Job Discussion Forums

[teraysah]

Has anybody taught in both Japan and Korea? I'm looking to teach overseas. Although I love teaching, I would like to be paid as well as possible (of course). My situation is I have about 10 years experience teaching survival English and citizenship to refugees, although my degree was in Sociology. I don't have a TEFL or TESOL certificate but I do have an ESL teaching certification for the state of Arizona. I guess my question is; with that as my resume, what should I expect for pay and benefits? I've heard that Japan has higher pay but usually doesn't provide anything for "extras" whereas Korea does. Is that true?

I'm also 36 years old and married to a non-American would that affect what jobs I could get?

Any help or advice is greatly appreciated!

[Glenski]

I have not taught in Korea. Here is a web site that I usually offer for those who want to compare. Some of the info about Japan is not 100% correct, but it's pretty close.
http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~jonb/

With a degree in Sociology and your experience, you would think you could get a fairly good job here. However the sad news is, unless you have had experience teaching here, you are probably only qualified for entry level jobs in eikaiwa (conversation schools) or on the JET Program. Eikaiwa salaries run about 250,000 to 280,000 yen/month, but be advised that the situation in Japan is in flux right now, such that many employers are trying to get out of providing health care benefits by adjusting work hours so that they pay you less than this amount. Some are just cheapskates and give you FT hours but pay less (170,000 to 220,000). The lower figure there is barely enough for one person to live on.

JET pays 300,000 yen/month and often pays for part or all of your rent.

You have an ESL teaching certification, but do you also have a license for teaching in Arizona? If so, you might have a third option -- international schools. The pay might be the same or slightly better than the above.

[PAULH]

[unsung]

Jobs are freakin' great in both countries.

In short, Korea is the Wild West. I was locked into a hogwon. The pay was great, the hours long and stressful, the air mucky, the students really emotional and the boss a real jerk.

Now I am in Japan. Everything is in slow motion. I don't feel like such a foreigner. Dating a J girl isn't a crime. Sighhhh. I like to be a forbidden fettish. I ride the subway and look at the scenery pass by. My job is part time. I study in a cafe and complain about smokers. Come home and cook my meal. Where are the girls? Everything in Korea happned so fast I was always meeting someone. In Japan people don't even scowl at me.

The cool thing about Korea is that if you stick around and get to know the ropes you can work yourself up the ladder. Eventually you can get a great uni gig with just a BA.

In Japan, everything is easier, more straightforward. Japan people are easier to mix with. In Korea I was always reading on Daves about some guy getting punched in the face.

hard to say what you like, but both countries are completely different..

[pjm]

I have taught in both Japan and Korea. Both offer interesting challenges and rewards. The money to be made in Korea is much, much better than that of Japan. The cost of living in Japan, plane tickets, apartment rental fees and bonus structure mean your income is roughly half of what it would be in Korea. There are also unlimited opportunities to teach privates in Korea for more money than in Japan. If it's about cash there is no debate. You can make a pile more money in Korea than you can in Japan. Personal opion; Korean food is better (more variety), and the eye candy is more plentiful in Korea as well.

[PAULH]

[teraysah]

Thank you! Your responses are VERY helpful.
PaulH-My husband is from Iran. He doesn't care what grunt work he would be doing but he would like to do construction. What do you think?

[PAULH]

[Stosskraft]

[sushi]

I have just come from Korea, and privates are illegal, but everybody does them anyway. If you get caught, then you gotta be one big sucker. Very few get caught,　and if they do it`s probably because they opened their big mouths.

You can do privates from $50-$100 an hour if you play your cards right. There are your average mothers over there and here too who want their kids to have a head start in life, and they are willing to do anything for it. Of course if by chance you do find a parent like that then I am sure you would naturally be willing to bust your arse to help the kid learn. Alternatively many tell the parent that the rate stays the same if you get maybe 4 more kids to join the class.

[may be going]

like others, i have taught in both places. 2.5 years in korea at two univ. and now i'm at a univ. in japan.

as one person pointed out earlier, in many ways the two countries are like chalk and cheese in some aspects. korea is much more hectic, helter skelter, every day is different kind of thing whereas japan - thus far - is pretty cruisy. very predictable, far less madness and far more tolerance on the surface. which for me is great coz i had had a gutful of korea by the time i left.

i enjoy the ease of life in japan. much more western friendly here - depending on where you live of course. it's very easy to cruise along, do your job, have a social life and be relatively obscure in your own little existence.

not so in korea. over there you're in a constant state of alert in regards to what might happen to you or what might happen around you. high highs and low lows are the order of the day in korea. now i enjoy the consistency of japan.

in terms of work, i think korea is the place for saving money. just because private work there is so abundant. as mentioned it is illegal, but everyone does it. and korea tends to be a place that people want to leave after a couple years so they're willing to take the risks involved with privates.

people i know are more content in japan so aren't in the mode of work work work money money money that people tend to be in in korea.

uni gigs are abundant and sweet in korea, especially seoul. and unlike japan, at uni in korea you're only required to be at work for the times you're teaching. meaning you have plent of time for privates.

korea is far, far less tolerant than japan. well perhaps not but in japan you seldom feel on the outer or uncomfortable. any resentment towards foreigners is usually kept behind the stony face, whereas in korea it's a daily thing to cop shite from angry koreans in some way or another. don't know how thick your husband's skin is.

if you're after some quick in out money then i would say korea but if you want some roots for a few years then i would say japan. the longer you're in japan the more you network and create money making opportunities. in korea they are there from day one.

