Job Discussion Forums

[Davidos]

Hi,

Youve probably had this one before. I have taken a degree a long time ago in london but failed. It was a relevant degree(languages) for teaching english abroad . Since then Ive acquired eight years experience as an adult tutor( motivational, vocational) with an NVQ adult tutors certificate for two charities in Bristol, U.K. I also have a very useful assessment certificate NVQ which concentrated on learning needs assessment. Ive dealt with people looking for work in the U.K. from all cultures and walks of life ,some with very little command of english and encouraged/assisted them with CVs and interview skills training. For the last two years Ive been Esol tutoring part-time in New Zealand gaining . Home tutors awards and a Trinity cert TESOL. Ive completed evening classes in Esol(Film and Drama) and thoroughly enjoy this kind of work. I have business skills training as well. I speak french, portuguese and spanish but dont really want to work in Europe.
Is it not possible to get a decent job abroad with what I have but no degree? I'm getting a bit long in the tooth but I travel and communicate well. Any ideas and advice? I want to earn decent money but teachings the thing. Is it a question of going there to find the job? Any help would be very much appreciated .

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

If you go to the thread tiled "why?" then you'll see a discussion of why a degree is necessary (especially if you want to work in countires that pay well enough to save- Japan etc). It would really be better for you to just finish your degree. You say you have "taken a degree". Do you mean you were in the last year before obtaining an undergraduate degree or or the first? What do you mean by "failed"? Are you not allowed to continue at that university any longer? Can you not apply to another uni and apply for transfer credit from the courses you did complete (if any)? If you had difficulty with the subject matter itself (as opposed to just not really working hard enough at it), then two things might help:

1. It is a LOT easier to absorb university level material when you are a bit older than when you have are a teenager (although after being out of school for a long time, it can take some time to get back into thinking like a student)
2. Maybe if you switched majors you could do something that you are both interested in, and suits your manner or learning better. Linguistics is highly relevant to teaching ESL, and because it is more theoretical than languages, it may be easier for you to achieve higher grades in it (University foreign language courses seem to often be about grammatical accuracy and teaching discrete grammatical points rather than communication- maybe because it's eaier to mark). On the other hand, English degrees are often requested by overseas schools, even though for the most part, English degrees from English-language universities in English language countries are literature degrees that aren't really very relevant to teaching EFL.

I'm Canadian (from Ontario- each province has its own education system) so maybe my post-secondary system is different from yours, but where I'm from, it isn't uncommon for people to change majors or even transfer schools. I switched schools (started in interdisciplinary fine arts- almost everyone changed out of that major then) and at the new school changed my major once (switched from double majors in Music History/French to Music History/ English).

From switching schools I only lost one and a half courses out of eight and when I switched majors I lost nothing at all, although with all the courses from the previous school and the time spent in French, I ended up not having any electives at all in my last few years- I don't mind, I really enjoyed and got a lot out of the courses that filled my elective slots, although if I had started out in the school I eventually graduated from in the major I eventually graduated with, then I could have used my electives to get a minor in another subject- and so would probably know more French, or history or whatever I minored in, and far less about all the other things I studied).

[Cdaniels]

Forgive me if I'm missing the obvious, but are you a Native English Speaker, Davidos? It may not seem fair, but often schools want speakers whose first language is English even more than degree-holders.

[Davidos]

Thanks to gambate and c daniels. I took a 3 year degree at north london poly in the 70s. a ba general it was called with english and french and spanish coming into it . i finished the course but failed some of the final exams. I dont know about transfer of credits in the U.K. I know of accredited prior learning. I just dont want to slog away again for 3/4 years as a student .But I take in what you said. Yes I am a native speaker with good networking skills and a profound love of my language. Does it depend on how you present yourself then?
I mean, for instance your written and verbal communication abilities and relevant experience?

Thanks again (dont wanna be boring but I needs to know)

[JDYoung]

Schools may take life experience and personal interest into account but government departments who issue the appropriate residence and/or work visas/permits won't. The requirement of a degree is primarily a government one, depending on the country, rather than an employer one. Sorry, but them's the breaks.

[Super Mario]

China, by law, requires a degree.
However, if you wave a bunch of parchments in various faces, particularly the Trinity TESOL, you'll have no trouble finding a position. I'm sure you'll do a better job than many of those with degrees, not to mention those with fake qualifications.

And yes, before someone jumps down my throat, I know this advice is unethical. But where do ethics get you in the PRC?

[Riddick]

I would have to agree with "Super Mario"

I have come to understand that many agents in China will give you a copy degree for 100RMB if you sign up with them in order to find work.

[Volodiya]

It is possible to work, lawfully, in China without a degree.

The shortage of teachers in China is such that, for those willing to work in the less popular places, full documentation to live and work in China is offered to FTs who do not meet the minimum, statutory norms- which are a bachelors degree, and two years teaching experience.

This is nothing illegal, unethical nor anything else other than local authorities exercising their right to waive requirements in the face of the acute needs of schools in their areas.
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To complete the picture, it can be said that many work without full documentation, in China; and, just possibly, some others have faked their qualifications, just as said, or implied, by the previous posters.