Job Discussion Forums

[kai]

Hi everyone,

Sorry for the grammatically flawed but necessarily concise title. Admittedly, I recently stumbled upon this wonderful resource and have spent the last two nights doing my best to use the search engine and lurk like any good forum newbie should. In fact, I've found quite a few nuggets like...

http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewtopic.php?t=4231&highlight=shanghai

However, given the time I have left before I ship out, I hope you all won't mind me begging your hospitality and asking some questions specific to my situation that I hope have not already been asked too often before.

I'm a 24 year old pseudo-ABC, meaning I was actually born in Taiwan but was imported over to the states by the wee age of three and spent most of my life in the stars and stripes. As such, I never learned Chinese. Given that I generally speak Chinese (Mandarin) at home with my family, I perhaps possess intermediate conversational Chinese but I cannot read or write. Another way of putting it is that I can probably scrape by but I speak just enough to get frustrated with my limited ability to express the more complex thoughts I have. Those knowing my background consider my Chinese speaking ability to be impressive but native speakers who do not, would probably feel the same way I do: I sound stupid.

So, I'm committing a year or two to studying Chinese in China (whoa). After some referrals and good reviews, I chose to enroll in the Chinese language program at East China Normal University (ECNU) in Shanghai. The choice of city is definitely related to easing my own culture shock from Western to Asian and all the small (and large) creature comforts that it entails. The plan is to emerge with enough Chinese skill to feel good about myself as a bona-fide Chinese person and read a newspaper.

I grew up mostly in the suburbs of Los Angeles and graduated to attend my undergraduate at the University of California, Berkeley. There, I graduated with a Bachelor's Degree in Legal Studies. Work experience includes restaurant retail, sales, marketing, finance, and legal. Overall, my English is probably above-average. Of course, that speaks little as to my English TEACHING ability, but that's what we'll find out, right?

I'll be staying in the dorms, which is already pricey enough, but I figure being on-campus and around other students will maximize my chances of making new friends and immersing myself in the language so I can develop faster. That said, I'm still looking to help support myself financially by taking on a part-time job. Maybe its just my idealism but I figure teaching the natives English would work well. Having perused this forum and other websites, I'm tragically aware of how shady this language business can be in general, which is one of the reasons I felt slightly more comfortable enrolling in a school rather than some random language center for Chinese. The same appears to apply to English as well of course.

The above was meant to give you an idea of where I'm coming from, my background, and who I am. Given that I'll be studying myself, I figure I'll only have part-time availability.

1. Would teaching English be feasible with my schedule?

2. If there are better alternatives for supporting oneself, any suggestions?

3. Since I live at ECNU, should I apply to teach English there?

4. In a search, I read that the foreign affairs department won't be helpful in helping me secure a job. When I visited the school to check it out, I found this to be the case as well as they advised that it would be hard for me to get a job teaching English because I look Chinese and am not white. (wow, that sucks) Does this hold true for others? Is the color of my skin going to diminish my chances despite being a native, educated, degreed English speaker?

5. What department should I seek out for better chances?

6. Some posts said 5000RMB should be the minimum monthly salary. Others disagreed. Some said there are new regulations fixing the salaries that public schools can offer. Someone said they were offered 7500RMB but only 4000-5000RMB if they lived on campus housing. Since I'll be dorming, would that entitle me to the full amount were I fortunate enough to get 7500RMB? What could I reasonably expect as a part-time student and thus teacher with my credentials?

7. Or, should I offer myself up for private English tutoring/practice? I get the sense that most Chinese students are seeking conversational practice with Chinese teachers actually teaching the formal subject matter. This sounds like it'd work just dandy for me. What is the supply/demand market like amongst students at a place like ECNU? Would it be as simple as posting up a bulletin or flyers advertising my services? I do remember seeing some tourism students post a flyer looking to trade their expertise for English practice.

8. What is a reasonable rate (hourly?) to charge for private tutoring/practice services? I imagine it would be fairly informal and times to meet would be arranged between the student and I, right? Maybe there is a range people have experienced? Any personal testimony to what I can expect as far as demand and expectable income from such?

9. I posted here because I'm a "newbie." Should I repost this in the China forum?


Whew, long post, huh? Sorry. The specifics are above but in general I'll be in Shanghai to learn how to read/write Chinese and I'd like be able to make some money helping Chinese people with their English skills. I know its possible, but I'd humbly appreciate any specific guidance any of you experienced folk may have. If I can clarify or provide you with more information, just let me know. I'll be on the forums. My semester starts mid-February and I hope to fly out there by early February.

