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thermal
Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 60
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 Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 2:30 am Post subject: What's the best job I can get? |
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I am about to start applying for teaching jobs in Japan. I am looking to work on a working holiday visa. I am unsure what kind of job I am able to get and should apply for.. See below for my info and questions.
Qualifications / Details
- Diploma of Information Technology (Software Development) 2 year course
- Sun Certified Java Programmer (version 1.5)
- CELTA (Pass B recommendation � awaiting confirmation from Cambridge) (My teachers liked me so they should be good references.)
- I dropped out of Computer Science and Software Engineering degree in the second semester first year, which I do intend to finish when I return from Japan.. So I suppose I could put this as on going or even join up again and postpone if that will help me get a job.
- I also dropped out of an Arts degree in the first semester first year.
- I have 2.5 years commercial experience as a programmer.
- I am 25, white and live in Australia.
- I am a clear and proficient speaker with a good vocabulary.
- I have been learning Japanese for a year. (If I leave after December I will have JLPT level 4 Japanese qualification)
- I am going to try and do some volunteer teaching before I go over, which will most likely be tutoring.
What kind of job I want
- I want a teaching job where I am given freedom in how I teach. I would like to apply my CELTA training and try different techniques to find what is most beneficial for the students.
- I don't want every lesson to be with a new group of students.
- I want to work in Kyoto.
- I want to work 20 hours a week.
- Ideally I don�t want to work for a big company.
Questions
1. What roughly is the best initial job I can get?
2. Am I unlikely to get sponsorship for my visa unless it is with a big company?
3. In general, which of the big companies offering teaching are the best to teach for? (Freedom, hours, pay, etc.)
4. Which of these companies have the shortest contracts? (I will be interested in leaving as soon as I can to get a better job if it isn't that great)
5. Which of these companies will not consider me because I do not have a completed degree?
6. Will it be hard to get a job if I insist on Kyoto?
7. Am I better off to wait before I apply to get a better job? I hear February is a good time to look.
8. Of my details, what should I include on my resume?
9. If I apply for the four big companies and they respond positively, how long do I have to reply?
Any advice much appreciated. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 2:57 am Post subject: Re: What's the best job I can get? |
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| thermal wrote: |
I am about to start applying for teaching jobs in Japan. I am looking to work on a working holiday visa. I am unsure what kind of job I am able to get and should apply for.. See below for my info and questions.
Qualifications / Details
- Diploma of Information Technology (Software Development) 2 year course
- Sun Certified Java Programmer (version 1.5)
- CELTA (Pass B recommendation � awaiting confirmation from Cambridge) (My teachers liked me so they should be good references.)
- I dropped out of Computer Science and Software Engineering degree in the second semester first year, which I do intend to finish when I return from Japan.. So I suppose I could put this as on going or even join up again and postpone if that will help me get a job.
- I also dropped out of an Arts degree in the first semester first year.
- I have 2.5 years commercial experience as a programmer.
- I am 25, white and live in Australia.
- I am a clear and proficient speaker with a good vocabulary.
- I have been learning Japanese for a year. (If I leave after December I will have JLPT level 4 Japanese qualification)
- I am going to try and do some volunteer teaching before I go over, which will most likely be tutoring. |
With a working holiday visa you can work in japan up to 18 months and then you must leave. If you have no degree you wont be able to continue here without a valid work visa.
You can not cherry pick what jobs you will do when you are essentially at the bottom of the food chain for jobs. I live in Kyoto and to my knowledge there are not many jobs here, even for full timers with degrees. You have a one month CELTA and no teaching experience.
Japanese language ability is not required to get a teaching job and ethnicity is largely irrelevant. The days of getting jobs because of white skin are long past.
| Quote: |
What kind of job I want
- I want a teaching job where I am given freedom in how I teach. I would like to apply my CELTA training and try different techniques to find what is most beneficial for the students.
- I don't want every lesson to be with a new group of students.
- I want to work in Kyoto.
- I want to work 20 hours a week.
- Ideally I don�t want to work for a big company.
QuestionsAny advice much appreciated. |
Most schools here have a curriculum, a set method and a program that new teachers use. No one will hire you to come in and teach off the bat, considering you have no teaching experence and no idea what students want or need from a teacher or a language lesson. 90% of schools dont even require CELTA or previous experience and students for the most part wont care at all.
