Site Search:
 
Get TEFL Certified & Start Your Adventure Today!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Maybe inaka isn't so bad....
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Japan
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
TK4Lakers



Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 1:15 pm    Post subject: Maybe inaka isn't so bad.... Reply with quote

...afterall.

I want to share a quick story with all of you.

The other day, I woke up feeling sick, but tried going to school anyway and gutting through the day. After the 1st period, I knew I wasn't right, took my temperature (had a 38.4 C), and the principal was nice enough to quickly take me home.

When nightime came and I was resting at my apartment, my neighbor visits and hands me some udon noodles. Shortly after that, a teacher comes by saying the Kyoto sensei gave him money to buy me food and drops off a bunch of stuff. Shortly after that, the principal drops by and gives me food his wife made along with some fruit. Then the school nurse comes by with her husband and gives me some soomen and fruit and water. Then the school's tea lady stopped by and gave me medicine, some juice and tea, and an ice pack pillow. All these people literally came shortly one after another. I'm thinking they must have bumped into each other when leaving the premise.

My fridge is still a bit full of all the foods and drinks I recieved, but I was and am still shocked at how friendly people here can be. Maybe its because they like me, or maybe its because I'm a hard working ALT.

Or maybe its because I'm in the inaka, and the people here are just friendly like that and are watching out for me. I definitely don't think I would've gotten this kind of attention and care if I was living and working out in Tokyo.

Even though I feel bad and all of that was a bit unneccessary, I am very thankful and at ease to know how kind and caring people here can be. Before moving out here I really wanted to live in Tokyo. But now.... I think I'm starting to like inaka more and more.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kdynamic



Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dude, the inaka rocks. So many people complain about it, but I think they just don't really give it a chance. I am glad to have the experience of living in the inaka, even though I will break for wider horizons after being here a couple years.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Speed



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 152
Location: Shikoku Land

PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Same thing happened to me too. So many people kept coming over giving me food to help me get better.

The only drawback was that I could never get any sleep/rest since the doorbell kept ringing!

There really is an overall sense of kindness in the inaka that you don`t feel out in the citites.

Enjoy your noodles.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SeasonedVet



Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Posts: 236
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tk4,
That is definitely something that is dying out in the world but seems to be alive and well in Inaka places in some parts of the world (that's changing too) but still alive and well in Japan's inaka.

I work in a little bit of an inaka place, not too inaka, and although I haven't received that amount of attention I do receive Alot More attention by the folk than I have received in many years in a big city in Japan.

Enjoy it for what it is cause when we leave ...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
luckbox



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 180

PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 8:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lived in both Tokyo and the countryside. I think on pure health-related issues (both mental and physical), I'd take the inaka over the big city any time. Clean air, lower stress, and just a more friendly, relaxed vibe. Loved it for the most part.

But I do think the small town welcome you speak of only extends so far and tends to have a time limit. It seemed that people were amazing to me up to about a year, but after that, I think folks got a bit suspicious with my decision to stay longer. Japanese people - in my experience - seem wonderful to tourists and short-term foreign workers, but they feel uncomfortable with longer-term foreign residents. At least was the case with me. But then, I think that same small town mentality exists in every culture.

The best strategy to prevent this is to simply change inakas every year or two. Move around a bit, try living in different parts of the country. I'm living in my second inaka setting and its completely different than the first, so quite loving it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
6810



Joined: 16 Nov 2003
Posts: 309

PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I understand what you say about time limit, but I wonder if it is to do with other things.

For example, most people you work with know you're there only short term, so they will treat you like a guest. When the time is up, a guest must go, right?

But, once you learn to communicate better than adequately in Japanese and start forging a life for yourself, making friends and all the stuff you would do back home, things are a little different. I would say the key word here is reciprocation.

If you are only in Japan short term, enjoy the hospitality. But if you are here for the long haul, you need to take a good look around and figure out what you owe and to whom. What kind of relationships have you built? Does your job position you as a guest? Are you a kind of sponge (not accusing anyone posting this thread BTW)?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cafebleu



Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Posts: 404

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 1:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting thread.

Remember that there is no category called "Life in Inaka in Japan" under which experiences fall. You'll have good experiences and bad - and just because some of us had a hard time until we moved to nearer the city doesn't make us wrong.

I was not a fan of inaka living because of the opposite to the stereotype of rural Japanese people treating you like a guest in their town. I lived in an area with people mostly over 50 years old and their lives revolved around telling their neighbours what to do.

Some of it was due to these women not having much to do in the first place - but in the UK those people don't get obsessed with telling their neighbours how to live their lives especially when they're not bothering anybody.

