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tanklor1
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 26
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 Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 5:13 pm Post subject: Getting into JET. |
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Sorry if this is a tired topic on this borad but I feel that I could use all the help that I can get.
I'm applying to the JET programme next month and I was woundering if any one here was able to get in? If so can someone tell me if I have what it takes to get in?
I have been studying Japanese at my university for going on Two and a half years, I also took a Japanese history coruse during my time at university. I also studied Chinese for a year and a half, I can't see how that would help me, but it may show that I can be diverse. I also spent some time volenteering at the ESL center at my university. My only downfalls are my GPA which is around 2.4 and the fact that I haven't left my home country yet.
If any former or current JETs are reading this in your opinion will I be good enough for JET? Or if you have any advice to give a newbie applying for the first time it would be great. |
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luckbox
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 180
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| Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 10:30 pm Post subject: Re: Getting into JET. |
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| tanklor1 wrote: |
Sorry if this is a tired topic on this borad but I feel that I could use all the help that I can get.
I'm applying to the JET programme next month and I was woundering if any one here was able to get in? If so can someone tell me if I have what it takes to get in? |
Despite what some have written on this site, JET has relatively lax entry requirements. All you need is a BA and some decent references and an interest in Japan. The application process (which is not to be confused with the credential requirements), is, however, long and tedious and requires patience. If you do your homework, and find out what JET is all about, then write up your application (including essays, references) accordingly, you will have as good a shot to get in as anyone else. And be sure all your documentation is in accordance with the requirements. JET is pretty strict about this, and if you fail to have one document required, your application will head straight for the trash bin.
As I tell anyone thnking about this, APPLY anyway. It's free, and you can decide later whether you want to accept a position if offered. I, for one, am grateful I did apply, rather than leaving myself at the mercy of companies like NOVA or INTERAC.
Good luck. |
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kdynamic
Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:24 am Post subject: |
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| You just never can tell with JET. Try and see what happens. You have some of the qualities JET looks for, but it will most likely come down to things you can't list here, like how well you interview and what impression your personality gives. |
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Chris21
Joined: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 366
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:14 am Post subject: |
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It depends on where you applied. Some regions, where JET is not very popular, will take everyone that shows up to the interview. I heard anecdotal stories of applicants in the US southeast (Atlanta, Florida, etc) going to the interview and finding out that they didn't need to interview and were automatically accepted. I've also heard of really qualified applicants in Toronto and the Pacific Northwest (Seattle, Vancouver, etc) being turned away. It just depends on the number of applicants, and how close the consulate/embassy is to filling their quota.
Probably the best tip I can think of is be friendly and enthusiastic, while at the same time professional. Smiling is also important. |
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luckbox
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 180
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| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:22 am Post subject: |
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| Chris21 wrote: |
| It depends on where you applied. Some regions, where JET is not very popular, will take everyone that shows up to the interview. |
I think this is true. If you meet the general requirements (BA, plus an expressed interest in Japanese culture), then after that it pretty much becomes a numbers and regional quotas game. Therefore, the interview is very important and usually is the deciding factor. Learn a few Japanese phrases, and maybe slip a few in at the interview to show you are going the extra mile. If you have any facial hair, shave it off. The more conservative you appear, likely the better. Suit and tie goes without saying.
In my region, the year I got in, I was told that every single applicant that made the alternate list was eventually hired. So even if you don't get in with the first string, your chances are quite good as an alternate. |
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tanklor1
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 26
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| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for everyone's help. I started going though the hassels of filling out all of the information and photocopying them. Which is pretty much three of everything. I have to talk to my Japanese Professor about writing a referrence letter.
As for my location I live in Newfoundland Canada. If they want an interview I'll have to go to Montreal to have it. As far as I know they are only two people from my University who is trying; me and a fellow classmate of mine who also has spent the last two years studying Japanese.
As for the interview should I cut my hair? I normally only cut it once a year so it can be quite long by the time of the interview. Again thanks for the advice. |
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furiousmilksheikali
Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1660
Location: In a coffee shop, splitting a 30,000 yen tab with Sekiguchi.
