|
Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
luckyloser700
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 308
Location: Japan
|
 Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 11:57 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Zzonkmiles wrote: |
| Oh, and no Japanese person will ever expect you truly understand Japanese and its related nuances. So just relax and see what works and what doesn't when you talk to people. You can't go wrong with learning the plain forms and polite forms and then picking up the slang versions of them as you go. For a beginner, I think being able to say ikimasu, iku, ikimasen, and ikanai are more than sufficient. Worrying about iku wa, iku zo, and iku ze are not really worth it at such a low level. Being able to use the plain and polite forms of 10 verbs properly is far more useful than being able to use 5 different slang or casual forms of only 2 verbs. |
Thank you  |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
luckyloser700
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 308
Location: Japan
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
| kdynamic wrote: |
| The point is you should realize from day one that you can't up and use all the Japanese you hear around you, and that social context is a hugely important part of the language. I don't think it's inappropriate to tell this to a beginner. |
Well said. I don't think it's inappropriate either. I'm just saying that a beginner, with no aspirations of working in a Japanese-only environment right away, can effectively learn grammar and speech appropriate for various social contexts through self-study and going to classes while developing conversational skills with his/her partner. Anyway, everyone's different and having a relationship with a Japanese person isn't always an option. But, for a young person who's just coming here to teach and see what it's like and also wants to pick up some Japanese along the way, the Japanese partner is often a great resource. I agree with you and Paul on the fact that anyone who's serious about staying here for awhile and building a life ought to take the study of the language more seriously than just having chats with his or her SO. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
luckyloser700
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 308
Location: Japan
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| PAULH wrote: |
yes you can make a girlfriend, but common sense will also dictate that if you cant speak japanese and she speaks English which language are you going to communicate in? She will likely speak English to you, and yap in Japanese to her friends. What you pick up is titbits as she talks nine to the dozen in her native language. She wont speak at normal speed if you are a beginner in the language and you may pick up the odd word here and there. |
Well, for a young guy who's not looking for a relationship full of heady conversations (there are plenty of young Japanese girls who want to date foreign guys and aren't that serious about long-term relationships. And, there are lots of foreign guys who see this as a relief), meeting a girl with a minimal English speaking ability can often work to his advantage. Initially, they will use very simple English to have very simple conversations. The relationship will just be about having fun. There's a good chance the immersion factor will take over and his ability to speak simple Japanese will surpass her ability to use simple English. Of course, each case is different, but I've seen this happen quite a bit. I'm only saying this is a good thing for people who aren't concerned with developing more than basic conversational skills in Japanese (which seems to be a large portion of the people who come to work in eikaiwa gakkou). For people who are looking for more in a relationship than just good times and lots of simple conversation, my advice is lousy. I just figured that was obvious.
| PAULH wrote: |
Second I dont know how many women here have the time and inclination to spend hours teaching their boyfrends the intricacies of Japanese grammar, when most have never studied how to teach a language before. Girls I have gone out with and couldnt communicate past two dates. It takes a very special and dedicated lady to tough it out with a gaijin boyfriend who cant speak Japanesea and is prepared to speak japanese instead of English with him. |
I agree. Anyone who's serious about studying the language for the purpose of eventually being able to use it skillfully ought to learn grammar and speech patterns from a book, a class, or a well-qualified private instructor. The girlfriend situation just helps in developing conversational skills. And, you're right. It does take a very special and dedicated lady to tough it out with a gaijin boyfriend who doesn't speak Japanese well but wants to use it solely. But, those ladies are out there. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sallycat
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 303
Location: behind you. BOO!
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 5:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
| PAULH wrote: |
| sallycat wrote: |
e.g bobu ha futatu no ringo wo motte imasu.
e. |
| Quote: |
dude, i can't read that sentence in romanji, either.
i think the hepburn system is the one that uses "tsu" and the kunrei is the one that uses "tu". i'd say hepburn is the best, though i think they still teach kunrei in schools out of national pride.
. |
Bobu is Bob in Katakana. "ha" is the particle "wa" between subject and object. you type 'ha" to get the hiragana. wo is the "o" in Japanese before the verb.
Translation: Bob has two apples. |
yeah, i know  . it's just that if it were written as ボブは二つのりんごを持っています。 i'd be able to read it automatically, whereas even in the heburn system "bobu wa futatsu no ringo o motte imasu" i have to stop and think about it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
