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Zarny
Joined: 03 Sep 2005
Posts: 14
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 Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 8:16 am Post subject: REDSOXFAN |
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| I am definitely a redsoxfan on the Callan Method. I am not experienced in teaching like most of the teachers in this forum, but hey, i deserve a say:) I honestly think that any kind of method that can teach someone or improve someone's skill of learning another language is great. It obviously works for a lot of students to gain a lot of knowledge of english language which can help them in their future endeavours even if it is the Callan way:) Each to their own, A lot of you disagree with this method, but if it works for at least 1 student its a success, better than 0. May not develop you as a teacher personally but i am sure it develops the students in some way, Go Callan go. |
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expatben
Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 214
Location: UK...soon Canada though
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| Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:15 am Post subject: |
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I am an ex Callan teacher but I have taught other methods. I wonder without being insulting how many others can say the same?
I will say this though, not so much in defence of the Callan Methode but in defence of the Callan teachers I think it is unfair how they are ostrosized by many other ESL teachers. Being an ex Callan teacher I know many who teach the methode and even some who like it. I do not think them to be lazy of unethical. They have their teaching methods and I have mine.
XPat |
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zippy2k
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 42
Location: Riyadh
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| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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| "Coming from" was not listed as a phrasal verb because it is not a phrasal verb. It is simply the use of the verb "come" with a preposition. Dictionaries of phrasal verbs list phrasal verbs which are phrases; they don't list every possible permutation of verbs and prepositions. Why can't I say, "OK, I'll be a bit late, because I'm coming from work now."? Also, Callan uses "but" to reinforce that there is a contrast between two ideas. It's slightly awkward, but again, details |
I disagree - "come from" could otherwise be said "orginate". It is a phrasal verb in my view and listed as such in Collins and other phrasal verbs dictionaries because it is the standard format of verb+particle and usage is instead of one verb word for certain circumstances.
Of course they dont list every possible permutation, just the most used ones...
Who do you know that says"I'm coming from work now"? Nobody I have ever met does, not even Callan students...I'm concerned with teaching people natural English that people speak... Of course you can say whatever you like and probably find examples of it on the 'net. That doens't mean its considered correct. I simply pointed out to the organisation that main and recognised texts like Collins dictionaries don't recognise this usage. In fact the Callan org. responded saying it had been verified by someone from Oxford with an MA in linguistics and, more tellingly, if I didnt like it, go elsewhere.
On the "but" question, the Callan sets out usage of but instead of the more natural use of italics and word stress that would make the phrase sound less like a foreigner speaking it, ie
"Its not a pen but it is a pencil". Of course this is still a bit unnatural and the more natural response is
"Its not a pen, its a pencil" or "its a pencil". etc....
I explained all this to the director of the Callan school where I was offered a job. He listened to me, agreed, and let me teach using the Callan text but omitting the weird stuff they set out as normal English. In fact he thanked me for my advice. |
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Alex Shulgin
Joined: 20 Jul 2003
Posts: 553
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| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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| I must admit that I like the Callan method. As long as there is Callan I will never be short of students. |
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redsoxfan
Joined: 18 Oct 2005
Posts: 178
Location: Dystopia
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 11:00 am Post subject: |
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zippy2k wrote:
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I disagree - "come from" could otherwise be said "orginate". It is a phrasal verb in my view and listed as such in Collins and other phrasal verbs dictionaries because it is the standard format of verb+particle and usage is instead of one verb word for certain circumstances.
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In the sense of "to originate" it is a phrasal verb, but Callan did not use "come from" in that sense, ie. Where do babies come from? Maybe in Boston we speak wicked-weird-or-somethin'-dude, but I still don't see why "I'm coming from work now" is odd. For example, if you're giving directions to someone and you are trying to ascertain his location, you might ask, "Which direction are you coming from, north or south?" or "Are you coming from home or are you already in the center?" Maybe I'm wicked-retaaaarrrded-dude, but I don't see why this strikes you as strange. Would you rather say, "What is your point or origin?" or "From where are your travels originating?"
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Of course they dont list every possible permutation, just the most used ones...
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I'm looking in my phrasal verbs dictionary now, and it doesn't list "come in" for example. This is because it is not a "phrase" but rather the use of
"come" with a preposition. Likewise, it doesn't list "come from" because it is so obviously common that it is not a phrase, idiom, saying or figure of speech.
| Quote: |
On the "but" question, the Callan sets out usage of but instead of the more natural use of italics and word stress that would make the phrase sound less like a foreigner speaking it, ie
"Its not a pen but it is a pencil". Of course this is still a bit unnatural and the more natural response is
"Its not a pen, its a pencil" or "its a pencil". etc.... |
Callan uses "but" in this context in perhaps only the first stage, probably to avoid confusion with absolute beginners. Sometimes they answer, "It's not a pen, it's a pencil." No one is under the impression that they would continue to speak this way normally, but for the first few classes, perhaps it is useful to demonstrate contrast. Either way.
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I explained all this to the director of the Callan school where I was offered a job. He listened to me, agreed, and let me teach using the Callan text but omitting the weird stuff they set out as normal English. In fact he thanked me for my advice.
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Every Callan teacher I've worked with speaks excellent English. When they come across an occasional word which is outdated, they just change it. It's annoying, but hardly a problem. Such words are already crossed out and changed in the teachers' books, so in effect the method has already been revised at our school. Anyway, your comments at best suggest that the method needs a revision, which I've already acknowledged, but to dismiss the whole method on these grounds is just throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I hate that phrase, incidentally, and I do believe this is the first time I've used it. Thanks for making me use such an annoying idiom. Another idiom I despise is "play it by ear." That one really gets my goat.
alex shulgin wrote:
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| I must admit that I like the Callan method. As long as there is Callan I will never be short of students. |
I suppose that students who've studied by any method for a year and a half would need further practice before they achieve absolute fluency in a language.
Last edited by redsoxfan on Mon Nov 07, 2005 2:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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gregoryfromcali
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 1207
Location: People's Republic of Shanghai
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| Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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It sounds like you're both saying that Callan teachers should play it by ear.
Did I get your goat?
I don't like the goat one, but I do like, "Don't have a cow."
I got to run, I am coming from work now.  |
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