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| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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| tanklor1 wrote: |
| As for the interview should I cut my hair? |
Yes. |
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G Cthulhu
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Posts: 1373
Location: Way, way off course.
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| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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| luckbox wrote: |
| Chris21 wrote: |
| It depends on where you applied. Some regions, where JET is not very popular, will take everyone that shows up to the interview. |
I think this is true. |
Nah. Low application numbers skew the chances upwards slightly, but if you're really not what JET is looking for then there's no way you're getting in regardless. You might want to express some faith in the application process and also assume that perhaps everyone offered an interview is actually suitable for JET - you're constant negative outlook on JET warps your thinking IMO. (I don't for an instant think the application process does that, btw, but it's as reasonable a suggestions as your own idea!)
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If you meet the general requirements (BA, plus an expressed interest in Japanese culture), then after that it pretty much becomes a numbers and regional quotas game. |
Untrue. The consulates provide lists of candidates and scores. The decisions are made by CLAIR - while they have rough goals for each interview location they will and do move those numbers to take the higher scoring candidates. In most instances thism movement is very small in any given year because the programme continues to have far more applicants than it has places available.
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Therefore, the interview is very important and usually is the deciding factor. Learn a few Japanese phrases, and maybe slip a few in at the interview to show you are going the extra mile. |
With most interviewers it will mark you out as a fanboy and drop you down the lists. If you're an ALT applicant the only time you should use Japanese at the interview is when you're asked to, if at all. If you're a CIR then you can expect a heavy dose of it and "dropping in a few phrases" is not going to cut it.
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In my region, the year I got in, I was told that every single applicant that made the alternate list was eventually hired. So even if you don't get in with the first string, your chances are quite good as an alternate. |
Alternate success rates vary wildly from year to year and where you applied _does_ play a role in that. If, for example, there are fewer people being replaced in a year then the number of alternates goes down (both listed and usually selected (it's all a numbers game)) and if there are late dropouts then those called up to fill the places are more carefully screened to match the CO requests, although in general (i there is no other influencing factor) CLAIR simply runs through a list of consulates in sequence taking the alternates. In reality, the CO's being able to make late requests and have them more closely matched, tends to mean that Canadians and New Zealanders have a _slightly_ higher chance of being called up as an alternate than Brits and Americans do simply because they are requested more often. It is also a straight numbers game because there are fewer alternates in most countries compared to the US, so their lists are exhausted more quickly than the US ones.
Don't let any of that put you off applying: applying is free and so long as your materials are in order and your SOP is coherent and relevant (they _tell_ you what they want to hear!) then you're pretty much guaranteed an interview - GPA _is not relevant_ so don't worry about it. Once you've got an interview it's then yours to screw up! :)
Good luck. |
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luckbox
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 180
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 4:50 am Post subject: |
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| G Cthulhu wrote: |
| Don't let any of that put you off applying: applying is free and so long as your materials are in order and your SOP is coherent and relevant (they _tell_ you what they want to hear!) then you're pretty much guaranteed an interview. |
Cthulhu and I agree on the essential point here. If you have a BA and get all your documents in, you will almost certainly get an interview, and as I said, that interview will decide your fate with JET, so appear conservative and be on your best behavoir, and don't be a wise-ass.
Indeed, don't let any of Cthulhu's JET-speak or CLAIR gobbledy-gook about point systems and Consulate rules dissuade you in the slightest. Alot of that is classic Japanese tatemae (or offialdom), setting up the appearance of hyper-professionalism in a bid to appear important and extremely legitimate. The honne is that if you don't completely blow the interview, you're as good as in, especially if you are in a region where there's a low application turnout. Period.
Knowing a bit of Japanese may help your cause, and interviewers for JET have indicated as much to me (it may amount to a small edge or none at all, or if you overplay it it could hurt your cause, depends who is interviewing you and what mood they happen to be in, and how you present yourself). I think an honest konnichiwa followed by a bow as you enter the interview room can't hurt you. The actual interview is pretty much common sense stuff. I actually thought I did miserably on my interview, but I was offered a job nonetheless. Go figure.