Neighbourhood associations are fine - as long as they are not abused. The block group is not there to nag people who have to go off to their students' activities on the same Sunday morning as cleaning the block. Even after they pay a 2,000 yen fine as I had to do a couple of times because I had been invited to my school's students' events.

They are not there to whine and moan about the fact that your house has a nice privacy securing hedge around it - and it's your landagent's business if they want it cut back, not your nosey neighbour's business.

They are not there to complain that your boyfriend stays over on Saturday and Sunday nights at times - especially when you live in a house with a garden and a fair bit of privacy and your neighbours hear nothing of your activities.

These were a few of my experiences (there were others along the same lines) in the first place I lived in when in Japan. I never lived in a rural area again.

As for the stereotype of the generosity of the Japanese - it depends. I was the giver in too many situations. What I think happens is that some Japanese (consciously or otherwise) feel that with a gaijin there is not the same relationship.

Therefore some J people who are so careful with reciprocating with other Japanese can become, sadly to say, sponges soaking up the benefits of a gaijin such as being happy to receive home country goodies and other presents without giving back. Or happily practising their English outside of class with never thinking of giving similar opportunity to the gaijin for free Japanese practice.

There are foreigners who have never been treated to a meal or taken out by Japanese. I knew some of them and I can't say they were people who had insensitive personalities or whatever. I do think in inaka there is a big element of the gaijin as curiosity. When some J people have satisfied their curiosity then they remove themselves from the gaijin.

I taught nice people at my first job in inaka but I can't say my generosity was reciprocated by most. I think this was the curiosity element. I put effort into being a host outside of class for some functions but it seemed a case of the invited bringing along their non studying friends to look at me, be entertained by me, and go away satisfied with what they had taken from it.

I also think the male teacher who preceded me was given different treatment largely because he was male. He said so himself to me when I caught up with him about six months after I had taken over his job.

He was always asked if he needed a lift to the airport, for example, when he went back to Australia on holiday. The offers were made by people who knew he had his own transport and a girlfriend. I was never asked.

He said to me it was a typical fussing over of males by Japanese, particularly women. He never gave presents or did what I did but was taken sightseeing and treated to meals etc. He said I was taken for granted whereas he did nothing and received his due as a male.

Maybe somebody will criticise me for this post, but that's what happened. Don't get too carried away by the generous Japanese stereotype. It's not always applicable.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
luckyloser700



Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 308
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cafebleu wrote:
Interesting thread.

Remember that there is no category called "Life in Inaka in Japan" under which experiences fall. You'll have good experiences and bad - and just because some of us had a hard time until we moved to nearer the city doesn't make us wrong.


No, it doesn't make you wrong. But it probably puts you in the minority of foreigners who think inaka folk are generally inhospitable to foreigners.
Wherever you go, you'll have good experiences and bad ones. Why state the obvious?

cafebleu wrote:
Some of it was due to these women not having much to do in the first place - but in the UK those people don't get obsessed with telling their neighbours how to live their lives especially when they're not bothering anybody.


It's almost guaranteed that there are people in the UK who do nose into their neighbors' lives. I know you're making a generalization here, but there are most likely people who are not from the UK who've spent time in the countryside there and felt just the same way about the countryfolk there that you do about J inaka folk.


cafebleu wrote:
Or happily practising their English outside of class with never thinking of giving similar opportunity to the gaijin for free Japanese practice.


You lived in the inaka. Did everybody speak English? I'm sure you had plenty of chances to use Japanese in your daily life. If you exhibit a level of skill with the Japanese language that is higher than that of the English skill-level of the J person you're talking to, and they continue to use English, then yes, you are being used. But, was this really the case with you, Cafe? I doubt that it was. So if your J language ability is practically nil and the J person you're talking to can communicate with you effectively enough using his/her broken English, it's only obvious that he/she will avoid using Japanese since it will render communication with you almost meaningless. This is not just the Japanese way of thinking; it's human. Did you ever ask someone to help you practice the J language?

cafebleu wrote:
When some J people have satisfied their curiosity then they remove themselves from the gaijin.


People all over the world do this. You don't think so? Grow up.

cafebleu wrote:
I taught nice people at my first job in inaka but I can't say my generosity was reciprocated by most. I think this was the curiosity element. I put effort into being a host outside of class for some functions but it seemed a case of the invited bringing along their non studying friends to look at me, be entertained by me, and go away satisfied with what they had taken from it.


Has it ever occurred to you that maybe you're a bit offputting?


cafebleu wrote:
Maybe somebody will criticise me for this post, but that's what happened. Don't get too carried away by the generous Japanese stereotype. It's not always applicable.


