Job Discussion Forums

[tedkarma]

I hope this pops the great CELTA bubble - the be all and end all of TEFL programs. It is a name brand that has not changed or adapted to the changing TEFL world.

They are the General Motors and Ford of the TEFL world - slowly heading towards bankruptcy. Adapt to new and changing market conditions - or die.

[Gordon]

Outside of the Celta or Trinity, does anyone know a of a decent, reputable TEFL certificate program out there? TEFL International has a lot of schools teaching their program, but I have no idea if they are good, bad or ugly. (As I type this, their banner at the top of the page is blinkng at me )

[Justin Trullinger]

I don't know a lot about TEFL International. They're so big that there's likely to be a lot of variation from center to center. But as I understand it, it's a legitimate course- On site, not on line, roughly the same number of classroom hours and teaching hours as CELTA or Trinity. I haven't had much experienc with their grads, but suspect that the courses are okay.

As might be expected, I'll also chime in here a plug for the SIT TESOL certificate, from the School for International Training in Vermont. This course was new to me a year ago, and is relatively new in general, only having been around for a few years. Again, in terms of hours, teaching time, etc, it's equivalent to the CELTA. I like their insistence on small groups, of 6 to 12, which means a better chance for good relationships with trainers, and fewer participants to a trainer. When I did my Trinity cert, there was practically a new trainer for every input session. Some were very good, but who in the world were they? I like the SIT ideology in general, which is very inclusive and team based. Some of the methodology of the course is slightly different than others I've known, but the cert is similar enough- I've heard that International House will now accept it as a CELTA equivalent. (As all the forum regulars already know, there's nothing unbiased about my opinion on this course- I'm involved in a new SIT TESOL course here in Ecuador.)

I'll admit that when I get teacher applications, I am relieved to see a cert I know to be good, which is usually Trinity or CELTA. But while the CELTA is well respected and a good course, stories like Slim Pickens' are not exactly uncommon. I don't really know why, but there seems to be a tendency towards inflexibility in the offering of the CELTA, and a perception of unfairness that isn't uncommon amongst participants. I really wonder why this is, and wish that some of the higher ups in the UCLES organisation were aware of it, and taking it seriously. The CELTA is a good qualification, but more and more, I meet people who didn't have a good experience when they got it. It seems a waste, somehow.


Best regards,
Justin

[snorklequeen]

the SIT Tesol course in El Invu, Costa Rica [near La Fortuna] has gotten a LOT of great buzz recently on the Teacher Training Forum; i emailed with some its recent grads and a woman in the middle of taking the class; it sounds quite worthwhile! it is one on my short list, tho' i would miss out on the Mexico networking from taking a certificate course in Mexico, where i will actually teach; however, the El Invu course sounds so good for someone without teaching experience that i'm seriously thinking about doing it despite the loss of networking opportunities, just for the experience and what sounds like an exceptional training course

cheers,

Queenie

[Jetgirly]

I learned a lot in my CELTA, and it was amazingly fun, but some things that happened on the instruction / management end had me shaking my head.

One of our instructors was EXTREMELY rude to the "shy" students, and harassed them about their out-of-the-classroom personality. On the last night a bunch of people went dancing, and as a female CELTA student danced with one of the male practice students, our instructor leaned over and said (snidely... how else can you say this), "Finally... Monica really needed that." (Clearly implying she hadn't had sex in years.) Another male CELTA trainee had to take a break for several days after being reduced to tears on several occasions. The other teacher trainer had to call him repeatedly and beg him to come back to the program.

There were 30 people who signed up for the program when we did, and we were divided into a group of 12 and a group of 18 (within these groups, we worked closely in groups of six). I was in the group of twelve, and we were frequently expected to stay 90-120 minutes past the scheduled end of day to discuss our classroom experiences. This was pretty ironic, as almost every student in the other group got a Pass A or Pass B, but of our twelve we had only two of each. It was obvious that had we been in the other group, we could have done the same work and got a higher grade.

In the end, I feel I got my money's worth and would recommend the CELTA, but I would go into it with the knowledge that your teacher trainers aren't necessarily the Gods of ESL, and that you should demand respect from them.

[Justin Trullinger]

That's exactly what I mean. The course content is good, certainly as good as any four week intensive EFL teaching course, and way better than most. But the stories of rude instructors, rude to both trainees and practice teaching students, are not isolated anymore. We hear them all the time.

Why in heaven's name do the "good folks" at UCLES put up with this?

Most of us who teach are aware that teaching and learning are both more effective, and more fun, in a positive, supportive environment. Who would last 5 minutes in this profession if they couldn't build a good relationship with the people they're teaching? And, correct me if I'm wrong, practically all cert courses pay at least lip service to this important ability.

But somehow, some trainers feel that the powers vested in them as trainers remove the requirement to practice this skill.

I've no doubt that the trainers on the aforementioned CELTA course were well qualified. They have to be. But I would sack a teacher who treated students the way trainees sometimes get treated.

Practice what you preach, trainers!

Justin

[movinaround]

[Jetgirly]

We were grouped before the first day. We had a half-day orientation session before the class began, where all thirty people filed into a room. They read out two lists of names and said, "List A to Room 1, List B to Room 2." I had actually used this website to meet up with another girl who was taking the course at the same time/place as me. We met for lunch in downtown Barcelona, then went to the school together. I was List A, she was List B. I will admit that my group of 12 was very different than the other group of 18, but I would say the main difference was that most of the people in my group were over 30 years old and came to the courses with degrees and a fair amount of work experience.

As for the Pass A/B "hyperbole", I'm not lying. Two girls (who shared the same first name) received Pass As, and two other students got Pass Bs (one of whom had previous ESL experience). That was from our group of 12. The other group of 18 had oodles of Pass Bs and several Pass As. Who knows- maybe you can get your hands on the statistics. It was IH Barcelona in Nov-Dec 2004. It pissed me off at the time, but I couldn't care less anymore.

[movinaround]

[Gordon]

You are right about the Pass marks. At the time, you care what your grade is, but after a few years, you could care less. I only got a pass (I did speak my mind ) but now I don't care one bit and neither does an employer.