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Brooke Pain
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 31
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 Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 4:29 am Post subject: GEOS/NOVA/AEON/ECC/JET/PKC |
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Really need to know which one would be best.
Not fussed on teaching kids. I have an interview next month for PKC but didnt actually realise there were so many more to choose from!
Please help!  |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 4:34 am Post subject: Re: GEOS/NOVA/AEON/ECC/JET/PKC |
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| Brooke Pain wrote: |
Really need to know which one would be best.
Not fussed on teaching kids. I have an interview next month for PKC but didnt actually realise there were so many more to choose from!
Please help! |
JET program you can only apply once a year and JETs fly out in August. Pay is better on JET than on a conversation school but you will likely be posted in provincial areas.
http://www.jetprogramme.org
To a brand new newbie the big 4 schools are all pretty much the same as each other until you actually get some solid work experience. You wont always get hired by the 'best' school (which is a matter of personal opinion). Get hired first get some experience and then worry about which is the best school once you have got over here.
Read the stickies at the top of this page on working in Japan. |
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Brooke Pain
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 4:41 am Post subject: |
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Thanks heaps Paul, your right it really is a matter of getting accepted first! Cant be too picky!!!
Wish me luck!  |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| Brooke Pain wrote: |
Thanks heaps Paul, your right it really is a matter of getting accepted first! Cant be too picky!!!
Wish me luck! |
It may not be obvious to the new teacher but the schools like NOVA and AEON and GEOS are all in competition with each other for students and warm bodies to teach classes. they recruit from the same labor pool so you are going to find they will offer you pretty much the same deal except in a matter or degree. All schools here have to abide by the labor laws anyway, and after many years of posting on these forums I have found that its not a matter of if one is better than the other, but your personal ATTITUDE to your job, living in Japan and dealing with culture shock etc. the company wont change for you, you have to learn to adjust to your job and surroundings, and how well you deal with that will determine your eventual happiness
Too many teachers blame their employers for things that go wrong, that start and end with the individual person applying for a job.
If you have no experience its almost guaranteed you will go through one of the big schools or go on the JET program. NOVA has about 1000 branches around the country and is the 500 pound gorilla in language teaching in Japan. With no experience you can not afford to be choosey and cherry-pick your jobs.
(Something i posted on another forum but applies to the big chain schools here)
NOVA has its good points and bad points, but my advice is to come here pay your dues, get experience and then look for other jobs. New people moan and whine but for many its the first full time job they have ever had and they are straight out of college. Working at NOVA is what YOU make it and they are not there to entertain you or babysit you.The contract is fairly standard and they are too big to be nickel and diming ind vidual employees.
They lost something like 3 billlion yen last year ($3 million) from opening too many branches and are hurting for cashflow. Most schools are in high traffic areas, prominent locations and they pay a fortune in rent leases. Staff cutbacks are occurring I think they are not hiring so much these days and current teachers are getting more overtime and more work to pick up the slack.
Ignore the negative comments, its just newbies whining and letting off steam and a lot of it is culture shock. You will have good days and bad days (mostly long ones, 6-7 hours of straight teaching) and you will get tired at the end of the day. Teaching at NOVA is a JOB, its hard work though not intellectually or mentally demanding, and thats what people complain most about as they think being an English teacher is speaking English at students. Try doing it for four five straight hours every day and it gets stale quickly. The job gets physically tiring and boring after about a month. You are a paid conversationalist which is harder than it sounds asn many students speak next to NO English and you have 45 minutes of lesson with them.
I have posted on here some good points about NOVA
No need to speak Japanese to get hired
No previous teaching experience required
You can interview in English and get hired in your own country
Met at airport when you arrive
provided with health insurance and accomodation on arrival
furnished apartment if you need to rent.
basic training which consists of three days training and then thrown in the deep end.
liveable salary but very basic due to high living costs.
chances for promotions and advancement (teaching at NOVA is not really a career job for foriegners here though)
Transportation paid
Mobile phone provided by NOVA
You wont be stiffed on salary or paid late like some comapnies do.
branches all over the country and you can apply for transfers
10 paid holidays a year. Other days off are unpaid vacation days.
Airconditioned modern offices but classrooms feel like you are teaching in a closet. Very little privacy.
Very easy to quit NOVA. Give your notice and leave. They will have forgotten about you as soon as you quit and you will be replaced the next day.
Chance to meet a wide cross-section of Japanese society, people of all ages with the common denominator of wanting to meet foreigners and pay to speak English to you. Many have paid thousands of dollars in loans for lessons for the pleasure of sitting in a classroom with you.