Defensive as always, Cafe. Why do you expect the criticism? Is it because you know you're always making yourself a target for it. If your posts were a bit more objectice than just plain whiny, you wouldn't always get the criticism.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cafebleu



Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Posts: 404

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:36 am    Post subject: Well, I was proved correct, wasn't I? Reply with quote

In anticipating criticism by whiney defenders of Japan who are so insecure when their world-view of Japan is disrupted by somebody who has had different experiences.

Why are you so quick to jump in and try to put me in what you think is my place? Your lack of sophistication on the eslcafe has been apparent in some of your posts and you're on the way to trolldom.

Sorry luckloser - but there ARE negative experiences in Japan and those of us who learnt by experience have nothing to learn from you. For a start, you weren't there. Second - why do you feel so threatened by a less than glowing critique of Japan? Third - when do I follow around people on the eslcafe, scolding them for their view of Japan?

I might agree to disagree with other posters but I think your chipping in is something else.

And no, I'm from the UK and people don't form themselves into neighbourhood associations, charge compulsory fees, and nag people if they have something else to do on a Sunday morning. And penalise them - and keeping nagging. They also don't care about other people's sex lives, especially if they can't hear anything going on.

How honest are your so called Japanese friends with you? When I moved out of inaka my J friends said they understood and that a lot of those women were 'himajin" - free timers but in a different way from the freeters whom they also criticise. Too much time on their hands and not much going on - and often not with their husbands.

Maybe I'll give you my J friends' emails so you can lecture them on how they should view Japanese people of this kind. I half believe you'd be silly enough to do it.

Your insecure, roseat defence of some people in Japan who really don't need defending as they make their experiences with gaijin a win-win one at the expense of foreigners, is a little gauche and fairly annoying. To feel threatened because others can't reinforce your view of the world in Japan is your quirk but I don't want to address it any longer.

I will say it again - there are people in Japan who will use up foreigners. In your home country you usually know how to deal with users, in Japan it's more difficult because of the lack of experience. I've been on the cafe longer than you have and I have never seen the need to be the thought police when people have negative experiences.

Maybe you're inexperienced in life or something. That's your prerogative but please stop your trolling. It was tedious before, it's tedious now. I'll do what I do with another poster and simply laugh at you in icons or just ignore you. I think the last option is the best.

I am willing to have debates on this topic with grown-ups, however.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
furiousmilksheikali



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1660
Location: In a coffee shop, splitting a 30,000 yen tab with Sekiguchi.

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cafebleu wrote:
Neighbourhood associations are fine - as long as they are not abused. The block group is not there to nag people who have to go off to their students' activities on the same Sunday morning as cleaning the block. Even after they pay a 2,000 yen fine as I had to do a couple of times because I had been invited to my school's students' events.



I'm not sure I understand this. Are you saying that self-appointed groups in your town were forcing local residents into working around the neighbourhood? Was this a paid part-time job? If not, how can these fines be legally enforcable?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
6810



Joined: 16 Nov 2003
Posts: 309

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

depends on the neighborhood furious.

Sometimes you get dirty looks for not going to clean the temple/shrine/toilet/school/recycle drop-off day.

Sometimes you have to pay a kind of neighborhood fee which "gets you out" of doing the work. You have to pay if you do it, but either way, you have to pay.

Some neighborhoods have this, others don't. It's all down to where you live.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cafebleu



Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Posts: 404

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:34 am    Post subject: Well now, Mike the sheik, thank you Reply with quote

For asking a question instead of rushing in to give me answers.

I don't know where you live in Japan and whether the location is city, suburban or rural, but commonly in the rural areas your neighbourhood is divided into blocks and these function as compulsory assocations.

They actually really were formed in the Pre WW2 military dictatorship Japan, and functioned to keep people under surveillance both then and during the War. A custom that has persisted in some rural locations! After the War they became more of a defacto local govt - a way of getting more money from the Japanese under the guise of association fees.

For example a third of the fee in my area went to Japanese charities. Before you all say "Great!" remember that Japanese charities waste a lot of money on administration and have been found to be corrupt in re-distributing money collected from block fees for purposes which it was never intended to cover. Such as going into individual's pockets a la NHK.

Personally I don't think that in such an expensive country with so many fees to burden individuals and families, these associations should make people pay a fee just because they happen to live there.

I also had a problem with the fact that a relatively poor person or one on a modest income had to pay the same amount of money as a family who had 4 salary earners. My neighbours for example.