I think from your laundry list of demands you are simply disqualifying yourself s no school needs to pay any attention. Start demanding what conditions you will work under and they will show you the door. You have no university degree, can only work part time and therefore no in a position to call the shots here.
Lower your expectations, show some humility and be prepared to LEARN rather than tell other people what you will and won't do as a noobie teacher.
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1. What roughly is the best initial job I can get? |
Working part time or full time at whatever school will employ you.
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| 2. Am I unlikely to get sponsorship for my visa unless it is with a big company? |
WHV does not require a sponsor or a university degree.
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| 3. In general, which of the big companies offering teaching are the best to teach for? (Freedom, hours, pay, etc.) |
What do you mean 'freedom? You are paid to teach English, not do what YOu want. you are a salaried employee, a working drone. Part timers work 4-5 hours a day, 5 days a week. How much freedom do you want?
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| 4. Which of these companies have the shortest contracts? (I will be interested in leaving as soon as I can to get a better job if it isn't that great) |
A contract is one year and if you want to quit you give the required notice.Let me know which is a better company than the one you leave and how you know its better after only a few months here.
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| 5. Which of these companies will not consider me because I do not have a completed degree? |
Most of them. They wont consider you if you dont have a valid visa. NOVA hires part timers on a working holiday visa. Get the degree and visa and then think about who will hire you.
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| 6. Will it be hard to get a job if I insist on Kyoto? |
If there are no jobs there it will be impossible. You go where you are sent, not where you want to go. If you insist on where to work they will insist they don't need anyone.
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| 7. Am I better off to wait before I apply to get a better job? I hear February is a good time to look. |
You are better off to wait till you get a degree and employers here can hire you full time.
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| 8. Of my details, what should I include on my resume? |
you are on WHV, coming to Japan and interested in working here.
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| 9. If I apply for the four big companies and they respond positively, how long do I have to reply? |
They may ask for an interview. If they are interested they will want a reply within 2-3 weeks as to whether to proceed. NOVA doesnt need to sponsor you on a WHV.
Last edited by PAULH on Sun Jul 23, 2006 3:39 am; edited 1 time in total |
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kdynamic
Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 3:30 am Post subject: |
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| Without a degree you are going to be very, very limited and you will have to take what you can get. I don't think coming into this situation with a list of requirements is the right attitude. You are very very minimally qualified, and only for an 18 month WHV. |
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thermal
Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 4:45 am Post subject: |
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Thankyou for the replies.
Sorry if I am coming across as arrogant.
I include all information so you guys can answer me fully. It looks like it isn't necessary as no degree is the big minus and I am looking at bottom of the barrel teaching jobs.
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| You have a one month CELTA and no teaching experience. |
The CELTA does include 6 hours supervised teaching to real learners. Whoopty doo? 
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| Lower your expectations, show some humility and be prepared to LEARN rather than tell other people what you will and won't do as a noobie teacher. |
Where did I indicate my expectations? Am I supposed to know this stuff already?
I am here because I don't know what I am worth on the Japanese English teaching market. I don't know what I may be able to bargain for and what I will have no hope of getting. I include my ideal job for this reason, I have no illusions that I will get a job like that. My question is how close if at all.
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| How much freedom do you want? |
I want, ideally, the ability to tweak and shape the lessons to provide maximum benefit to the students.
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| You are better off to wait till you get a degree and employers here can hire you full time. |
It is an option to do my degree first. Will a degree assist in getting a part time teaching job? I am not interested in working full time for my initial year and a half. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 5:05 am Post subject: |
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| thermal wrote: |
| You have a one month CELTA and no teaching experience. |
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| The CELTA does include 6 hours supervised teaching to real learners. Whoopty doo? |
6 hours teaching students as a volunteer is not considered a lot. The training you undergo at NOVA and AEON lasts about 2-3 days and involves you teaching paying students. Most newbies have no experience whatsoever and only in-Japan experience is worth anything at all, if that.
Moreover what you do in a NOVA lesson may bear no relation you do in a CELTA course. Are any of those learners Asian or Japanese? Even Korean and Chinese kids learn differently than Japanese.
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Where did I indicate my expectations? Am I supposed to know this stuff already? |
You seem to come here with a laundry list of things you will and wont do. Im saying you are being unrealistic and putting yourself out of contention. Say that you will work anywhere, do anything, be prepared to learn and gain experience and be adaptable and you will do better.
You expect employers to give you the hours you want in the city you want. You expect them to let you do what ever you want in the classroom.