[nomadder]

I had big highs and lows in Japan at times. I think it seems less for the above poster because s/he started in Korea first but culture shock can send you spinning if you've never lived in such a different place before.

[JezzaYouBeauty!!]

I read these forums everyday. And....I haven't posted for a bit. But...I've decided to come back in, for a really lame reason, just for a heck of it.

PJM wrote 'Korean food is better (more variety), and the eye candy is more plentiful in Korea as well.'

Really?

I did meet many a western man who agreed with PJM about the eye candy in Korea.

For me....though....I just didn't see it. I guess, to each his own, huh? But I have been in and around asia quite bit in my life......and seen a bit of eye candy around.

Anyhow, to more serious stuff. In 4 months in Japan I saw one person spit.....in their garden, in fact.

In korea, I'd see a dozen or so spitting incidences a day. A few got a bit too close to me actually.

But today...in Japan...it was all civil and boring as usual. However, a possible future employer told me that they might want me for the job, (even if I'm male, when they really wanted a female)........cos they just rejected the Canadian girl.....cos she was CHINESE-Canadian. And the mothers of the kids didn't want that.......

The same crap like that, goes on in korea, plus the spitting (to me the spitting is a symbol of slightly common aspects of korean behaviour that you might encounter. So to me it represents......the 'gut full' that you may eventually have of korea) But straight off the bat, as a newby to Korea, you might save more than a teacher in Japan who's been there 10 years. I've already met 'decade' dudes in Japan who have a worse deal than what I had in Korea straight away.

To me there's a bigger picture that lies beneath the surface of both countries.....and maybe a lot of asia. Economic juggernauts, yes.....but there is a shallow aspect to things.

I've been in and out of Australia and Asia since birth. I feel I've always been international, and not insular, and not patriotic. I've probably preferred asia actually. BUT............

At least this part of asia can really challenge you. A complete lack of regard for non-discrimination and equal opportunity (as in the canadian girl's case) might throw you off.........in this part of the world.......and in Korea, heck....a bit of spit might land on your face too. But 20 grand U.S., might land in your pocket, after a year there too......

Or back in Australia......you might have depression, divorce & alcoholism in the suburbs, and foul-mouthed, abusive alcoholics, you could experience in one footy much at the MCG, more than what you might experience in a whole year in Korea.

Wish I had the answers. But I don't, so I don't post on here too much anymore.

-Jezza

[malcoml]

[David76]

I've been teaching in South Korea and out of curiosity have been looking at jobs in Japan. The jobs in Japan I have read about (not very many at this point) usually seem to require an intermediate level of Japanese language ability and working at more than one school. Are those jobs typical? If so, I think I'd much rather stay in South Korea.

A few points about teaching in South Korea according to. . . me!:
*SK seems to be better for getting some money saved, but again, I have not taught in Japan. That's just how it looks on paper.
*I did not have to pay for airfare.
*I am interested in traditional Korean music, and have been unable to find lessons in my area. How common is traditional music in Japan?
*I have not really had problems with the Korean people. Maybe the teachers who are reporting bad experiences are in or near Seoul? I don't want to pry too much about where people are located, but maybe we could distinguish between the Seoul area and SK outside of the Seoul area and see if there is a difference in the negative experiences? I am outside of the Seoul area.
*The South Korean people have not really been a problem for me, but most of the other foreign teachers I have met here seem to be rotten human beings. This is not an attempt to start a flame war; read on. . . Again, this is based on my personal experience and the foreign teachers I have met in person. I have not met anywhere close to the majority of foreign teachers here, so this probably does not mean you. I realize that many South Koreans seem to have a sort of Hangook supremacy thing, and I can see how that might cause some problems. Not to blame some who might have been victimized, but is there perhaps a chance that some (not all, but some) of the foreign teachers reporting problems might have done something to provoke the natives?

All in all, even though I am curious about Japan and would like to stay away from most of the other foreign teachers I have come across here in South Korea, I think I'd rather stay here than go to Japan if the jobs in Japan I asked about near the beginning of this post are typical.

I forgot to mention the illegal private lesons others have mentioned. I do not think they are nearly as common as some people make them seem. You can probably save somewhere in the vicinity of 15,000,000 won (about US $14,500) without much trouble here in a year legally working about 30 hours a week. Why risk ruining that with private lessons unless you are desperate or greedy?