Not to mention, in my 3 years on JET I was endlessly surprised by the wide range of qualifications and personalities among JETs and how so many who shouldn't have, did manage to slip thru the CLAIR point system. And I'm not just talking about just the crazies, sex fiends, alcoholics and morons. How often I caught myself uttering under my breath a comment like... "How the fvck did that yahoo over there with the dreadlocks and pierced nose and gold chains get thru the JET gate????..." The lack of professionalism among JETs in my prefecture at these joint ALT-JTE midyear conferences was often shocking. JTEs (Japanese teachers) all in business attire, their ALT counterparts showing up late, if at all, in kaki shorts and Aloha shirts, sporting bed-hair, with booze still on breath from night before....
Trust me, the JET standard is not hard to achieve. You can do it!!! |
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kdynamic
Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 5:11 am Post subject: |
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Uhhhh IIRC, luckbox, G Cthulhu is a JET interviewer? I think he would know what he was talking about.... And what are you talking about thowing terms like honne and tatemae around? JET gets a lot of applicants and they only take the ones they think are the best. That's pretty straightforward. Their criteria may seem opaque to us, but people who do interviews have it all laid out for them and they always say it's pretty much cut and dried.
And just because you have piercings doesn't mean you're not professional. I have 6 above the neck 
You and I always lock horns, but that's because you always present this bitter picture of JET. Remember how it is to be a bright-eyed newbie for once! And if you go on about how easy it is when the reality is 4 out of 5 people don't make it, how is the OP going to feel if he is one of those 4? |
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hentaigaijin
Joined: 05 Oct 2006
Posts: 104
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 5:23 am Post subject: |
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do you not think that JET is somewhat overrated? after all, being an ALT could be seen as demeaning in many respects and doesn't exactly constitute teaching experience.
the money is quite good and if you get free rent then you are laughing. however, you would do just as well to head to London or New York after graduation, get some phat sales job for a couple of years and bank the cash, and then go to Japan and teach (perhaps get the masters first).
i was rejected by JET but would not apply to them now because i am overqualified. not knocking the programme, which is obviously a terrific success, but it sometimes sounds kind of pathetic to hear some of things that JET people think are achievements (like my mate who bragged that he got to select text books and have extra responsibilities that most jets could never enjoy) - it just goes to show how hard it is to make a career out of a college degree these days.
then again, perhaps being a JET affords you certain connections/ references for future work in japan... true or false? |
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luckbox
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 180
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 5:50 am Post subject: |
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| kdynamic wrote: |
| Uhhhh IIRC, luckbox, G Cthulhu is a JET interviewer? |
Yes, I was aware of his affiliations, but I'll let him clarify his position with CLAIR. Nonetheless, even he, I'm sure, will agree that interviewing is not an exact science and contains an important element of human judgement. My comment was based on a conversation I had over a few drinks at the consulate sendoff party in my region, with one of the guys (a former JET himself) who was part of the consulate interview panel. He said he personally liked applicants who tactifully exhibited a bit of interest in the Japanese language.
The point about tatemae and honne... JET is a Japanese institution, which plays by Japanese rules and cultural norms. Anyone working for CLAIR or towing the JET line is going to be issuing lots of official sounding utterances, which amount to usually nothing more than window dressing. This is especially true in the Japanese business world or culture at large. Of course someone from CLAIR is going to proclaim JET's hiring standards to be tough and highly scrutinizing, and fair, and good, and so on...because that's the image JET is trying to send out. If Cth is saying this as an employee of CLAIR, then he is doing so with a vested interest. Fair enough. The CLAIR official position deserves as much consideration as yours or mine or anyone elses.
I have no stake in CLAIR, other than having been a former JET, so I feel in a neutral position to call it the way I see it. I have no vested interest defending JET or criticizing JET. I'm giving you pure honne, like it or leave it. I doubt, however, that a spokesperson for JET/CLAIR, or someone with a vested interest, is going to be giving pure honne.
I'm sharing my opinion based on 3 years in the program. JET is easy to get into if you have a BA and play your interview cards right. Period. Anyone who says otherwise is trying to sell you something.
