Job Discussion Forums

[garlic and basil]

As far as I can tell the only wide open country with no government or school controls of travel, private life, taxes, contracts, visas etc existed in the *past* - Taiwan 20 years ago, Cambodia 10 years ago, etc.

Where, in your experienced opinion, is the country with the fewest 'cannots' and 'musts'?

[Bebsi]

Let me get this straight: you are looking for a job in a country that you don't need a visa to enter? When you get there, you want a good job for which qualifcations or experience are not necessary, and in which you can do what you want without taking responsibility as such? And should you wish to leave at any time, you would hate to be bound up in contracts and other obligations? Hmmm...

I suppose that you will expect a reasonable salary? And of course, you will not want to pay any taxes on that salary?

If the school provides free accom (and why even consider the job if it doesn't?) you don't want the hassle of noise control regulations, utility bills, cleaning responsibilities etc, right?

It goes without saying that you don't want any competition for this job either.

You could try the Nirvana school in the Republic of Utopia.

[garlic and basil]

For example, a sensible flat tax rate, say less than 10%, as in Vietnam

Easy to enter and exit the country (as it is in Thailand, or at least has been for decades) Visas easy to extend, as in Cambodia

Teachers not expected to work by contract but rather are free agents.

Etc.

In other words a country that is in dire need of ESL teachers and thus welcomes us rather than places obstacles of bureaucracy in our way.

[Glenski]

garlic and basil,
What you call bureaucracy can also be construed as proper regulation. Mind you, there isn't much of that around either, but to be a free agent can be a bad thing, you realize.

No health care payments by your employer (because you work for yourself).
No guarantee of union protection (because you don't belong to one, nor do you sign a contract that specifies your work conditions)

How has it been difficult to "exit the country" in the places you have lived? Just go to the airport. If you want to return and keep a visa, get a reentry permit. If you see such permits and visas as bureaucracy, so be it, but they are there for a reason and are not big hassles UNLESS YOU ARE UNQUALIFIED.

Which raises a point. What are your qualifications?

[sigmoid]

Yes, the trend with TEFL seems to be heading in the direction of more regulation, but that could turn around soon as countries realise that they need to relax in order to attract sufficient numbers of foreign teachers.

Apparently the governments wake up one morning and suddenly discover a prosperous TEFL market with a healthy labor force. Then, they get the idea of 'hey, we should do something about this' in the usual 'well, it's not broke, so let's fix it' attitude. The two main goals seem to be control foreign residents and to generate revenue.

Soon after that, schools start hurting for foreign teachers who are unable or unwilling to go through the bureaucratic hassles and costs to set up in that country. That's when the ESL/EFL websites and recruiters come out of the woodwork followed by the TEFL certification industry. Teachers risk getting screwed by the recruiters. Some do, post their experience on the internet and even more stay away. Then everybody's left scratching their heads. "Why can't we get good-quality foreign teachers to come and teach at our school? Why do the ones we get disappear when their contract is over or even before?" Maybe we should make it more difficult for them to work in our country? Maybe we should demand higher qualifications? Yeah, maybe that'll solve our problems...

[garlic and basil]

"a free agent can be a bad thing, you realize."

I'll put it this way. For 20 years I have run my own businesss, self-employed salesman, service business with employees (all immigrants making some cash on the side), videographer working for a foreign compnay, personal assistant for a millionaire who ahd me traipsing all over the planet for his personal and business needs. So whenever i have been between freeman jobs teaching English has always been a hassle. it's a lot of work for not a lot of pay (when you add up the hours and emotional energy expended). I've never banked in my own country for decades, nor asked for anything from my government - never wanted medical insurance or any perks from the state, any state - I'll pay my own way.

No health care payments by your employer (because you work for yourself).

See above. besides unless I'm hit by a truck I use TCM and ayurveda. I believe that except for emergency treatments the pharamceutical industry and medical industry is a big con and does more harm than good. Don't want it.

> No guarantee of union protection (because you don't belong to one,

I don't support unions.

> nor do you sign a contract that specifies your work conditions)

We negotiate terms, If either of us don't keep our part of the bargain - one of us walks. It's called the free market. A contyract neen't be making anyone a slave it's explicit terms of doing business between equals.

> How has it been difficult to "exit the country" in the places you have lived?

Hmm, I must have missed something here. i just mea free (or low cost) movement between countries. It is my take that nation-states do not own the country, the people do. And they are not the government. Passports are a con designed to control people's movements.

