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Leon30
Joined: 18 Sep 2006 Posts: 60 Location: South Korea
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 6:42 am Post subject: JET Programme closing down...? |
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Hi. I heard that the JET programme is being scrapped. If so, does anyone know when, and also - how will the jobs in the public schools thayt were previously fille dby JET be filled in future....?
Cheers for any info. |
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maya.the.bee
Joined: 23 Sep 2005 Posts: 118 Location: Stgo
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 7:40 am Post subject: |
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the JET website says nothing about being scrapped. and they're taking applications for next year, so i wouldn't worry about it. |
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kdynamic

Joined: 05 Nov 2005 Posts: 562 Location: Japan
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 7:52 am Post subject: |
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It's just a rumor, the same rumor that seems to come around every year. |
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ironopolis
Joined: 01 Apr 2004 Posts: 379
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:54 am Post subject: |
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I would expect it's not true, but at the same time, it wouldn't surprise me if it turned out to be at least partially true sometime in the future.
Entry level job salaries in Japan have been falling across the board and I'm sure the bodies footing the JET salary bill must have realised they're now paying more than they need to.
I've also heard of a few boards of education up and down the country who've either actually withdrawn or were considering withdrawing from the JET scheme. Perhaps saving money was one reason, the teachers employed instead would be very unlikely to be on the same salary as a JET participant. Another reason I heard mentioned is that some boards of education were very unhappy with the quality of people they were getting.
Still, if the OP is thinking of applying next year, I'd say the advice above to not worry about it is probably good. It may change over the next few years, but someone coming next year for a year or 2 is perhaps not going to be affected. |
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furiousmilksheikali

Joined: 31 Jul 2006 Posts: 1660 Location: In a coffee shop, splitting a 30,000 yen tab with Sekiguchi.
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:15 am Post subject: |
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ironopolis wrote: |
Entry level job salaries in Japan have been falling across the board and I'm sure the bodies footing the JET salary bill must have realised they're now paying more than they need to.
I've also heard of a few boards of education up and down the country who've either actually withdrawn or were considering withdrawing from the JET scheme. Perhaps saving money was one reason, the teachers employed instead would be very unlikely to be on the same salary as a JET participant. Another reason I heard mentioned is that some boards of education were very unhappy with the quality of people they were getting.
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Increasingly BOEs have turned to agencies but I am not sure if that really has saved them money. The salaries of ALTs who work for agencies are lower than those of JET salaries but the ammount that the BOE pays to the agency is probably about the same as what they would spend on JET.
One of the problems BOEs have with JET is that whenever a JET ALT leaves halfway through their contract they don't get a replacement. The agencies use the possibility of replacement as a selling point (If the ALT leaves because thay are homesick, we'll give you another ALT. If you don't like the ALT we'll give you another one. If the school doesn't like the ALT we'll give you another one.)
That said, JET will probably be around for a few more years at least. |
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Chris21
Joined: 30 Apr 2006 Posts: 366 Location: Japan
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:48 am Post subject: |
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That rumor has been around for a long time, but the JET Programme is larger than it's ever been. Just a few years ago there were about 3000 new JETs per year (6000 total), and it's up to over 5000 newbies now (not sure what the combined total is). I've also heard that there is a waiting list for contracting organizations trying to land a JET.
Compared to what unionized teachers make at public schools, having a JET on staff isn't a big expense at all for most school boards. |
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kdynamic

Joined: 05 Nov 2005 Posts: 562 Location: Japan
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:24 am Post subject: |
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Furthermore they just changed the rules to JETs can recontract up to 5 years when it used to be limited to 3. Seems like they want them to stay, not go. |
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TK4Lakers

Joined: 06 Jan 2006 Posts: 159
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:56 am Post subject: |
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I don't know if there's any truth to this, but I can assume a little that JET is being downsized.
Lately, I've heard that dispatch companies are taking over in many of the cities and spreading into districts. In my own city, this is the final year JET is being contracted.
The reason why is that JET's are the BOE's full responsibility. They have to take care of them, watch after them, and be there for them. As you can imagine, the costs and time add up.
With dispatch companies, BOE's have little or no contact with the ALT at all, but rather through the company. In regards to the ALT, the BOE has little to no responsibility as well as the schools. |
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kdynamic