If you meet their selection criteria they hire almost anyone. The rumor they hire people with a pulse is a myth and they regularly turn down people for jobs, simply to teach English here. Jump through their hoops and you have a good chance. Teaching is easy, getting hired to do so is NOT.
They will provide you with 100,000 yen when you arrive and are short of cash to get started. This is a LOAN and must be paid back, coming out of your first two months salary. It can make for some very lean months when you first arrive as they take out rent, insurance and loan, while on probation income.
NEGATIVES
Lately very low pay for new teachers. Salary level has not gone up in 20 years and in fact has gone down to record low levels
Long wait periods to get initial visa and sponsorship
You cant always choose where you get posted. They send you where they need people. you may not get Tokyo or Osaka.
NOVA is now taking 30,000 yen a month out of salaries for health insurance. Teachers whine like hell about a cut salary but its Japanese law.
Very expensive rent if you rent their apartments. No need to pay keep money but NOVA makes a lot of money as your landlord.
Job can get very boring very quickly. Extremely low level but motivated students. always have to be peppy and chirpy even though you are dog-tired.
foreign managers and trainers can be extremely anal with subordinates. Usually rather ambitious, rather full of themselves, they have had to do some serious brown-nosing to management to advance in the companyand this can include spying on other teachers. Watch your back.
Small closet like classrooms packed together like sardines. You can hear whats in the next classroom and vice versa. Supervisors can listen in on your classes from outside.
Non-fraternisation policy. Can not socialise or meet with any student of any age or either gender outside the school. Anal policy and totally illegal. Students may ask you out for meals and drinks but it makes teachers paranoid they can lose their jobs for socialisng with students.
Some students you may want to date and meet socially but you can risk attracting serial stalkers. A soured relationship with a female student can make your life very unpleasant with an employer as she discusses your sex life with the office staff at your job or starts to character assassinate you. You take a big risk dating students though the temptation is great for many as you will not know many people and having a pretty young thing come on to you in class is too much to pass up.
Can be rather bureaucratic. Its a big chain school and things sometimes move slowly. You will likely never meet your bosses except the branch manager.
Two months probation income where you are paid 2/3 your full salary. add in initial loan from company and you will be living on gas fumes until payday.
Greater emphasis on profit and business than on education. NOVA is a business, not a school. students are customers and you are a salaried employee. Dont expect to impart any great founts of wisdom or improve the knowledge of your students. Some you only only see once every three months. Homework and tests are a foreign concept at NOVA. Your bosses wont be educators and probably have little real interest in students learning, but more interest in getting them to sign up for more lessons. |
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patsensei
Joined: 06 May 2006
Posts: 27
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 7:46 am Post subject: |
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NOVA has its good points and bad points, but my advice is to come here pay your dues, get experience and then look for other jobs. New people moan and whine but for many its the first full time job they have ever had and they are straight out of college. Working at NOVA is what YOU make it and they are not there to entertain you or babysit you.The contract is fairly standard and they are too big to be nickel and diming ind vidual employees.
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that i very sound advice. Get some experience hang in there for about a year and then you'll be able to judge for yourself and much more easily pick and choose should you wish to move on.
Good Luck! |
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luckyloser700
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 308
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 8:39 am Post subject: |
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Interview with all of the big eikaiwa companies.
NOVA, GEOS, AEON, and ECC are definitely not the same in terms of compensation, accomodation, and working hours. There aren't huge differences between the different companies, but working for a company like AEON is definitely more appealing (in my opinion, of course) than working for NOVA. The starting salary at AEON is 35000 Yen more than NOVA's. AEON provides single apartments with a fixed rent of 42000 Yen. Basic health insurance is covered by the company; students don't pay any premiums. AEON schools are closed most Sundays throughout the year and socialization with students isn't discouraged.
No matter where you work, you will develop skills that'll help you in your next job whether it's teaching English or not teaching at all. However, as Paul said, eikaiwa work is neither highly rewarding nor easy. As long as you come knowing you'll be expected to work hard and smile all the time as if you're having the time of your life, you won't be too surprised by the work environment at one of the big eikaiwa schools.
Again, apply to all of them and go to the group interviews (if you're invited). You'll get a good feel for which company is the best for you if you do. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 8:50 am Post subject: |
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| NOVA, GEOS, AEON, and ECC are definitely not the same in terms of compensation, accomodation, and working hours. |
Pretty close, though. Most of the issues raised by complainers seem to center around management and administrative topics (failure to provide health insurance copayments, and contract clauses that state no fraternization with students,for example).