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| I am here because I don't know what I am worth on the Japanese English teaching market. I don't know what I may be able to bargain for and what I will have no hope of getting. I include my ideal job for this reason, I have no illusions that I will get a job like that. My question is how close if at all. |
My answer to that is you are worth the same as any raw rookie that rolls off the plane looking for work. Dont expect them to be impressed by a CELTA or offer you more money. Jobs are non-negotiable and you will find you will take whatever you can get or is offered to you, than you shopping for jobs and picking and choosing. If you want to eat and meet your rent you will need to get a job first, ANY job. You are worth what people are willing to pay you which at todays rates is around 180-200,000 for a 20 hour work week. language teachers on average make from 1000-1500 yen an hour.
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I want, ideally, the ability to tweak and shape the lessons to provide maximum benefit to the students. |
Maybe they teach you that in a CELTA course. Do you know how to plan a curriculum, do you know how to teach Japanese students? Do you know what students actually want or is good for them?
Do you subscribe to teacher-centered learning where you call the shots or student centered learning i.e. teaching students how to be autonomous. what do you do about students who dont respond to your instruction? How will you know students have benefitted from how you teach them? You can tweak the lessons but you need to use the materials you are provided with. schools here dont like loose cannons and prima donnas.
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| It is an option to do my degree first. Will a degree assist in getting a part time teaching job? I am not interested in working full time for my initial year and a half. |
With a WHV you dont need a degree as you can work legally in Japan. A degree is needed to get a full time sponsored work visa. A degree wont make any difference to your actual teaching as its for visa purposes. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 5:17 am Post subject: |
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| thermal wrote: |
I include all information so you guys can answer me fully. It looks like it isn't necessary as no degree is the big minus and I am looking at bottom of the barrel teaching jobs.
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In Japan a degree is considered the de facto minimum qualification. its virtually assumed that any person applying for a job has one. You dont which means 80% of jobs here are out of reach to you as they either dont hire part timers in the time or place you want or they require a degree.
A degree is the minimum start line for getting work here and with no degree you are still in the changing rooms getting your shoes on.
As for being arrogant, no but perhaps you thought that being an Australian with a CELTA might have some pull here. Sorry to say, but it doesnt, and wont even get you an interview at many places.
If you are really keen on working here, have no degree, apply to the japan association of Working Holiday Makers
http://www.jawhm.or.jp/
They help people like you find jobs. |
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thermal
Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 6:58 am Post subject: |
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| You expect employers to give you the hours you want in the city you want. You expect them to let you do what ever you want in the classroom. |
I have no expectations at all. Want does not equal expect.
I did hope that my CELTA (my grade puts me in the top 17% of graduates) counted for something but didn't know.
In terms of the CELTA you seem to lack knowledge on it. Here is some info:
There are 9 lessons taught to anyone seeking free English lessons. Each lesson is judged and feedback provided. This process of continual feedback makes it very efficient at weeding out bad tendencies in teachers and pointing them in the right direction. As the lessons progress they are longer and involve more complex lesson types, incorportating knowledge the teachers recieve as the course goes on.
In terms of method CELTA is greatly focused on maximising student talk time and minimising teacher talk time. It is also focused on engaging students and personalising activities.
It is a crash course no doubt, but IMO a brilliant one.
I won't go into each of your teaching quesitons but they do not worry me. I have been taught good principles, will evaluate both myself and the students and am eager to improve. I will make lots of mistakes and they will teach me not too make them again.
I don't dispute that CELTA doesn't mean much in Japan, but you seemed to be undervaluing what the course teaches.
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If you are really keen on working here, have no degree, apply to the japan association of Working Holiday Makers
http://www.jawhm.or.jp/
They help people like you find jobs. |
Thankyou, I will look into it. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 7:18 am Post subject: |
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| thermal wrote: |
| I have no expectations at all. Want does not equal expect. |
What you want and what you will get are two different things. I want a Porsche and a house with a tennis court. i doesnt mean i will get them.
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| I did hope that my CELTA (my grade puts me in the top 17% of graduates) counted for something but didn't know. |
A CELTA will not even qualify you for a work visa which is all immigration is interested in.
| Quote: |
In terms of the CELTA you seem to lack knowledge on it. Here is some info:
There are 9 lessons taught to anyone seeking free English lessons. Each lesson is judged and feedback provided. This process of continual feedback makes it very efficient at weeding out bad tendencies in teachers and pointing them in the right direction. As the lessons progress they are longer and involve more complex lesson types, incorportating knowledge the teachers recieve as the course goes on.
