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coming soon
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 47
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 Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 3:07 pm Post subject: Web International School- Suzhou |
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Hi, this is a bit different since I'm not interested in working for that school but I have a friend in Suzhou who is really interested in taking classes there. I browsed through their website but it's mainly in Chinese.
I was wondering if anyone who had actually taught there could comment on the school and their curriculum.
Cheers n beers. |
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Babala
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 1303
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 9:35 am Post subject: |
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Hey, I work at Web so I can tell you how it works.
There are 2 kinds of classes, privates and salons. Private classes have 4 students or less and the student is required to do work on the computer software first and then get at least 80% on the level test before they are able to book the class. Private classes cover grammar, questions from the computer work and then we teach new vocabualry and do some activities dealing with the topic (we cover topics such as schedules, directions, food etc). Salons classes require no computer work and have 10 students or less. They work a little like a structured EC with about 3 activities. All classes are 1 hour in length. There are also 2 EC's a day which all students may attend without booking. My boyfriend attended Web for 3 months and I really saw an improvement, especially in his grammar. He really liked Web. He then changed cities and attended EF and he was really disappointed with the school and the textbook. Any other questions, just let me know. I would reccomend Web to students. |
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edwinagirl
Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 68
Location: beijing
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 6:11 am Post subject: |
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Babala,
How much did your boyfriend spend for his 3 months of study? |
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Babala
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 1303
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 6:54 am Post subject: |
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| I have to admit, my boss let him study there for free. |
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coming soon
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 7:16 am Post subject: |
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| I believe that my friend is going to pay about 4000 RMB for their 3 months program. |
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Babala
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 1303
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 7:51 am Post subject: |
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| That sounds about right. Web prices vary a bit from city to city but that's about standard. |
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edwinagirl
Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 68
Location: beijing
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 9:23 am Post subject: |
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| Er, is that your boyfriend in the photo? Not a bad looking fellow! |
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Babala
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 1303
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:58 am Post subject: |
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| edwinagirl, I wish!!!! My boyfriend is cute but not this hot. The guy on my avator is actually Takeshi Kaneshiro, famous 1/2 Chinese 1/2 Japanese actor from Taiwan. |
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shonisan
Joined: 23 Sep 2005
Posts: 338
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| Posted: Sun Sep 25, 2005 4:52 am Post subject: |
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| Babala wrote: |
| Hey, I work at Web so I can tell you how it works. |
Interesting.
I have been working at the Suzhou Web International since February and, since there were only male instructors, I can only assume you are either 'office staff', a Chinese tutor or a person who drops in occasionally to do the odd English corner.
I can also tell you that of the instructors who started there in the year sice it started in August of last year, only Jim McGeough, the head teacher (working with an 'F' visa, LOL) is the only one who remains.
While the concept of Web is sound and students do show improvement, the environment is highly unstable.
There are a lot of 'scams' being operated within this franchise of the Respected Web chain of schools which have resulted in a high turnover of not only foreign but Chinese staff as well.
The School administrator, Jane, does not speak much English and secludes herself in the back of the school preferring to buffer herself with the managers.
From February until now, the actions of Jane on behalf of the Shaghai investors have resulted in the loss of 4 managers and some excellent teachers.
They have recently had to 'make do' with hiring 'F' visa teachers on a part time job sharing basis meaning the quality of the teaching is going to get hit very hard.
Some of the problems are:* students using Guanxi to be placed at higher levels than they are qualified for. This results in them disrupting classes because of the extra help they need.
* Classes that begin and end on the hour meaning if you have to urinate you have to be in THREE places at once instead of two.
* Teachers who think they have a contract with the school are surprised to find their contracts invalid because the management refuses to 'red stamp' them.
* The local school is actually unable to issue visas so visas are coming out of the Shanghai office and with some strange Guanxi arrangement, have them validated with the local PSB.
* Teachers are forced to fight each month for their wages and have to submit a minimum of 1,500 yuan in fapiao to get their housing allowance. (Amazingly this amount is then paid in cash ... nudge nudge wink wink ... and not into the teacher's bank account along with the salary)
* Flight allowances that are paid as salary and not as an allowances so you are taxed meaning your 3,500 becomes 2,800.
I could go on, but I won't
I think the thing that finally did it for me after several months of teaching with this school was when the newest manager decided to take a hardline approach with the teaching staff and stated to me and I quote:
| Quote: |
| In English, you have a saying, "When in Rome, do as the Romans do. You all need to act more Chinese now and accept what we give you." |
So yes, if you want your friend taught at extremely high fees for direction by a group of people who are part time and working with an 'F' visa instead of 'Z' visas, go right ahead.
There are better places around. |
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Babala
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 1303
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Sun Sep 25, 2005 7:12 am Post subject: |
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shonisan,
I never said I worked at the Suzhou Web, I said I worked at Web and I do. I work at the Changzhou Web which is under different ownership then the Suzhou Web. I am sorry to hear of all the troubles at your school but this is not how all Webs are run. |
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shonisan
Joined: 23 Sep 2005
Posts: 338
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| Posted: Sun Sep 25, 2005 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Babala wrote: |
shonisan,
I never said I worked at the Suzhou Web, I said I worked at Web and I do. I work at the Changzhou Web which is under different ownership then the Suzhou Web. I am sorry to hear of all the troubles at your school but this is not how all Webs are run. |
While I appreciate what you are saying, please realize that this person was asking about the Suzhou school in particular. The Web format is, in theory, commendable.
