries where face is everything, might you consider that a student may doubtfully report him? He is no allowed by law to teach in his own country, why should he be allowed to teach here?

31 · Joined: 21 Jan 2005 Posts: 1797

Signor · Joined: 07 Sep 2004 Posts: 66 Location: Qatar

The response that springs to mind is - Would you be happy with this guy teaching your 15 year old sister or daughter? If you wouldn't then he shouldn't be near any teenage girl.

As teachers, we are in a priviledged position and should make sure that it is not abused.

spidey · Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 6:58 am Post subject:

ls650 · Joined: 10 May 2003 Posts: 3484 Location: British Columbia

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

This is a population group with which I have had some familiarity--though it has been quite a while. My ex-husband is in the process of retiring, but still has one of the most respected clinics for treating sex offenders in the US--most come through court referrals, exactly like the one mentioned where probation is conditioned on treatment.

Treatment of sex offenders is not especially effective. Modalities such as penile shock showed some promise back in the early to mid-70s, but the ACLU was very vocal in protest. Covert desensitization works when the patient really wants to make changes. And very few do. This is compulsive activity, and recidivism rates are extremely high.

I can't say if the guy is a pedophile from what information has been given--it's too limited. I remember an incident 6 years ago in Cuernavaca, Mexico, when a theology/philosophy teacher who was on the faculty of a private junior high/high school with me was given the sack for taking photographs of his 15 year old female students. Has this guy been doing anything to indicate that he's up to his old tricks?

spidey · Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 4:20 am Post subject:

SandyMcIvor · Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 5:57 am Post subject: ask

Dillenger,

Why don't you talk to the guy? Ask if he's doing ok working with kids, and just let him know that you know and are keeping an eye on him. If he has a guilty conscious, he'll quit. If he don't, well, he'll be careful. At any rate, you've let him know where he stands.

lajzar · Joined: 09 Feb 2003 Posts: 647 Location: Saitama-ken, Japan

Being convicted of a sex crime involving minors is completley different from being from a viasible minority. The is a matter of choice - he chose to do the crime.

Personally, I would happily employ him in any job that did not conceivably involve any contact with minors in any way. That doesn't apply to most EFL jobs I know of.

At teh very least, he is guilty of a sex crime, and paedophilia (most countries that allow sex for people under 16 also qualify with certain conditions about the age of teh partner), and most importantly, he has abused teh position of power a teacher has over a student. To me, that last one is as least as important as the others in deciding whether to employ him.

stillnosheep · Joined: 01 Mar 2004 Posts: 2068 Location: eslcafe

Let's stop referring to any sexual activity concerning people below the legal age of consent in a aprticular country as an incidence of paedophilia, which can then be kept as the correct term regarding the desire to have sexual contact with children (pederasty relates to actual sexual contact with such). 15 year old girls are not (normally) children.

The guy engaged in sexual activity with a 15 year-old pupil. Regardless of the the fact that this was illegal in the state where this most EFL teachers, would, I think, regard such behaviour as irresponsible and unethical.

What "we" should do if we find a paedophile in our midst is not the same question as whether somebody who has previously had an affair with a 15 yr old pupil should be allowed to teach EFL. The matters deserve to be treated seperately.

ls650 · Joined: 10 May 2003 Posts: 3484 Location: British Columbia

spidey · Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 1:34 pm Post subject:

Gordon · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 5309 Location: Japan

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

First of all, let's all calm down and at least TRY to be rational.

It is very possible that the person in question specifically went into TEFL to run away from a situation at "home". It is also very possible that he went into TEFL for other reasons.

I do NOT agree with the advice to confront him. That is humiliation. The only bare-bottom spanking my daughter ever received from me was when she hollered out in her "stage whisper" at the Seattle Art Museum, complete with pointing index finger: "That's one of my dad's pedophile patients!"

My advice would be to do nothing unless it is clear that the person is backsliding into the behaviors that ran him afoul of the legal system. It really is not your business. Maybe that sounds callous? Remember, other people DO have rights. If you were making a sincere attempt to put pathological compulsive behavior behind you, how would you feel if someone exposed your past? Think about it.

High Plains Drifter · Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 127 Location: Way Out There

Is it really so easy to brand this 52-year-old man a pedophile and to feel so morally superior? What is a pedophile? A man who is attracted to young women? How young is young? How old does the man have to be? And is there a difference between what is biologically natural and what is legal?

While it is not legal in the USA for a man to have sex with a 15-year-old girl, it is perfectly natural for a normal man of ANY age to be sexually attracted to ANY female who is past puberty. That is basic human biology, and though we men are socialized to suppress this attraction, we can�t turn it off�we are hardwired this way and no amount of moralizing will ever change it.

If all heterosexual men who have ever been attracted to a 15-year-old girl are pedophiles, then ALL men are pedophiles. But even if we grant that an attraction is natural, but acting upon that attraction is the problem, is a man who has sex with a woman who is 15, past puberty and sexually mature, a pedophile and a rapist, or merely a rapist?

Though laws vary from state to state, I believe in the USA it is generally illegal for a man over 18 to have sex with a woman under 18. This is called statutory rape. So the 52-year-old man who had sex with the 15-year-old girl was guilty of rape (assuming it occurred in the USA). OK, that�s a no brainer, but how many 18-year-old guys in the USA have sex with their 17-year-old girlfriends every year? Plenty, I�m sure. Are they all rapists too? And lest we tacitly accept a double standard, is every 18-year-old girl in the USA who has sex with her 17-year-old boyfriend, which must surely happen all the time, a rapist too?

And what of other countries and cultures where it is legal and socially acceptable for men to have sex with 15-year-old girls? Are those men all pedophiles and rapists too even though where they are it�s legal?

Before anyone jumps on me, I am not in any way condoning or advocating pedophilia, but I think it must be recognized that the broad range of human psychology, sexuality and behavior is not so easily quantified and regulated.