I have a problem with flat taxes and I have a problem with regressive redistribution of taxes. For me the block fee was a tax, levied the same amount on all regardless of employment or not, wealth or modest means.

To redistribute the fees of those in particular who were of modest income to give trips to those who didn't have to work and were free to take advantage, or to send the children of comparitively wealthy families on a holiday to Tokyo to me is an abuse and it's a regressive use of people's money.

These associations are compulsory to join - ie you're not given a chance. You move in and the local rep is telling you about how you have to pay the fee. Yes, they distribute a newsletter and that can be helpful - depending on who wrote it. Yes, they have clean up days which I support. That's the work I'm referring to.

However, when it coincided on a Sunday with special events of students I taught and they had asked me to attend, I prioritised my students. On my block if you couldn't attend a clean up day (and it was always arranged for the benefit of the 50 somethings and nobody such as myself was ever consulted about their timetable on that day) you had to pay a 2,000 yen penalty.

I still find that unwarranted, typically of the legalistic mentality in Japan (yes, some of us understand the culture a lot better, particularly the culture of older Japanese, than others) and plain greedy. I paid up twice in my time there - I went to 4 clean up events but couldn't go to 2.

When I gave the association's leader the money it was received ungraciously and then she nagged about it again and again. This was an affluent woman of 55, with no working commitments whatsoever.

This system is usual in Japan's countryside as I mentioned. I have made my points about what I don't like about it reasonably. I had no problem with being a part of things but when I had other, real commitments they apparently weren't important. T

he system could be a very positive thing but it runs on the usual Japanese principle of doing something because it's always been done that way.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TK4Lakers



Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cafe,

Interesting post. As the OP, I just want to make one thing clear:

The original thread was not intended to say "inaka" is this way or the "inaka" will treat you like this.

I was only sharing my experience, saying that I am blesssed to be around so many kind-hearted people who genuinely care.

Although I may not agree with everything you wrote, thank you for posting your experience. That's exactly what it is, your experience. So it would be nearly impossible to to argue over who's right and how the inaka is really defined.

and you're right, the inaka isn't for everyone. As I originally stated, I thought the inaka wasn't for me either...but this past experience has loosened me up a lot more.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TK4Lakers



Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
But I do think the small town welcome you speak of only extends so far and tends to have a time limit. It seemed that people were amazing to me up to about a year, but after that, I think folks got a bit suspicious with my decision to stay longer. Japanese people - in my experience - seem wonderful to tourists and short-term foreign workers, but they feel uncomfortable with longer-term foreign residents.


Interesting post luckbox. I can understand why locals would get suspicious if a foreigner was to stay awhile, especially since a lot of these small, rural towns have these residents and their family name who have lived here for generations, and they might feel its being intruded upon.

And if I do stay longer than a year, I am going to keep an eye out. I think I've got good people sense, and will know who my real friends are compared to those trying to use me or treat me nice as a guest.


Last edited by TK4Lakers on Tue Sep 26, 2006 10:59 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TK4Lakers



Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:52 am    Post subject: Re: Well now, Mike the sheik, thank you Reply with quote

Quote:
These associations are compulsory to join - ie you're not given a chance. You move in and the local rep is telling you about how you have to pay the fee. Yes, they distribute a newsletter and that can be helpful - depending on who wrote it. Yes, they have clean up days which I support. That's the work I'm referring to.

However, when it coincided on a Sunday with special events of students I taught and they had asked me to attend, I prioritised my students. On my block if you couldn't attend a clean up day (and it was always arranged for the benefit of the 50 somethings and nobody such as myself was ever consulted about their timetable on that day) you had to pay a 2,000 yen penalty.

I still find that unwarranted, typically of the legalistic mentality in Japan (yes, some of us understand the culture a lot better, particularly the culture of older Japanese, than others) and plain greedy. I paid up twice in my time there - I went to 4 clean up events but couldn't go to 2.

When I gave the association's leader the money it was received ungraciously and then she nagged about it again and again. This was an affluent woman of 55, with no working commitments whatsoever.

This system is usual in Japan's countryside as I mentioned. I have made my points about what I don't like about it reasonably. I had no problem with being a part of things but when I had other, real commitments they apparently weren't important.


I'm also shocked from hearing this. and I'm pretty sure my inaka doesn't have something like this....or even if they did, I doubt they'd force me to join or pay up.

It seems like you might have been put in an unlucky situation. It just sounds a bit too harsh that local residents would force a foreigner to join and pay for something like this.


Last edited by TK4Lakers on Tue Sep 26, 2006 10:59 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Japan All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
Page 1 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

Teaching Jobs in China
Teaching Jobs in China