I was the last teacher to be put through the training in Shanghai with Greg from this school for example. The six subsequent teachers have not been through the training. I think the investors think the training is a waste of money.
I realize that the franchises are all different although they teach the same format however this Web International in particular is peeling back all the Web Standards to the bare minimum and sacrificing quality.
The head teacher is known for forgetting to assign homework or completely walking away from the lessons and teaching his own content rather than the assigned curriculum.
This makes it particularly difficult when you encounter the extension lesson about The 10 Worst Polluted Cities and The Social Problems Encountered in Urbanized Centres when the whole lesson is centred around these two questions.
It's not as if we can complain to the Head Teacher ... James IS the head teacher.
By the sounds of things, I would have no problem recommending Chanzhou as a school but be careful using your experience to recommend another location. After all, it was only last December that a Web Owner/Manager did a runner with all the money in the bank accounts and moved out all the furniture overnight forcing all the other schools in Shanghai to teach the locked out students for free. |
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Babala
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 1303
Location: Henan
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| Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:45 am Post subject: |
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Point taken and I understand. How's this, I would recommend both the Wuxi and the Changzhou Web. I have worked at both and they are under the same ownership.
shonisan,
It's interesting that you have a head teacher. Neither one of the Webs I have worked at do. |
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juliagirl
Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 69
Location: California
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| Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 11:26 am Post subject: |
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Can someone tell me more about Web in Shanghai???
Thanks~ |
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halroach
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 43
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 3:37 am Post subject: |
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I disagree that the Web approach is fine 'in theory'. It is nothing of the sort. The multi-media thing is the flavor of the month all across China, but it is driven by the needs of the school owners, not the needs of the learners.
This method began in the 70s as an extension fo the audio-lingual approach. Learners sat in huge language labs (ouch!) until they were tested by a native speaker. There was no teaching goinm on. (Testing is not teaching.) It was pure behaviorism and behaviorism has been thoroughly descredited as a learning theory. To this day there is very little teaching going on in Web or the other multi-media schools - there's just that testing.
It is this combination of reconstructed behaviorism, plus a business model designed to drive short-term revenues (one year tuition, paid in advance) that makes it so attractive to the owner, but so risky to he learner. In Spain, Wall Street (the originators of the approach) have gone from 150 schools in 2002, to 17 now. Their competitors Opening and Brighton have also gone bankrupt. In Europe, multi-media is out. Now, in China, Canilx have gone bankrupt. Wall Street have been losing in the millions for the last few years. Their value drops as they are bought and sold, but it won't save them. Web will soon follow suit.
Babbala says her boyfriend inmproved his grammar at Web. His grammar? If there's one thing Chinese do not need is more grammar. She is dating him so his speaking shoudl have improved anyway, but she says it is his grammar that improved. What would it normally cost someone to study several months in order to improve his grammar?
It amazes me that people do not see through this. |
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shonisan
Joined: 23 Sep 2005
Posts: 338
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 4:11 am Post subject: |
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| halroach wrote: |
I disagree that the Web approach is fine 'in theory'. It is nothing of the sort. The multi-media thing is the flavor of the month all across China, but it is driven by the needs of the school owners, not the needs of the learners.
This method began in the 70s as an extension fo the audio-lingual approach. Learners sat in huge language labs (ouch!) until they were tested by a native speaker. There was no teaching goinm on. (Testing is not teaching.) It was pure behaviorism and behaviorism has been thoroughly descredited as a learning theory. To this day there is very little teaching going on in Web or the other multi-media schools - there's just that testing.
It is this combination of reconstructed behaviorism, plus a business model designed to drive short-term revenues (one year tuition, paid in advance) that makes it so attractive to the owner, but so risky to he learner. In Spain, Wall Street (the originators of the approach) have gone from 150 schools in 2002, to 17 now. Their competitors Opening and Brighton have also gone bankrupt. In Europe, multi-media is out. Now, in China, Canilx have gone bankrupt. Wall Street have been losing in the millions for the last few years. Their value drops as they are bought and sold, but it won't save them. Web will soon follow suit.
Babbala says her boyfriend inmproved his grammar at Web. His grammar? If there's one thing Chinese do not need is more grammar. She is dating him so his speaking shoudl have improved anyway, but she says it is his grammar that improved. What would it normally cost someone to study several months in order to improve his grammar?
It amazes me that people do not see through this. |
Interesting that you would assume that the computerized model of learning would not improve over a 35 year period.
I guess writing will never catch on because it washes off the slate.
Let's review some of the things that were not around in the '70s:
Voice recognition that will record a speaker and compare the sample to a native sample model for increasing the accuracy of pronunciation. The student can drill as long as they like without the constraints of class times.
Randomization with progressive difficulty levels a la the methods currently used to instruct Engineers for Novel Netware Certification (for example).
Emphasis on the spoken word and visual cues rather than the written word improving comprehension in the vocal and real world rather than just the printed page.
In other words, these people know English. They have all been placed in the category of 'dumb English by the vastly inefficient school system here.
What web does is move the knowledge they already have to voice and visual centres.
Sure the model fails in Spain. They are learning the language cold; from the beginning.
Now surely you are aware of the phenomena known as Chenglish. Why would you make a statement regarding the use of grammar in a spoken situation? |
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