Thanks!

[Super Mario]

At a rough guess, your visa category would preclude you from paid employment, which is why your FAO doesn't want to know. Formal teaching is out of the question.
On the other hand, yes it can be done. Some casual language mill work involving evening and weekend classes might be the way to go. Many of these outfits lack legality, not to mention scruples. Demand cash in hand after every class. Check the notes carefully.
Yes, your "banana" status will make things more difficult, but not impossible.
Tutoring is another option. One of my former Shanghai students makes a full time living tutoring English to Taiwanese in Shanghai. She began with a few students while still at Uni, then word spread. See if you can make some connections in the OS Chinese community. Tutoring is best done with 2 or 3 students in a private home. 50 rmb/student/hour would be reasonable.

So, two options, both of which should be carried out discreetly, especially the language mill one. Expect to be deported if busted.

To get some ideas, trawl the classifieds at: www.shanghaiexpat.com also www.expatsh.com has lots of teaching small ads.
A Google search should yield further resources.

BTW, Roger will have a conniption if he reads this.

PS Getting a work [Z] visa first, and then studying part time would be quite legal. You just need to find a Shanghai based employer licensed to employ foreigners. Try one of the chains.

[kai]

Ah, that makes a lot of sense. I must've taken for granted that students are allowed to work to help support themselves through their education and had forgotten that visas may preclude that.

So, to teach formally like many of the individuals on this board, I'd have to be offered employment, secure the appropriate visa, and then enroll to study Chinese. I assume the work visa allows one to be a student as well?

Given that the course of events already in motion would make it difficult to reverse and redirect my course, I suppose my best option now is to find informal prviate tutoring arrangements, switching cash on hand with the actual students themselves. Kinda like a lot of tutoring arrangements in the states, all under the table. I'm fine with that and only hope I can find some students who'd be interested. Would posting up fliers around campus like the other students be too risky in attracting attention to my informal operations?

Thank you, Super Mario.

[Super Mario]

There are many internet sites that are Shanghai based, both in English and Chinese. Probably some Taiwanese expat sites too: there's a lot of TW business people in SH with families.
Once you're on the ground, some small ads just giving your details [stressing the nationality and native speaker factors] and email might be the way to go.
Once your foot's in the door, building a client base shouldn't be too hard, as long as you're doing a good job.

[bdawg]

Kai, I was in a similar situation last semester. I studied at Nanjing Normal University on an F-Visa. I needed to work to eat so I held down a full-time job at a local middle-school (attached to Nanjing Normal). They didn't care about my F-Visa...in fact they preferred hiring foreign students as they came complete with their own visas, thus removing the burden of obtaining a Z-visa for an imported teacher. This is not legal, but I suppose everyone was taking the mindset that it was a 'victimless' crime.

This was in Nanjing, Shanghai is probably different.

I would say tutoring is probably the best option for earning some side clams. It gives you a bit more freedom in regards to scheduling and you don't have to worry about wasting time on examinations and discipline.

[kai]

Thanksm, bdawg.

How did you get your job at the local middle school and what was your experience like (or if you've related it elsewhere, perhaps a link would be great)?

Does anyone have any idea what private tutoring would be like? As in, what sort of help they seek. I've read that a lot of the time, they just want to practice their conversational ability. I know this is broad, but does anyone have any anecdotes or commentary for this?

Thanks yet again.

[Super Mario]

Depends on the age and ability of the students. If they're at school [ie, 7-22!], they're probably looking for ways to top their English class, so will want to go through their school work.
However, you have to try to make it fun! They put up with enough drudgery already.
My best tutorial groups were management/professional types. Their English was quite good, they were interested in conversation around economic/current affairs type issues, and they saw the language as important to advancing in their jobs.
With the younger students, you having reasonable spoken Mandarin will be a big advantage.
You need to thoroughly prepare your materials and having a set routine helps.

[kai]

Thanks Super Mario. In speaking with bdawg over private messages, he said that a lot of students may have enough formal education but require more practice in their use of the language. I expressed that it would be really fun and hopefully extremely practical if my private tutoring involved a lot of "field trips" where we basically go out to somewhere and work with actual situations and places. On top of the Q&As about everyday objects or activities, the whole auditory, visual, and tactile approach could reinforce each other and provide an alternative to using a book and rote-memorization. This is probably counter-intuitive to the teaching methods of Asia and may be more successful with older age groups than younger age groups but any thoughts on its feasibility especailly when I'm hoping to do private tutoring with fellow students at ECNU or whatnot?

=)

[Chris_Crossley]