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joshsweigart
Joined: 27 Feb 2005
Posts: 66
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 Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 4:42 pm Post subject: corruption |
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Freud:
How do you have time to go out six nights a week and think of all those creative and interesting ways to insult and antagonize Alex? You must lead a busy life indeed...
I'm shocked that no one else has called you on your "Alex getting blue in the face again" comments.
Checkmate 
Your friend,
Josh |
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freudling1000
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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84 zlt per person in Warsaw. 120 zlt with large bag, again, per person in Warsaw.
Taxi drivers are the absolute worst in Warsaw. They scam locals all the time and take foreigners to the cleaners. I have grown to hate them, because I use them so much. And I know all their little tricks to get an extra 10 zlt.
I am going to look on my map and calculate distance to my popular destinations. With a number in mind, it will give me a good idea about how much they are ripping me off. |
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Alex Shulgin
Joined: 20 Jul 2003
Posts: 553
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| Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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| gregoryfromcali wrote: |
| Or you could just buy a ticket and show some respect for the country you are in. |
Why not actually quote what I say? Instead of editing it to make it look as if I said something different. |
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Alex Shulgin
Joined: 20 Jul 2003
Posts: 553
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| Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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| freudling1000 wrote: |
| The fine is 84 zlt. If you have a large bag it is 120 zlt. I have been pulled off many, many times. |
Good to see you really do know Warsaw so well!
| Quote: |
10. Luggage and animal fares:
(In accordance with new Regulation of transport of passengers and hand luggage in vehicles of municipal public transport in Warsaw, which is in force since 1 July 2004 year, transport of luggage as well as animals does not come under additional payment.
Until the resolution of Council of Warsaw new ticket tariffs, the record about payment for transport of luggage without a valid ticket still is a part of ticket tariffs.)
.........
12. Additional charges:
1/ Journey without a valid ticket 120,00*
(Attention! In accordance with The Order of minister of Infrastructure of the 20th January 2005 relative to the way of establishing additional charges (The Journal of Law No. 14, par. 117) since 31st January 2005 are force following values of additional charges:
- fiftyfoldness of price of the single fare ticket (i.e. 120 PLN) for the journey without a valid ticket,
- fourtyfoldness of price of the single fare ticket (i.e. 96 PLN) for the journey without any document entitled to reduced or free fare.
Until the resolution of Council of Warsaw new ticket tariffs, the record about additional charges is still a part of ticket tariffs.)
2/ Transport of luggage or animal without a valid ticket 48,00
(In accordance with new Regulation of transport of passengers and hand luggage in vehicles of municipal public transport in Warsaw, which is in force since 1 July 2004 year, transport of luggage as well as animals does not come under additional payment.
Until the resolution of Council of Warsaw new ticket tariffs, the record about payment for transport of luggage without a valid ticket still is a part of ticket tariffs.)
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3/ Additional charge for stopping or changing the direction of a vehicle without a justified reason 260,00
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4/ If the fines listed above in paragraphs 1/ and 2/ are paid within seven days from the moment when issued the fines are reduced by 30% |
http://www.ztm.waw.pl/tariffs-gb.html
So to recap: having a bag makes no difference to the fine for not having a ticket. But well done on knowing the city as well as you do. Explains how you managed to find that 90 metre flat in the old town for 450PLN.
| freudling1000 wrote: |
Taxi drivers are the absolute worst in Warsaw. They scam locals all the time and take foreigners to the cleaners. I have grown to hate them, because I use them so much. And I know all their little tricks to get an extra 10 zlt.
I am going to look on my map and calculate distance to my popular destinations. With a number in mind, it will give me a good idea about how much they are ripping me off. |
You use taxis a lot and you still don't know how to use them? Astounding. Phone for a taxi! Get a reputable company. I use the same two or three companies and have not been ripped off by any of them for the past seven years.
Good luck with the map. But why not just use automapa instead? It'll tell you the distance point to point to within 10 metres. And look on the bright side: with the 1500PLN you are saving on the cost of the apartment you have you can pay the extra 10PLN five times every day! |
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guy crouchback
Joined: 01 Oct 2006
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 7:14 pm Post subject: Re: Corruption in Poland |
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[quote="freudling1000"]How much do you combat on a daily basis? Loads for me. Country is backwards beyond reasoning. It is their mentalities coupled with people who don't have money and want to make a quick buck.[/quote]
Funny that that original message cited local corruption and yet the replies about metro and tram tickets seem to point to quite a high degree of corruption among us so so noble expats - don't forget that corruption requires two parties.
Suggesting that Poland is 'backward beyond reasoning' is just plain ignorant. |
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gregoryfromcali
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 1207
Location: People's Republic of Shanghai
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:08 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Funny that that original message cited local corruption and yet the replies about metro and tram tickets seem to point to quite a high degree of corruption among us so so noble expats - don't forget that corruption requires two parties.
