Job Discussion Forums

[Tracye]

I am 29, and after a few years of meandering through unfulfilling jobs (library, inventory, non-profit, and now, a nanny), I've decided that earning money while seeing a bit more of the world is a great combination. I have read that many teaching jobs start in September (which makes sense), and this actually works quite well for when my current job is supposed to end, and I'd like to use the months of planning time I have wisely.

A little about me: I'm vegan, non-smoking, speak only English and elementary-level Spanish and French (though I know I can't get a job in Spain or France without further qualification), and prefer urban settings. I also generally prefer warmer climates to cold ones, though being in a fun, attractive city is more important than the climate to me. I am also a woman who is not trained in martial arts, and hail from a country (the U.S. of A.) that is pretty unpopular at the moment. Hence, safety is an issue. Then, there's the fact that I only have a B.A.

My first thought was Korea, where jobs seem fairly easy to get. I know I'm not qualified for Japan or Hong Kong. Korea has the advantage of being on the other side of the world, which is somewhere that would be very difficult for me to visit, so being paid to live there seems very attractive. I would be able to see other parts of Asia, I think, and still come home with some savings. Also, South Korea is a democracy with a fairly stable government. (I ruled out China and Thailand because they don't qualify on these counts.) On the downside, I think it would be a huge culture shock for me, and the language seems really challenging.

I had assumed that I was not qualified to teach in Europe, but I now learn that this is not the case. I now see that I can teach in Poland with just a B.A. From what I see, Krakow looks lovely. I think Europe would be less of a culture shock than Asia for me, though learning Polish would still be somewhat challenging. Also, I very much want to see the rest of Europe.

I think it is also possible for me to teach in Hungary, and Budapest seems interesting. I don't think it's quite as easy to get a job there as in Poland, from what I've read, but otherwise, it has the same advantages and is slightly warmer.

What do you think? Should I focus on Korea, Poland, Hungary, or another choice I haven't thought of yet? I'm looking for something reasonably safe, fun, and urban, where I could make decent money and save some of it. Vegan- and nonsmoker-friendly would be a bonus.

[denise]

I don`t have many answers for you, but just a couple of comments--

Regarding seeing more of Europe while you�re living there--I worked in Prague a while back (1999-2001), and while the salary was more than enough to see the country and take a couple of trips outside the country, extensive travel through Western Europe would have been really hard to fund on the salary that I was getting. I`m not sure how much things may have changed since then, but if you`re based in Poland, trips to France, Spain, or Italy might be really hard to afford.

I`m a non-smoking vegan as well. People always tell me I will have such a hard time in (Country X), and while it is generally true that outside of the US, most people smoke and aren�t familiar with a vegetarian diet, let alone a vegan one, you will survive! Don`t let people discourage you--even those "I used to be vegetarian before I came here" people, and there are a lot of them! It does get awkward sometimes, having to constantly explain exactly why you can`t eat 99% of the local/national cuisine, having to turn down invitations, etc., and you may find yourself eating something that you know isn`t vegan just to get people to stop pestering you, but it is doable. I have lived a vegan life in the Czech Republic, Japan, Chile, and now Peru.

Oh, and with a BA, you are qualified for Japan, for basic conversation school jobs.

With your knowledge of Spanish and your preference for warmer climates, have you considered Latin America? It`s not nearly as safe as Asia (or at least Japan, the only country I am qualified to comment on!), and as a single woman I am constantly looking over my shoulder, but so far there have been no problems!

d

[jeffchik]

While my experience in the world is quite limited in comparison to the rest of the members of this board, I do have experience traveling in Europe and living in Korea.

Korea isn't as much of a culture shock as you might expect. The major items you will have to get used to are spicy food and the military stationed there. It is very easy be a vegan there! If you decide to work in one of the major cities, such as Seoul or Pusan, you will be greeted to restaurants from around the world! Avoid 99.9% of the military if you can; they are rude, stubborn, violent, and quite stupid when drinking. Although I was military during my stay in Korea, I still had a chance to teach private lessons. Most of my exapt friends living there would have never had thought that I was military unless they asked me.

Korea is the place to save a decent amount of money. My current girlfriend, who is finishing her third year teaching in Korea, is able to save about $10,000 USD per year.