In terms of method CELTA is greatly focused on maximising student talk time and minimising teacher talk time. It is also focused on engaging students and personalising activities.
It is a crash course no doubt, but IMO a brilliant one. |
i have an MEd in TESOL which is 360 plus hours of classroom plus years of teaching behind me.
CELTA is world recognised and a good qualification but of itself it is of limited value here. Obviously the CELTA people have sold you on its merits.
as for what it does that is what most ESL classes aim for, I dont need 100 hours of lessons to tell me that.
Now all you need to do is apply those principles in the classroom. |
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kdynamic
Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:16 am Post subject: |
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Freedom to tweak lessons as you see fit?
Why would you want to design your own lessons if you didnt have to???? I mean, as a non-teacher, trying to figure out what the hell you're doing is hard enough. You will be grateful if you are handed a planned curriculum instead of being told "we need a lesson on infinitives for a class starting in 5 minutes." I can see how real teachers would want control, but you, walking into a situation blind, would be making 100x more work for yourself and probably shortchanging the students, if you threw away the lesson they wanted you to teach and tried to do your own thing. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:21 am Post subject: |
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I have heard of people go into nervous fits because they have to do a 3 minute teaching demo at AEON or ECC interviews. A job offer is riding on how they do. Some of the recruiters will act as students in the demo lesson.
You have CELTA and know all the theory and all of 6 hours teaching practice and know exactly what Japanese students want and need out of a lesson.Should be a walk in the park, no doubt.
Good luck what ever you do, you will need it. |
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Birdog3344
Joined: 28 Jun 2004
Posts: 126
Location: Osaka, Japan
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| Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 10:09 am Post subject: |
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He said "tweak" not "throw away" or "create his own" lessons.
And he never implied that he was an expert or that it would be easy.
Give it rest, guys. Stick to the constructive feedback, onegai. |
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tokyo story
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 40
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| Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 6:44 am Post subject: |
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In my experience -- as someone who only wanted to come to Tokyo -- it's better to use your working holiday visa to arrive in Kyoto and start your job hunt from there, using the nearest Working Holiday Makers Association office (Osaka maybe.) You could try getting a job from overseas, but it's not easy... though NOVA may recruit you for their Osaka multi-media centre. You need proof of funds to get your WHV anyway, so you should be able to set yourself up in Kyoto without a job.
There is little freedom for teaching how you want, regardless of how academic or educational your institution is. Every job involves compromise. The greatest freedom is teaching students privately. You can teach 20 hours a week private, but it's best as supplementary income.
Don't worry so much about your qualifications or references. It's not as rigid or organised as you might imagine.
BTW, you could try Shane -- they usually take people based on CELTA, IIRC. |
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thermal
Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 10:49 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for your post tokyo story.
I think I will take that option. Hard question to answer.. but do you think it would take long to get a teaching position? Also would it be easier to get tutoring work?
I worry about running out of money and having to come home.
On Shane, they do appear to take CELTA. I will look into it further cheers. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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Hard question to answer.. but do you think it would take long to get a teaching position? Also would it be easier to get tutoring work?
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It's definitely a hard question to answer. We don't know you or your interviewing techniques or when you plan to come, etc.
Some people come here and have to go home in 90 days emptyhanded. Others get jobs in a couple of weeks. I think the safe average time to follow is that you may have to wait a month or so before you get your first classroom assignment. The first paycheck may follow 4-6 weeks later, depending on circumstances, so be prepared to support yourself for at LEAST 2 months.
As for "tutoring" (is that what you call giving private lessons?), that will also depend. Many people start by pirating their current eikaiwa classes, then go by word of mouth. Some advertise. You have another option of registering yourself (free) on several Internet sites that students will search. Many have the first trial lesson free, then the fees thereafter are up to you. Some of us have had zero luck in using them, and I suspect it's because of location and/or the cheapness of students. Once you land a student, though, don't expect him/her to stay. There is no guarantee of that whatsoever. |
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thermal
Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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I will have the money to support myself for 2 months, but i'd rather not risk having to come home.
In terms of when I was thinking September.. but given that the FAQ mentions February-March as ideal, I may delay.
Will waiting for this period have a big effect on my chances of landing a job? |
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