Suggesting that Poland is 'backward beyond reasoning' is just plain ignorant. |
My point exactly. |
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Alex Shulgin
Joined: 20 Jul 2003
Posts: 553
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 8:32 am Post subject: Re: Corruption in Poland |
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| guy crouchback wrote: |
| Funny that that original message cited local corruption and yet the replies about metro and tram tickets seem to point to quite a high degree of corruption among us so so noble expats - don't forget that corruption requires two parties. |
Having actually counted the posts, there are two posts from people who paid a bribe (including one who wouldn't need to pay bribes if he realised that forgetting one's monthly card does not result in a fine, just take the ticket from the inspector and then go to the ZTM office on the corner of Plac Bankowy and show them the ticket and your monthly card and they will tear up the ticket). We don't know whether they offered bribes or were asked for them. Two people have been asked for bribes by officials who claimed they something wrong had been done when nothing wrong had been done.
| guy crouchback wrote: |
| Suggesting that Poland is 'backward beyond reasoning' is just plain ignorant. |
But that part you have absolutely spot-on. |
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Grrrmachine
Joined: 27 Jul 2005
Posts: 265
Location: Warsaw, Poland
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 11:14 am Post subject: |
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It does seem like there's two Polands - Old Poland, where bribes, nepotism, and the "nie ma" attitude run rampant, and the New Poland, where people want to work hard, have justice done and be governed by a system that works for them, rather than endlessly feeding itself (Im pointing at ZUS here.)
Unfortunately, Old Poland still rears its ugly head at times - the doctor who makes a casual remark that a small "incentive" can help a man have his knee rebuilt after a skiing accident in three weeks rather than six months (as happened to two of my associates; with an emphasis that if there IS no bribe, it WILL take six months); the estate agents who demand cash up front to gazump other buyers, and the taxi drivers that will drive you along the bus route if you don't know the direct way. Maybe this should include certain politic parties offering cash and power to opposite politicians willing to defect. THIS is the "backward beyond reasoning" - how do you break that cycle if the new generation are continually forced to follow Old Poland's methods? |
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cezarek
Joined: 29 Aug 2005
Posts: 149
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| freudling1000 wrote: |
| The fine is 84 zlt. If you have a large bag it is 120 zlt. I have been pulled off many, many times. |
No it isn't, as I said earlier, it's 120pln.
84pln is including the discount that you get if you pay in cash at their office within 5 days.
You can take a large bag on any tram or bus without paying for a ticket - that rule (also the one about tickets for domestic animals) was changed over a year ago.
The regulations are written on a notice in every tram and bus - the relevant parts, of course, in Polish. |
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Sgt Bilko
Joined: 28 Jul 2006
Posts: 136
Location: POLAND
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:11 pm Post subject: Just to balance things up |
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This might not apply to Warsaw but certainly here in the sticks...
Taxi drivers who round the fare DOWN and don't expect a tip
Doctors who give a free consultation because ..well I've no idea but I went to a private doctor because I noticed a few lumps and he had a look, said it was just gristle (lovely!) and told me I didn't have to pay anything because it had only taken 5 minutes.
Police officers who let you off because you are English (cycling the wrong way up a one way street) and smile because they like having you in the country.
Having said that, one thing to look out for is those huge communal bills in bars which you pay at 3am when you're in no fit state to check if they're correct - and I'm sure sometimes they aren't. |
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gregoryfromcali
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 1207
Location: People's Republic of Shanghai
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Why not actually quote what I say? Instead of editing it to make it look as if I said something different. |
My point is Alex, sure you may have wasted an hour of their time but you've just wasted an hour of your time.
Why not just obey the law?
Would you try to ride a taxi for free? Or drink a beer without paying?
Why should a bus or a tram be any different? |
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Alex Shulgin
Joined: 20 Jul 2003
Posts: 553
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:38 pm Post subject: Re: Just to balance things up |
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| Sgt Bilko wrote: |
This might not apply to Warsaw but certainly here in the sticks...
Taxi drivers who round the fare DOWN and don't expect a tip |
I do sometimes get drivers who round 9.40PLN down to 9PLN but more often I get drivers who will round it up to 10PLN, probably they would find the 40gr if told "and the rest please" but life's too short.
Certainly never get any who expect any kind of tip other than the groszy.
| Sgt Bilko wrote: |
| Having said that, one thing to look out for is those huge communal bills in bars which you pay at 3am when you're in no fit state to check if they're correct - and I'm sure sometimes they aren't. |
That is something to watch for but I've had more problems with Canadians than with Poles. More than a few of Canadians I've know had no problem at all about ordering drinks on the communal tab when they had no money at all in their pockets. I've heard Poles claiming to have only had one small beer but I've never heard any say "I got nothing, you guys cover me and I'll kick in extra next time".
These days I either just buy the second round for everybody (prefaced with "I still can't get used to running a tab. In England people buy rounds and I'm used to that. I have this embarassing habit of walking out of Polish bars without paying my share of the bill, so I'll get these and them I'm good for the night" if needed) or just keep handing the waitress cash for my drink when she brings each round. |
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freudling1000
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 8:02 pm Post subject: |
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| So you are English Alex? Would explain your endless banter. Maybe you have freckles, light hair and blue teeth too. Love the English I do! Queen Alex, the all knowing Warsaw God. |
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simon_porter00
Joined: 09 Nov 2005
Posts: 505
Location: Warsaw, Poland
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Maybe you have freckles, light hair and blue teeth too |
Blue teeth??
Being English myself I've heard most insults against us, but blue teeth?? |
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Alex Shulgin
Joined: 20 Jul 2003
Posts: 553
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| Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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| simon_porter00 wrote: |
Blue teeth??
Being English myself I've heard most insults against us, but blue teeth?? |
I know, he quite a strange little man isn't he?
And what is it with this obsession with blue?
| joshsweigart wrote: |
How do you have time to go out six nights a week and think of all those creative and interesting ways to insult and antagonize Alex? You must lead a busy life indeed...
I'm shocked that no one else has called you on your "Alex getting blue in the face again" comments. |
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