Travel is fairly cheap to the rest of Asia from Korea, so that is a bonus.

It is nice to see another Pennsylvanian! I am originally from Camp Hill.

[Tracye]

Wow, it's good to know I could possibly get a job in Japan. That's also good to know about pay vs. expense of travel in Eastern Europe. I'm not terribly worried about the vegan thing except that, if I want to eat in restaurants, mastering the native language becomes even more important.

You know, I hadn't really thought much of Latin America, simply because the cities there don't strike me as appealing for the most part, but yes, it would be much easier to brush up on my Spanish than to learn Polish or Korean from scratch. Where in Peru are you living, and are you paid well?

Jeff, I can handle the spice if it can be made vegan! Yes, I've heard that tofu and soymilk are pretty easy to get in Korea, though in restaurants, I hear that you need to be really specific in defining your dietary needs, even listing each animal you don't eat. (I don't eat any, of course.) You are not the first to tell me that anyone working in Korea can save a lot, and yes, this has huge appeal. I'm sure it will take me ages to decide, but I appreciate the useful information from both of you!

[earthmonkey]

A plug for Japan:

Yes, with a BA, any BA, you are qualified to teach in Japan.

As for safety, I live in Tokyo and have never felt safer anywhere. I'm from Portland, Oregon. Walking home from the station after midnight down dark streets, and no worry. I'm a man, but my women friends seem to feel safe as well. Crime is on the rise in Japan, but compared to the U.S. it is still very very low. The only people with guns are the police and the yakuza. The police rarely use theirs and the yakuza only shoot each other.

Tokyo is a great city. I love it. However, the weather is terrible. Being from the Northeast, the winter would seem relatively mild, but the summer is like a sauna, very very humid.

Good luck!

[mezdupa]

I got mugged in Kwangu, South Korea and had men try to break into my apartment when I was in bed, while living in Mokpo.
As a woman, prepare to get stared at, followed home and should you have blue eys and fair skin ( which from your pic, does not seem to be the case ), get ready to walk around the supermarket and get people coming up to you and poke your eyeballs, touch freckles and don;tmind the children in class, should you have boobs! They just like to have a good grope!

Apart from that, the majority of Korean people, are keen to learn and experience new cultures and will spoil you rotten feeding you food which is delicious! Do stay away from sitting down at a family BBQ, that you have been dragged to by strangers, while walking by the water, by green areas, due to the fact they are fascinated by you and do say, " No thank you,"to the raw duck and the raw fish, which has just been caught from the sea, put into mint leaves, lashed with samsjang, washed down with sujji, or else, you like me,could be getting paid a visit from the Herbal Doctor, who shall bring gifts of Gingseng medicine, needles and pills, as you lay daying a death from poisioning!

It is easy to save cash in Korea and accommodation and airfare is provided, which is a plus. Should you chooseto escape from your evil employer and you attempt to leave the country, do be prepared that at the airport, the Customs will ridicule you, demand your ARC card, fine you what cash you have on you and cause you adequate stress by nearly missing your plane as they laugh!

Positive and negative experiences can happen anywhere, but ensure you meet people who can talk your language, because, although fun, like anywhere, Korea can also be a lonely place.

Rant over!

* Awaits to be ousted!*

[denise]

[Jizzo T. Clown]

I don't think I'd rule out China just because they're not a democracy. The government didn't really affect me personally, and most Chinese seem to have a laissez-faire view of government. However, you probably wouldn't be able to save any money...just be able to live high on the hog while you're there!

Japan would be a good option. If you don't speak the language (to be fair, learning survival Japanese is pretty easy), you can always point to what you want in the restaurants. Plus, the cities have all of the comforts of home, so culture shock may not be as bad as in Korea (don't know, haven't been there), and definitely won't be as bad as China!

I know that fruit is very expensive in Japan, but veggies are easy to come by, and the Japanese diet is very healthy.

You should be able to save quite a bit of cash if you curb your spending (my roommate in Osaka sent home $1,000 every month on a NOVA salary), but maybe not as much as if you lived in Korea.

[Super Mario]

I wouldn't write off China either, especially the renegade province of Taiwan, which has the kind of political system and stability you enjoy at home, as well as good pay.

