Job Discussion Forums

kimcordle · Joined: 23 Mar 2006 Posts: 30

This is sure to upset the apple cart, but I feel something needs to be said. I read these boards a lot and post very little. From what I see, there are a lot of immature, negative, unhappy people in the field of TESOL.
From my point of view, the "newbie" forum is for having questions answered by people who genuinely want to be helpful. However, what I've found is that many current teachers who post on here do nothing but spew their negativity. Do you not have anything better to do in your life than post negativity on the message board? Is your life so empty that you have to resort to being an argumentative jerk and actively seek out people you can make fun of? I feel sorry for you. You are pathetic.
Granted, there are bad things in this industry, as in every industry. I work in the medical field as a hearing specialist for a HUGE corporation, and there are lots of things that suck about it. That doesn't mean that I am going to dissuade people from entering this profession, or make fun and belittle someone simply because they don't have my experience and have questions. It doesn't make the field I'm in a bad one to enter. There are good and bad points to every job, every person, every country, etc.
I see lots of you complain about your wages, but you know what? You are being paid to see the world and experience things most people only dream about. If the money is most important to you, I think maybe it was a mistake for you to choose to teach overseas. If you want the big bucks and benefits, why not go back to your home country to teach?
You made this choice, yet you whine and complain about your position in life. It's a self-inflicted wound my friend, and I don't feel sorry for you in that respect. I make $60,000 a year in a town with a very low cost of living, yet I am planning to leave my position to become a EFL teacher and work for peanuts. Why? Because money isn't that important to me. I want to travel the world and meet new people and learn new things. Those are the things important to me, and they're the things you already have, yet you complain about it.
I'm sure for some of you, the reason for your negativity on the "newbie" forum is to keep people out of the market to have less competition and higher wages for jobs. I can understand your motivation. But there is something called respect for others, and many of you are severely lacking in that department.
My question for you is this: If you're not a newbie and you don't want to be genuinely helpful to those of us that are, why do you insist on posting here? Figure out what's wrong with yourself in your own life that causes you to be so unhappy and negative and deal with it. Grow as a person. Have the desire to be happy. Help people when you can and butt out when you can't or don't want to. It's a simple matter of respect, and you have none.
If this applies to you, you know who you are.

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

kimcordle, not all the genuine information that can actually help newbies is positive. For example, all those North Americans who want to work in Spain or Italy or France genuinely need to know that it's extremely unlikely that they will find legal work. It's not all happy news, but it's important to go into something as potentially risky as moving overseas with one's eyes open.

I agree with you that sometimes the negativity on the boards is unwarranted, but filtering out the reality from the simple sour grapes may not be as clear-cut as you seem to think.

And I really doubt that anyone is motivated by a desire to keep more newbies out of the field. The overall fact, with few exceptions, is that people in our field with basic qualifications get entry-level jobs. Those jobs rarely support people in the long-term, if you consider pensions and buying property, raising children, and other stuff most grown-ups want to do. There's nothing much to protect if you've got basic quals. The job market in the most desirable locations is always going to be tight because people will always want to go there (Madrid, or Prague, for example).
A few posts on this forum will absolutely make zero difference.

Nowadays, if you really want to make a living in this profession, you really need advanced qualifications in most places. Those of us who have worked for MAs and the like have 'real' jobs and we certainly have zero motivation to try to keep newbies out of the field. It's not even the same field, in many respects. But many of us do post in the newbie forum, in hopes of helping people .

Sorry all the info can't be positive and happy all the time!

thrifty · Joined: 25 Apr 2006 Posts: 1665 Location: chip van

Most people can only dream about being a TEFLer?

kimcordle · Joined: 23 Mar 2006 Posts: 30

Spiral,
Obviously, from reading my post you can see that I understand there are positives and negatives to ANY job. I never said don't be honest. Also, the type of person I'm referring to in my post isn't indicative of the majority of people on this board. But, if you tend to read the newbie threads, there are certain people that continually berate people and spew opinion and not fact. I would assume most newbie's would like to know the "real" truth...good or bad. Forewarned is forearmed. But if you don't know the answer or you just want to be a jerk, why reply at all?

Thrifty,
My statement was
"You are being paid to see the world and experience things most people only dream about."
Would you not agree that a majority of people like to travel, and would more if time and finances would permit it? That's what I mean.

Did you not understand or are you just being a smart*ss?

ls650 · Joined: 10 May 2003 Posts: 3484 Location: British Columbia

Rin · Joined: 09 Jan 2006 Posts: 173 Location: Doha

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

I agree a lot with spiral. I'd like to add a couple of remarks.

TheLongWayHome · Joined: 07 Jun 2006 Posts: 1016 Location: San Luis Piojosi

Gordon · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 5309 Location: Japan

I think the OP has made a good point. But i think if you read closely, it is often a few people who post a lot and do a lot of the negative posting. The majority of people here are quite helpful. Glenski was right when he said that there is a fine line between negativity and the truth when it doesn't suit someone. Anonymity can bring out the worst in people.

anospi · Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:58 am Post subject:

Mchristophermsw · Joined: 14 Apr 2005 Posts: 228

Great Post,

In this world there will be those who are positive or negative.
Insulate yourself with the postive as much as possible.

I have taught overseas and I loved it. Currently, I am an Investigator for Child Protection Services and make anywere from 75K to 90K depending on OT. There are people here who have Phd's and those who are Clinicians who stay because of the money but bitch and gripe everyday.

You will always find those type. I love my Job, especially when I think of other things I could be doing at a much lower pay. But also my goal is to save X amount of dollars before heading overseas in a few years full time were I will resume my teaching career---and even though I will be making much less, I will be happy---no griping now and no griping later for me and I avoid gripers as much as possible.

You can see the bright side of every situation if you just look hard enough, the problem is that its easier to complian for many people.

kimcordle · Joined: 23 Mar 2006 Posts: 30

Glenski,
You're right, you are paid to teach. I didn't phrase that well. But I think for most the reason to want to teach overseas is the overseas experience. Otherwise you'd just be teaching at home.
You may not realize this, but you're lucky. You work in a field where you CAN get a job overseas. I wish I could get a job as a hearing specialist in China or Indonesia. I'd already be there. Now, a little later in life, I'm going to do what it takes to be a qualified teacher so I can do it too. That's how much I want to do it.
I want you to understand too though that I don't just want to do it to travel. I think if that's your only motivation you would be doing a disservice to your students. I think religion, language and government divide us as people. I think we should have one universal language, and if I can help to make that happen I can make a difference in the world. Some people see this as kind of a joke of a career, but I think it's noble. You won't make it rich, but you can make a difference and have experiences most people will never have.

spiral78 · Joined: 05 Apr 2004 Posts: 11534 Location: On a Short Leash

TheLongWayHome's right - teach a year first, and then you can comment with some real substance behind whatever you've got to say.

kimcordle · Joined: 23 Mar 2006 Posts: 30

Spiral,
Well, since I never said any of you were wrong, it's a bit of a moot point you're making. I'm certain I would have different attitudes about it after being in the field a year. It would be impossible not to. But there is a difference between being honest and being negative, nasty and mean. That's the point I was trying to make.

Ai · Joined: 02 Jun 2006 Posts: 154 Location: Chile

I love being a TEFLer but I have had BAD experiences with it as well. I came to Japan thinking I had it all figured out and that things would be cake. It turned out that I'd been fooled and had taken a rotten job. I think it's important to warn people of the potential difficulties of the TEFL industry even if it does sound negative.

The positive aspects of TEFL are obvious. It's the negative that people may not anticipate.