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| The starting salary at AEON is 35000 Yen more than NOVA's. |
Is this true in all cities? NOVA's salary varies with the city where you are posted, probably because of the difference in cost of living.
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| AEON provides single apartments with a fixed rent of 42000 Yen. |
Yes, and if you don't like it, you have to find your own and still pay AEON the 42,000 beside what you pay for the other place.
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| Basic health insurance is covered by the company |
Make absolutely sure about this. Practically all eikaiwas these days are making use of the legal loophole that allows them to avoid paying this. That is, the job is listed as full-time, but if you work 29.5 hours or less in the classroom, the employer can declare only those hours to the government and thereby label you as a part-timer, so they don't have to make those insurance payments.
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| socialization with students isn't discouraged |
To even try discouraging this is illegal anyway, and NOVA has lost in court over this.
Moreover, to socialize with students has its negative points.
1. Students often see teachers only as after-hours free English lesson providers. You won't be treated as a friend in that situation.
2. Do you really want to see the same people day and night? Especially "those" students whom you don't like? They often feel safety in numbers and will arrange to meet you as a class.
3. Try to turn socialization into a dating opportunity, and you are looking at a recipe for disaster. |
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stillnosheep
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 2068
Location: eslcafe
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| Posted: Wed May 24, 2006 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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Go for JET if you want 20% more money, don't mind being an Assistant Language Teacher in a Japanese school and like 9-5 and less teaching hours and are prepared to wait until Sept 2007 to start.
Otherwise: Try Aeon or ECC, then Geos, then Berlitz, finally Nova; I don't know about PKC |
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Brooke Pain
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 12:11 am Post subject: |
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Wow thanks guys! what a great response.
After reading all of your replies, im really not sure, I have hered a lot of bad things about NOVA, but JET seems to appeal to me as the hours would be a lot more convinient.
I am traveling with my partner, we are both Kiwis but he speaks Japanese aswell and would possibly work in a convinient store or something like that.
The pay package does concern me as i do not have a degree or anything of the sort. PKC have offered 215000 yen a month. Is this good or standard?
Has anyone else had experience working with PKC? |
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Hoser
Joined: 19 Mar 2005
Posts: 694
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 1:12 am Post subject: |
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I'm not a huge fan of NOVA but they're ok. If you're only planning on staying on one or two years then they're probably the most convenient option. What's the deal with AEON's salary anyways? It states that it's 255,000 yen. Is that what you get each month or do they tack more cash onto it? For example my salary at NOVA is a lot lower than this but then after all the allowances (nights, sundays, service) my salary ends up being a lot higher than this total. Is it the same for AEON?
I was actually checking out AEON's site and then say that they have a 29.5 hour 5day work week. And yet when I checked out the "daily life of AEON" section, it had the teachers arriving at 12:45pm and finishing at 9:00pm which is exactly the same as a NOVA teacher's 40 hour work week. Where's the discrepancy here? |
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dudelebow
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 42
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 1:24 am Post subject: AEON apartments |
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| you can wiggle your way out of the AEON apartment pay if you decide to get your own place, but you have to fight for it. a friend of mine fought aeon on this issue and won with help from the labor bureau. |
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Brooke Pain
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 2:30 am Post subject: |
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So Hoser, your working for NOVA???? I do only intend to stay for a year or two maybe.
I have hered bad things about NOVA, are they true? |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 2:46 am Post subject: |
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| Brooke Pain wrote: |
I am traveling with my partner, we are both Kiwis but he speaks Japanese aswell and would possibly work in a convinient store or something like that.
? |
Is your partner your husband or your boyfriend?
with no degree you can not get a full time sponsored work visa, only a working holiday visa.
If you are married and he has a degree you can get a dependent visa.
The chances are slim to none that he will get a job working in a convenience store if he is not Japanese. It doesnt matter how good his Japanese is. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 2:49 am Post subject: |
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| Hoser wrote: |
I was actually checking out AEON's site and then say that they have a 29.5 hour 5day work week. And yet when I checked out the "daily life of AEON" section, it had the teachers arriving at 12:45pm and finishing at 9:00pm which is exactly the same as a NOVA teacher's 40 hour work week. Where's the discrepancy here? |
Because the official work hours and the actual teaching hours and face time with students is different. You will physically be in the building 8 hours a day plus meal break but your actual lesson time will be something like 27 or 28 hours a week. The rest of the time during the day is made up of breaks between lessons, paperwork and admin, level checks, demo lessons and busy-work. These are not included in your teaching hours. |
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Brooke Pain
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 2:54 am Post subject: |
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| He is Japanese but born in NZ. |
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