> Just go to the airport. If you want to return and keep a visa, get a reentry permit. If you see such permits and visas as bureaucracy, so be it, but they are there for a reason and are not big hassles UNLESS YOU ARE UNQUALIFIED.

White face, native speaker, three years experience teaching ESL in both East and SE Asia. Some basic TOESL certification. The best teachers are not paper collectors they hve learned through the school of hard knocks.

> Which raises a point. What are your qualifications?

See above.

[garlic and basil]

My keyboard switched to devanagari (script for Hindi!).

It seems that 20 years ago one could be very unqualified and get plenty of work in Korea and Taiwan. In Cambodia 10 years ago the same was the case.

Wages and opportunities have GONE down as far as I tell - I mean all over the planet.

I am simply asking which countries are good opportunities for adventurers seeking good wages. I don't care if it's Inner Kingdom of Slobovia with civil war, horrible food, ugly women, six feet of snow in the summer, and an insane monarch. If the wage is $20+ an hour and the government and gangsters stay out of your face I'll move there.

But here's what I find instead...

Top paying countries with plenty of regulations and high standards

Low paying countries with fewer and lesser respectively.

medium countries medium.

which oddball countries where nobody wants to go are desperate for native speakers. Locals can teach grammar and all that. Only native speakers can teach intonation, rythm, natural usage etc.

I would expect that the best countries to teach in would be Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Hellholes with military instability and otherwise hellholes. Problem is finding those with money to spend.

And to those who say this is a fantasy - I did it in 1994, Everyone was afraid to go to Cambodia. So wages were $16 an hour, almost anything went there and then. The Americans and international NGOs hadn't taken over the country (although UN soldiers for a while drove up prices).

Kosovo?
Democractic Republic of Congo?

For me it's all about money and freedom. I'm an ESL soldier of fortune. It needn't be schools - teaching businessmen would be better.

[Bebsi]

We are now in 2005, it's no longer the 60s and the world has changed dramatically.

Wages and conditions have gone down for two reasons: there are more and more people in TEFL, many with qualifications (a fair amount of which are utter rubbish, but which are taken seriously by third-world employers/clients) and many more without qualifications who are very happy to work for almost nothing.

Many of us in this business, as in any business, have lots of quals and experience, and we voluntarily subject ourselves to restrictions in order to get a better package. God knows, there are enough insultingly inadequate packages around the place.

Was it Plato who said that in order to have rights, we must also have responsibilities?

You may possibly accuse us of prostituting ourselves, for financial or other gain. I would disagree, but even if we WERE prostituting ourselves, at least we are consenting adults who do it willingly. This would be in stark contrast to those young children who find themselves involved in child-prostitution and paedophiliac circles, in places like the free- and unfettered Cambodia that you appear to idolise.

Incidentally, given the vast experience that you appear to have in various fields, why do you choose TEFL if you agree that it is, relatively speaking, not as lucrative as many of the other fields you appear to have worked in? Just extremely curious!!

I am not given to preaching or telling others how to lead their lives as, frankly, I have more than enough in my own life to concern me. However, you are the one who came in to this forum seeking what can only be described as Utopia. You sought advice. My advice would be, stop looking for Utopia. If you DO find your idea of Utopia...well, to each his own, I say!!

[Glenski]

garlic and basil,
Your self-imposed independence is admirable in some ways, but you completely ostracize yourself from real-life conditions in many other ways.

Go ahead and pay your own way through life, ignore unions, call pharmaceutical companies a big scam, etc. I totally disagree with you on most counts, and I'm living just fine with a nice income and family.

Go ahead and run your own business, etc. but in places like Japan, that will be difficult if not impossible to get started on, unless you have some experience here first.

I don't know TCM and ayurveda, but you will probably have problems using some private health insurance companies here in Japan.

You negotiate terms, and that's served you well so far. Negotiation is fairly uncommon in Japan. (I'm sure you have seen a pattern so far in what I've written.)

[mick_luna]

is it hard to get a work visa in japan if one has years of ESL experience and uni tutoring experience but no degree? i lean towards japan because when i taught and did journalism in vietnam, i was told (and later experienced personally)that the japanese were the most liberal and friendly in asia, particularly the ones with the high voices and bumpy chests. any helpful feedback on that? i am also a freelance artist and writer, which i imagine would be difficult to do there ?
cheers
mick

[stillnosheep]

Japan: No degree = No 'Specialist in Humanities/International Services' visa (the relevant visa to teach EFL). Govt. rules.

The only way in (unless you are ethnically Japanaese) is on a Working Holiday Visa (if you qualify), a spouse visa, a diplomatic visa etc.

[Glenski]