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does tefl alter your speech?
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enigma



Joined: 22 May 2003
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

shmooj wrote:
When I train new teachers though I notice their number one strategy is not to simplify their English. Rather they simply say the same thing slower and louder. This hardly ever works. I try to help them communicate more through simplifying their English and using a lot of body language and re-phrasing than speaking slowly. If they continue to speak slowly, it will not help our students cope with connected speech.

So, how do you cope as a teacher with your own English in your classrooms?


I am a newbie teacher (sort of - I have taught before, but not EFL), and simplified sentences with body language, spoken at a normal speed, has been my strategy so far. However, my Chinese students have trouble with the concept of listening for stressed words, and get very hung up if they miss a little word here or there, so they always ask me to speak more slowly. I want to teach them how to listen to, and make sense of, a sentence based on the important words, and not to get tied in knots over every little article if they get the general meaning. We'll see how this plays out over the year...
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Mark-O



Joined: 25 Jun 2003
Posts: 464
Location: 6000 miles from where I should be

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Shmooj,

I'm afraid to say that I don't know how my speech will alter due to teaching English as I have not started my TEFL career yet! I'm still trying to gain the credentials back home so I can start off properly and never have to come back to this hole again!

This is just a question I have been pondering lately - wondering how/if my speech would vary from what it's like now. Currently, I have a neutral english accent (I'm a 'soft southerner' as they say in the UK), but I was wondering whether there would be any danger of turning into a monotone TEFL robot - an english version of Stephen Hawkings voice synthesizer!

I anticipate my speed of speech to slow and to start pronouncing my t's more emphatically (many Brits have a tendency to relax the t, especially towards the ends of words). The main thing I will be really conscious of is talking to other ex-pats in the same manner - I could come across as really patronising ... either that or Hugh Grant! I'd prefer 'patronising' in that case.
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Gordon



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark-O,
Don't worry about sounding like Stephen Hawking.
Most ex-pats will understand and will at times sound like a record playing at a slower speed too.
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FGT



Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Posts: 762
Location: Turkey

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 1:06 pm    Post subject: Gesturing to excess? Reply with quote

How about increased use of gesture/body language when conversing with other native speakers?
Overheard/seen in the teachers' room today:
Colleague 1 (Scottish) to colleague 2 (American) : "There's a man working upstairs today." Accompanied by hand wafting in the air to imitate someone using a paint brush! I know this is something I do to excess too.

As far as speaking is concerned; I speak very clearly, and some say more slowly than normal, and I wondered if this had changed over the years (11) that I've been in TEFL so asked my brother his opinion when on a visit to the UK in the summer. Apparently it's my normal way of speech and he assured me I still sound like a native speaker. For this relief much thanks!
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Snoopy



Joined: 13 Jul 2003
Posts: 185

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 2:08 pm    Post subject: not at all Reply with quote

I was brought up to speak clearly articulated English and it makes no difference whether I am talking to the class, colleagues at work or a taxi driver back in the UK. Or even to my aged mother on the phone. If I am speaking French or Spanish, it happens at double or triple speed!
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Capergirl



Joined: 02 Feb 2003
Posts: 1232
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Gesturing to excess? Reply with quote

FGT wrote:
How about increased use of gesture/body language when conversing with other native speakers?
Overheard/seen in the teachers' room today:
Colleague 1 (Scottish) to colleague 2 (American) : "There's a man working upstairs today." Accompanied by hand wafting in the air to imitate someone using a paint brush! I know this is something I do to excess too.


Definitely. I know that I do this, and friends will sometimes comment on my gesturing...they are amused by it. Very Happy To say that I "talk with my hands" is an understatement. Laughing
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Lynn



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 696
Location: in between

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

shmooj wrote:
Mark-O - good topic.

In fact, as our English deteriorates while we are here as we forget idioms and slang etc, we often joked that if this happened at a faster rate than we learnt Japanese, we'd end up language-less!

?

I worked at a public elementary school in Japan for 2 years. I could already speak Japanese before I started that job. At the time English was not required in elem. schools, so there were no "Eigo" teachers. I communicated in Jpes everyday. The only English I used was, "Red! Blue!" or animal names.