Joined: 05 Nov 2005 Posts: 562 Location: Japan
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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On the other hand, ALTs are now going into elementary schools, etc etc. Look, there are too many variables to think of it in such simple terms. The numbers of JET participants aren't falling. |
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ironopolis
Joined: 01 Apr 2004 Posts: 379
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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furiousmilksheikali wrote: |
Increasingly BOEs have turned to agencies but I am not sure if that really has saved them money. The salaries of ALTs who work for agencies are lower than those of JET salaries but the ammount that the BOE pays to the agency is probably about the same as what they would spend on JET.
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Yes, I agree that the amount paid to the agency would probably be about the same as the JET salary. But, as TK4Lakers pointed out, I think the other related expenses of "looking after" their JETs would probably mean they are still making a saving, in time, effort and resources as much as money. As I said, I suspect the reasons are not just financial. Increasingly a lot of BoEs have perhaps felt a bit hamstrung by the JET scheme. You mentioned yourself the problem they have if a JET quits early. Also, if they get lumbered with a complete idiot, they've often just got to put up with them as best they can. With an agency, the BoE may still ultimaltely be leaving the recruiting to someone else but they've got a lot more say in things than they had under JET. |
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natsume
Joined: 24 Apr 2006 Posts: 409 Location: Chongqing, China
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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I don't have the answer to this, but I wonder if, although many BOEs and prefectures are switching to dispatch companies, the overall total number of ALTs in the country is actually higher then ever? Anybody know?
Pre-Jet, in it's 20th year this year, were there even that many ALTs in Japan? |
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G Cthulhu
Joined: 07 Feb 2003 Posts: 1373 Location: Way, way off course.
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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Chris21 wrote: |
Just a few years ago there were about 3000 new JETs per year (6000 total), and it's up to over 5000 newbies now (not sure what the combined total is).
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Untrue. The _total_ is just under 6000, with an annual turnover of around 2500-3000 people. The rules have also, as kdynamic mentioned, also just been changed to allow people to stay 5 years instead of 3, although it's not automatic. JET topped out at just over 6000 in 2001 and has been slowly dropping since then Expect it to drop to around 5000 over the next five years or so, maybe lower if the "qualification" faction wins the current war at the Ministry. |
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luckbox
Joined: 18 Mar 2006 Posts: 180
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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ironopolis wrote: |
furiousmilksheikali wrote: |
Increasingly BOEs have turned to agencies but I am not sure if that really has saved them money. The salaries of ALTs who work for agencies are lower than those of JET salaries but the ammount that the BOE pays to the agency is probably about the same as what they would spend on JET.
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Yes, I agree that the amount paid to the agency would probably be about the same as the JET salary. But, as TK4Lakers pointed out, I think the other related expenses of "looking after" their JETs would probably mean they are still making a saving, in time, effort and resources as much as money. As I said, I suspect the reasons are not just financial. Increasingly a lot of BoEs have perhaps felt a bit hamstrung by the JET scheme. You mentioned yourself the problem they have if a JET quits early. Also, if they get lumbered with a complete idiot, they've often just got to put up with them as best they can. With an agency, the BoE may still ultimaltely be leaving the recruiting to someone else but they've got a lot more say in things than they had under JET. |
Yes, the tradeoff is not financial, but logistical. The fact is BOE's are very uncomfortable dealing with foreigners directly. The dispatch companies play up this selling point, saying, never again, "we handle all that stuff."
But here's the flip side of that coin. BOEs who did use JET before and switch to private dispatch will have to deal with the realities of ALTs getting a sub-par salary. ALTs who are underpaid may not behave as well, or may not stay as long. In short, the ALT product is weakened thru privatization. The JET contract salary wasn't pulled out of thin air. It was determined that this was the standard required to attract and keep teachers on the program. And that figure was not derived by a private sector profit motive.
In my 3 years as a JET, no JETs in my prefecture left early. A couple went home for funerals, but came back and finished their contracts. The reason? Despite all the shortcomings of ALT work, JET offers ALTs a good civil service salary/benefits package (including a nice pension refund at the end), so most will tuff it out for at least the year. Conversely, I can't count the number of times I've heard of private dispatch ALTs taking "the midnight train" out of Japan because they were unhappy, or simply resigned with notice prior to the end of their contract. I can't blame them. Faced with sometimes 210,000/month gross, plus 60-80,000 for rent, key money, furniture purchases, and other expenses such as flight cost over and initial living expenses (some dispatches insist you need 5,000 $ US to make it to the first check, which is sometimes 2 months away).
The point is, privatization of education has its own costs, and BOEs are discovering these unforseen costs. In my school district there are currently 5 dispatch companies competing for a piece of the ALT pie, and all of them have had problems keeping ALTs, according to conversations I've had with teachers. There have also been serious problems with ALTs who felt they were getting shafted, so they acted out, disobeyed rules, skipped out of duties... issues (money, sick leave, nenkyu and hours of work), most of which would not have arisen under a JET contract. Yes, of course JETs are known to bitch and whine, but the nature and gravity of their grievances seem quite a bit different than those of private ALTs.
Otherwsie, there's no way JET would suddenly be scrapped by a Japanese government. Change at the bureaucratic level simply doesn't happen that fast in Japan. It would be years of committees and consultations before any decision was made. |
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ironopolis
Joined: 01 Apr 2004 Posts: 379
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Posted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:00 am Post subject: |
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Yes, fair post, luckbox, I'd agree with most of that. I think it's certainly true in the present ALT situation that when saving money and cutting corners comes up against improving quality, there's only going to be one winner.
Having said that though, quite a few BoEs probably rated the quality of their JET participants rather lower than some of those JET participants did themselves, and they may feel that for less money and less hassle, they've ended up with an ALT product of at least similar quality.
I take the point about JETs seeing out their contracts in your area, and I'm sure that was the case in many places elsewhere too. However, from what I'd heard of unhappy BoEs, this was sometimes what they were actually bothered about. Whilst of course someone doing a runner after 5 months was a problem (and with an agency they can now be much more easily replaced), I'd heard they were more concerned about being stuck with people they really didn't like, who treated it like a holiday and were never going to leave early precisely because of the decent salary they were on.
Indeed, there's not much point paying a higher salary to get better quality if you don't match that higher salary with specific higher requirements. If they wanted better quality, I reckon they'd need to have a salary structure similar to other vaguely equivalent schemes in other countries, where they reward teaching qualifications or experience. But, as I said at the beginning, that's a big 'if', and is perhaps frequently not the case at all. Us foreigners tend to be largely the same, so let's just get them cheaper, eh!? |
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kdynamic

Joined: 05 Nov 2005 Posts: 562 Location: Japan
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Posted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 2:30 am Post subject: |
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Quote: |
JET topped out at just over 6000 in 2001 and has been slowly dropping since then Expect it to drop to around 5000 over the next five years or so, maybe lower if the "qualification" faction wins the current war at the Ministry. |
I think those number drops are also in large part due to gappei and nationwide belt tightening. |
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