Job Discussion Forums

Wouter · Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 128 Location: Tlaquepaque

Hi Moonraven,

Thanks for the advice. What our plan is that we provide the teacher with the necesary papers from the school. They self have to go to immigration office to aply for the FM 3. We know what kind of paper we have to give them but they have also to bring in a lot of papers.

We have to speak with the accountant to see what extra cost we going to have.

We already are aproved as far as I know because we are working for this company and have a FM3. My girlfriend is owner and we are working for the company.

We only have to find out what the extra cost are and to write the paper that the teacher will need to aply for the FM 3.

Wouter

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

I don't get it. WHAT extra cost?

Either you are willing to pay the teachers a living wage, or you aren't. If you aren't, they will not be given an FM3.

I believe you are being deliberately ingenuous. The INM offices all have a list of the required documents for an FM3, as does the website for the Secretario de Gobernaci�n.

You just don't want to hire teachers legally. I believe that you should stop trying to recruit them here on Dave's.

Wouter · Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 128 Location: Tlaquepaque

Hi Moonraven,

I will explain you why. If the person who is going to work here is registered as a freelancer we dont have extra cost than the amount we pay him plus the IVA. I dont know how this is called in English. The thing is that if he is a freelancer he has to give us a factura.

If he is registered as somebody working for the school we have to pay extra costs. These are IFONAVID, heathinsurance and some other things. If someones salary is for instance 5000 pesos the extra cost for us will be around 1200 pesos.

Further I looked around and what we found out that it is quite common that schools have a trial period from around 2 months. These two months the school can descide if the teacher is what they are looking for and for the teacher to see if he likes the school. In this period the school wont start the FM 3 procedure. After this two months if both parties agree schools start with the proces to get a FM 3.

As to your asumption that we dont want to hire teachers legally. We want to hire teachers legally but we have to find out what is the best way for the teacher and for us to do this.

Wouter

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

If the person is a legal freelancer then he/she has an FM3. It is necessary in order to register with Hacienda and to have recibos de honorarios printed.

Yes, if a person is legal you have to pay benefits. They are a cost of doing business.

Why have you waited all this time to consider hiring folks legally?

It should not have taken my complaints here on Dave's for you to do that.

I think what you have told us is a crock.

Wouter · Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 128 Location: Tlaquepaque

Hi Moonraven,

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

You just do not care to understand. Or you are a total cynic. It is ILLEGAL to give folks "trial periods" and then help them get an FM3. They cannot legally work even 1 minute in your school without one.

All the folks that I hired on an FM3 basis were given a contract with a base salary, full benefits and bonuses. We had a couple of Mexican teachers who at different times were on honorarios instead of a salary, but most of the Mexican teachers were salaried, with contracts. Salaries varied--were based on education, experience and ability to teach advanced levels.

Insulting my intelligence apparently doesn't count as an insult, Wouter?

And, on a purely professional note: based on what you have written on this forum, I don't think you should be teaching English. I have had many students with better levels.

Wouter · Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 128 Location: Tlaquepaque

Hi Moonraven,

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

Glad to hear you are not a teacher, Wouter.

Not only I, but also other posters have advised you that it is ILLEGAL to have a non-Mexican teacher working until the FM3 is in his/her hand. If you are caught, the teachers will be deported and your company will be fined. I have seen it happen. This is not ring-around-the-rosie, Wouter, this is the real world.

Until it is in his/her hand, the teacher is also not elegible for IMSS coverage--to which SAR and INFONAVIT are attached.

Full benefits at the school where I was director: (percentages refer to salary)

IMSS coverage
SAR
INFONAVIT
vales de despensa (10%)
savings plan
assistance with transportation and housing (10%)
5% for punctuality
5% for attendance
5% for student evaluations over 90%
5% for student re-enrollment over 90%

plus semester bonuses.

You insult my intelligence by thinking that I could possibly believe your good intentions in this situation!

chola · Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 8:58 pm Post subject: IMSS etc

Hi, Hopefully someone is able to help me.

I would like to know what benefits i would qualify for if I were teaching full-time, legally, with an FM3? It's a bit baffling trying to understand the organization of the various kinds of employment status/obligations/responsibilities and rights.

Also, what are some of the less obvious questions I ought to ask the person interviewing me? Any shoulds/shouldn'ts?
....what's the best way to dress for "the interview"? I'll be in Guadalajara so.....I am assuming it's business attire, on the conservative side...

One more thing: do you know which areas of guad. are affordable and safe (I spent a week there alone a while ago and felt okay...but, any info helps).
Thanks to any and all who offer advice, sage or otherwise.

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

Legally, you should receive IMSS coverage( national health insurance--you pay half and the employer pays half), SAR and INFONAVIT (100% employer paid), aguinaldo (number of weeks depends on the employer) and prima vacacional. Any other benefits depend on the employer.

chola · Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 12:01 am Post subject: august 15.....too late?

I'm going to be in Guad. Aug. 15th. Will I be too late to find a job?With my meagre credentials (TESL diploma, years experience and B.Sc., I'll be wading around in the shallow end of the teaching pool, I suppose, and thus, looking at jobs in private schools), I don't expect heaps of money nor hoards of offers. However, I do hope I CAN find something economically sustainable. Is it too late? Am I doomed? Shocked

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

What do you mean by "private schools"? If you mean private K-12 schools, their teachers will already have been hired and working. If you mean language schools (Harmon Hall and the like), you might still have a chance.

chola · Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 10:03 pm Post subject: "private" schools

Because I don't hold a B.ed, I assume I am not qualified to teach in K-12 private schools, but I may be wrong? I suppose my options are limited to schools such as Harmon hall(private schools) and the like...unless anyone can advise me of other options based on my meagre credentials.

Do most private schools(as defined above) have revolving enrollment or is it limited to specific periods?

thanks, sorry for the fuzzy question.

Ben Round de Bloc · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 1946

moonraven · Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 3094

I agree with Ben.

This is not the US.

Chola, I think your fuzziness is going to be a problem for you. And I think you would be lucky to be hired by an organization such as Harmon Hall. Harmon Halls are language schools. Language schools teach languages--not grades in primary, secondary and high school. In the case of Harmon Hall, courses during the week are on a 4 week cycle, and Saturday classes are on a 6 weeks cycle.