There were times when I couldn't recall an English word. When I came back to the states, I found myself often language-less. My mind would just be blank. I knew there was such a word for an idea I had, but could't recall it in either language.
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dduck



Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Posts: 422
Location: In the middle

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think my language has changed much because of TEFL. As a Scot who's lived in England for 8 years, I already had to modify my language to talk to 'foreigners'. I also spent 3 non-tefl years in non-English speaking countries, so my speach was often simplified and slower. However, talking to foreigners with very little English was something new, so I've learned to speak even slower than before.

When I returned to Scotland I was shocked and horrified that some Scots, in my home town, thought I was English because I didn't use any of the local dialect (after about 6 months back in Scotland I started using the odd word again) and my accent is non-standard. English people wouldn't imagine for a second that I was English, and some Americans comment on my rolling R's, saying that I'm sometimes incomprehensible. My students don't have this problem, bizarrely enough!

Iain
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dmb



Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which alters your speech more. Teaching elementary or drinking too much beer?
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MELEE



Joined: 22 Jan 2003
Posts: 2583
Location: The Mexican Hinterland

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

veiledsentiments wrote:
After spending most of the last 18 years abroad teaching English, there is the obvious slowdown in speed and disappearance of vague idioms --- but the strangest thing to me is that North Americans suddenly think I am British!! Shocked


YES!!! that has happened to me. More often than not, people don't actually mistake me for British, but they ask me (even Brits) how long I lived in England(I've never been to Europe at all). In my case, I don't think it's so much pronunciation as word choice. New words and phrases have crept into my vocabulary as a result of hanging around with a multinational array of English speakers.

Cheers Wink
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jud



Joined: 25 May 2003
Posts: 127
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've gotten so used to telling the time using "past" and "to" that it's become instinct.

In the States we don't use this as much, so I get some pauses or strange reactions at times.

When I lived in Germany with my ex we spoke English at home, so I took on his accent. People in New York used to ask me where I was from. But now I speak Italian in my personal life and I've gotten my mid-Atlantic states English back.

I do occasionally say strange Italish things, though. Like "touristic" and "let's do a control."
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Sherri



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 749
Location: The Big Island, Hawaii

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A little rant here...
I really hate the way some native English speakers in Japan, start to use Japanese words and expressions when they are speaking in English. For example they tack "ne" or "desu-yo" on the ends of sentences, or sprinkle their conversation with words like "genki" (being in a good mood). I have seen countless people answer the phone "moshi, moshi" when they can't even carry out a conversation in Japanese, why bother? Especially when the caller is likely to be an English speaker.

I suppose if you are with your good friends you can communicate any way you want, but I find it strange when people I hardly know do this. I especially dislike it when people do it in job interviews!
Rant over.
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Gordon



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Sherri,
I like genki. It's a great word and is better to express how you are feeling or doing than a single English word.
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denise



Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish

PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2003 12:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sherri wrote:
A little rant here...
I really hate the way some native English speakers in Japan, start to use Japanese words and expressions when they are speaking in English. For example they tack "ne" or "desu-yo" on the ends of sentences, or sprinkle their conversation with words like "genki" (being in a good mood). I have seen countless people answer the phone "moshi, moshi" when they can't even carry out a conversation in Japanese, why bother? Especially when the caller is likely to be an English speaker.

I suppose if you are with your good friends you can communicate any way you want, but I find it strange when people I hardly know do this. I especially dislike it when people do it in job interviews!
Rant over.


I think I'm guilty of this... I do not speak Japanese (yet!), but every now and then words just come out--completely unintentionally.

Also, if I am trying desperately to convey something in Japanese, Spanish and even Czech words come out instead--anything to avoid resorting to English!

d
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shmooj



Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 1758
Location: Seoul, ROK

PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2003 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Denise, don't feel guilty about this. Language is about communication. There are no rules about sticking within the boundaries of one or another accepted definition of a language. Where is the English for natsukashii, genki, yada, ittekimasu, guruguru etc etc... ??? They don't exist so my wife and I use them all the time in our English with each other and other English speakers here in Japan who know them.

We love it. We also still use a couple of Hindi words we picked up years ago in India and can remember.

Why not? We do this because we have found that these languages have a word for something that more accurately describes what we want to say than any simple words in English do. So long as they communicate, what is the problem Sherri is ranting about Wink

Now, before anyone draws a knife on me I am talking about English speaker to English speaker communication in a foreign country. I am NOT talking about communication involving students learning English.

Mind you, it is pretty hard to help them when they ask me the English for words like guruguru though.... Confused
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