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cafebleu



Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Posts: 404

PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark - I haven`t taught at a big eikawa and I haven`t been on the JET program. But I know any number of native speaker English teachers who have done either and I am also familiar to some extent with the Japanese high school system.

Don`t make the mistake of thinking that all private eikaiwa grind out lessons just to keep the students coming back without actually doing anything productive. It depends on the eikaiwa. I have worked in smaller eikaiwa schools and I was generally satisfied by the progress of my students.

You also have to remember that progress does not necessarily mean becoming a good speaker of English. Some Japanese take English lessons as a way to make friends, get to know foreigners, and try to learn some English in a group situation that does not challenge them too much.

I have students who will never become fluent speakers of English (in common with 90 percent of students learning English at private eikaiwa - maybe my figure is too high) but they are making progress. They are coming to class and they are speaking in English to me, and trying to have English conversation with the other students about topics they are interested in. They also use textbooks but I always do everything I can to make their grammar learning etc relevant to their daily lives.

Overall I have found the English speaking ability of the Japanese to be poor, especially given that they have so many years of English study which should be an advantage. Their excuse is that they didn`t learn conversational English (true) but their big advantage in knowing English structures from school and often college should give them a sound base. (If I had studied Japanese at school and college I have little doubt I would be somebody who speaks a fluent level of Japanese.) Yet you can produce results at eikaiwas that are satisfactory for both yourself and your students.

I have some students who are forever beginners but it doesn`t stop them doing their best to join in the class and try to talk about their lives and interesting things that are happening. Other students are seriously trying to learn in order to do homestays or study at foreign colleges and while again, I think as a rule their English level is relatively poor given the exposure they have had to English in school, they have a purpose and are making serious efforts to be able to live life in a foreign country. Then there are the good speakers, a few of whom need to maintain their English level for professional purposes.

I have heard that schools such as Nova do the same lesson plan again and again to reinforce grammar structures and I have heard that GEOS and AEON are similar. Yes, that IS boring if you`re a teacher who genuinely wants to make English more creative for your students. But think of the big schools as your starting point. Try them, get your visa from them, try to keep to your contract and learn what you can. Then after that initial period is finished you will have the visa and the Japanese working experience to be able to get jobs at different kinds of eikaiwa.

As for high schools, there are any number of potential problems. Do you want serious students of English at high school level? Don`t come to Japan and teach in a usual high school. The Japanese tolerate unbelievable rudeness such as sleeping in class which even in rougher schools in my home country is not acceptable. Class sizes are usually big and the interested students often are in a minority. The Japanese usually are poor at English after studying it at high school and college so imagine trying to teach them at high school.

Japanese school teachers` attitudes towards foreign teachers fluctuate wildly. There are genuinely helpful teachers who will try to accommodate the foreign teacher. But there are also resentful teachers who will complain behind your back about your salary and how they have to work much harder than you. There are teachers who feel insecure because their own language shortcomings will be exposed by your native fluency. Then there is the general Japanese attitude to foreigners - as a rule I and other foreigners have found the Japanese to feel threatened by a foreigner who adjusts to the life and language here. Not every Japanese person is like this but many are.

If I were you I would go for one of the big four eikaiwa, get experience and then broaden my working horizons after one year here.
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Gordon



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 5:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark,
I think you are overanalyzing the situation. I believe you have gotten all the facts that you need. You have no way of knowing what avenue will turn out best for you. You could have a good or bad time no matter what your decision or place of employment is. There comes a time when you have to take a leap of faith and then make the best of whatever situation you are in.

BTW
Where are you working in Vancouver?
Weekly intakes, that's terrible.
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april



Joined: 07 May 2003
Posts: 83
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 6:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Do students at Nova/Geos/Aeon/ECC actually improve beyond a low-intermediate level through studying at these places?


Yep. If they didn't I am quite sure the company would have gone broke years ago!! I don't know real figures, but my guess is it's about half-and-half. Some students accelerate quickly, others are stuck in the same level for a couple of years. Depends on their own motivation and study habits as well as many other variables that I'm sure I don't have to explain to you. Some students are happy to stay at the same lever because, as cafeblu said, their motivation isn't to be a fluent English speaker.

Quote:
Are they exposed to natural native speech (i.e. not easy-to-understand teacher-talk) and taught how to listen to it?


Of course! That's why native speaking teachers are hired. The whole emphasis is on speaking and listening. The 'Voice Lessons' focus entirely on this. At training you will always be told to speak naturally, and at normal pace. For beginner students I speak at normal speed and normal pronunciation and intonation, but I use shorter sentences and have a longer pause in between each sentence. Teachers are always told to not dumb down their speech.

Quote:
Do people typically get much job satisfaction from the big schools?

I did. I worked at a small school and got to know my students really well. I loved watching a student progress within a few months from "I like sushi" to "Yesterday my friends and I went to a sushi bar and ate so much that we got sick!" For me it was very rewarding. Even though I had to teach the same lessons over and over, I had fun with it, and so did my students. I can teach the same lesson in 10 different ways, even more. I can't imagine getting that same satisfaction standing up in front of whiteboard talking to 40 blank-faced students in a classroom. But I've never been an ALT, so I could be wrong.

I agree with Gordon that you are over-analysing.
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cheryl



Joined: 01 Apr 2003
Posts: 119
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2003 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This response is a bit delayed...sorry. I was in Kumamoto on a rafting trip this weekend which was fabulous! Anyways, a short comment.

Quote:
Well... CLAIR, the government agency responsible for the hiring says that your primary purpose is intenationalization, BUT when you are working for a school, they generally expect you to be focused on teaching and often don't have time in the curriculum for you to "internationalize" their students.


In my short time here in Japan, I've had more than enough time to "internationalize". I don't know any ALT who is so incredibly busy during their school day that they can't find time to "mingle" with their students. My JTE's, my VP, and my Principle are all interested in me getting to know the students in and out of class.


Mark --- if you decide you want to do the JET programme, i suggest you go to www.bigdaikon.com (it's a website for "JET's"). You'll be able to hear about many different experiences rather than having to base your decision on a few generalizations.
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Celeste



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 814
Location: Fukuoka City, Japan

PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 3:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
In my short time here in Japan, I've had more than enough time to "internationalize". I don't know any ALT who is so incredibly busy during their school day that they can't find time to "mingle" with their students. My JTE's, my VP, and my Principle are all interested in me getting to know the students in and out of class.



I think that it is great that the staff at your school is so supportive. I think that the key is definitely to mingle with the kids outside the class. I didn't mean to imply that the JET ALTs didn't have enough time in their day to talk to the students, just that in class time will often not be allocated to "internationalization". I find that a lot of the Japanese teachers really feel pressured to squeeze in the whole curriculum in the allotted number of classes, and that often they have a hard time seeing the value in things that are not directly related to the curriculum.

Quote:
Weekly intakes, that's terrible.


When I was teaching in Vancouver, my school had weekly intakes, but it wasn't too bad. Genrally because the classes were very small, it wasn't a big deal to get someone up to speed on what the class was doing.
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cheryl



Joined: 01 Apr 2003
Posts: 119
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2003 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I didn't mean to imply that the JET ALTs didn't have enough time in their day to talk to the students, just that in class time will often not be allocated to "internationalization"


Ah, sorry Celeste, my bad. I agree, in class time is NOT for internationalization. I hardly have any classes so most of my contact with the students is out of class.
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