Now, the other thing is, if you could add a PGCE or PGCTESOL while you were working overseas, you'd suddenly become very marketable: in fact, the world would be your oyster, except for Western Europe, which only eats Western European oysters!
Hey, how about a WTO for equal job opportunities?

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

One thing about Japan is that most jobs atually start in late March/ early April (the school year goes according to the fiscal year, not like in North America where it begins in Spetember, or for people in some of the States late, late August-or so I've heard).

Being from America is not unpopular in Japan. People who hail from other countries sometimes get a hard time from some people (including employers) for not being from the US (it happens to me off and on and it's my third year- I'm from Canada and so speak with a North American accent). Japanese people want to learn 'American English' although many/most cannot actually hear the difference between different varieties of English (including the difference between an American and an Australian accent) and so basically just use the passport to decide what kind of English the person speaks. I taught ESL in Canada and it doesn't matter how many times I tell people that teaching ESL in Canada does not mean only teaching English to French Canadians, they simply will not believe me and use that (saying English is much easier for French people to learn than for Japanese people, although they don't speak a word of French and are really only guessing, although it's a pretty good guess) as a reason why they should not listen to anything I say... ever. Instead they ask language questions to Americans who may not know the answer (if it is a question about high level grammar or phonetics or something like that- I studied that type of thing in university for a TESL certificate), who in turn just ask me, and so then I tell the American who in turn tells the Japanese person.

Eikaiwa schools hire year round. Just keep in mind that most of the time for Japan, you need to pay for your own flight over and start up costs etc. so you need several thousand dollars for start up.

If you wanted to become a woman who is trained in martial arts, then Japan (or Korea for that matter) might be a good place to go. However, the schedule at eikaiwa (English conversation schools) generally makes it impossible to participate in clubs except for on your days off (but that's okay because often at eikaiwa your days off will be two individual days in the middle of the week (like Tuesday and Thursday). Generally martial arts clubs (at least in Japan and in my experience) are not like in North America where they run as a busines and are open every day. They tend to be either privately owned and operated only on two or three days a week (and attached to the owners house and almost never open on the weekend, except for prior to tournaments or tests) or else they are at a training hall where other martial arts are scheduled on other days (sort of like at the YMCA, if the YMCA had no other function other than that type of sport)

The exception to paying your own way over is the JET programme but there are a two major drawbacks with it (from what you've written in the original post)

1. It starts at the end of July and the application was due back in November, so you would have to wait almost a full year to just apply (which alone should put it out of the running).
2. Most JETs are in rural placements, regardless of their listed preference (just because that's where the positions are).

ETA

The winters may be mild (I lived in Ottawa for two years in a house with single pane windows) but because there isn't any insulation it gets pretty cold inside. Instead of going outside where it's just ridiculously freezing, and then going inside where it's warm, you go outside where it's somewhere between cool and a bit cold to inside where it's anywhere from 3 degrees warmer than outside to (in the morning) a few degrees colder. Getting up in an apartment that is only five degrees Celcius (you can see your breath) to get ready for work in a school that will likely be the same temperature can wear you down a bit (especially if your water pipes froze overnight because you forgot to leave them slightly on and so you end up taking a cold water shower- yay pneumonia!!! ).

[m2adam]

hi MaryBeth 24 Ontario Canada
I'm having trouble deciding where to travel also. you do have an advantage actually to have a BA, in what field by the way? that might be an issue as to your opportunities. I noticed that you haven't mentioned Taiwan? you might want to look into it, there seems to be plenty of demand. I am also hoping to leave this year late aug, but not much can be done until a decision is made; and then well the job postings are for the spring term right now. keeping my eyes open.
take care.

[m2adam]

what is PGC? PGSTESOL?
I got my TESOL cert. many years ago and am now getting the chance to travel, have the requirements change much since I took my program in 1999-2000.
and what is WTO?
thanks

[Tracye]

Adam, my B.A. is in English.

I don't like what I'm reading about freezing cold apartments!

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

m2adam,

A PGCE is a Post graduate Certificate in Education. It's the same type of thing as a one year consecutive B.Ed in Ontario.

I could barely understand your first post. And we're both are from Ontario!

[Super Mario]

Post Graduate Certificate in TESOL. Full time one semester course in ESL theory and methodology. Can be done part time and externally. A superior qualification to a CELTA, and later on you could build it to Diploma or Masters in TESOL.