Last edited by luckbox on Wed Oct 25, 2006 6:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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luckbox
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 180
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 6:05 am Post subject: |
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| kdynamic wrote: |
| You and I always lock horns, but that's because you always present this bitter picture of JET. Remember how it is to be a bright-eyed newbie for once! And if you go on about how easy it is when the reality is 4 out of 5 people don't make it, how is the OP going to feel if he is one of those 4? |
PS: Kdynamic, consider our discussions to be beneficial to those wanting a broader picture of what JET really is like. If they only read you, they'd have this fairytale image of the wide-eyed gaijin contributing to Japan's bold and noble cause of internationalization, whilst attending tea ceremonies in Kyoto's neatly raked Zen gardens.....  I, however, have a different take, which I claim neither true nor false, just honest, based on my experience in the program. I loved it for the most part, but it's not without its faults. I think you and me are both right.
The issue at hand - entry requirements - is plain as day to me. A BA and enthusiasm and an ability to gather all your required documents and CV and present it neatly and professionally -- and you're as good as in. If you met all the qualifications and conducted yourself like a pro at the interview, yet still failed to get in, this does not reflect poorly on you! So anyone reading this, who didn't get in, should not feel it reflects poorly on them! It's simply an issue of quotas, and you may have been unlucky. And yes, some people are simply too good for JET, far too qualified.
If you want a glimpse into the calibre of talent that passes for JET, go spend a few months reading Bigdaikon.com. You too will be asking how many of these people qualified. Trust me, it ain't that hard to get in. You have no control over the quotas and numbers at play, but otherwise, it ain't hard to enter JET. |
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craven
Joined: 17 Dec 2004
Posts: 130
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| Posted: Thu Oct 26, 2006 7:09 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, and I'm going to jump in here, just like I did on the last thread playing down JET's entry requirements, and say they are INDEED much more stringent than any of the big box eikaiwa companies. If you are comparing applying to JET to applying as a certified teacher at an accredited international school, or with a position at a reputable university in Japan then yes, I guess you could say they're not overly high.
And comparing all folks working on the JET program to the gutter-denizens posting on Big Daikon is a little unfair...remember, most people who are actually enjoying the program and getting involved with school and community life don't take the time to post on a second-rate chat site.
OP, a trick for the interview. Show both an interest in, and knowledge of Japan. More important than that, demonstrate that you have plans for AFTER the program...be it grad school, or a job using your Japanese abilities back in your home country. They want folks that will be serious about working in Japan, but definately not folks that want to consider putting down roots when their time is up  |
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G Cthulhu
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Posts: 1373
Location: Way, way off course.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 26, 2006 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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| luckbox wrote: |
| kdynamic wrote: |
| Uhhhh IIRC, luckbox, G Cthulhu is a JET interviewer? |
Yes, I was aware of his affiliations, but I'll let him clarify his position with CLAIR. |
You appear to be under the strange impression that if I do interviews for the Consulates that I must swallow and regurgitate their line without any thought of my own? _You're_ the one displaying the stronger cliched Japanese traits there!
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Nonetheless, even he, I'm sure, will agree that interviewing is not an exact science and contains an important element of human judgement.
My comment was based on a conversation I had over a few drinks at the consulate sendoff party in my region, with one of the guys (a former JET himself) who was part of the consulate interview panel. He said he personally liked applicants who tactifully exhibited a bit of interest in the Japanese language.
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There you go again with your assumption that a single experience is somehow universal. Sorry, I disagree. :) My own experience, across interviewing in two different countries and three consulates, knowing the actual guidelines and instructions and standards and literally dozens of interviewers besides myself, is that trotting out a few pat Japanese phrases and acting like a fanboy will not do you any favours in the majority of cases. Yes, it's about human judgement. And I'm letting you know that based on my own experience, it's not a good idea.
Tactfully expressing interest, yes. Doing what was asked about doesn't count as tactful IMO. <- & that's the important point: IMO. Feel free to try it.
After all, you seem to know more about it, don't you? :roll:
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The point about tatemae and honne... JET is a Japanese institution, which plays by Japanese rules and cultural norms. Anyone working for CLAIR or towing the JET line is going to be issuing lots of official sounding utterances, which amount to usually nothing more than window dressing.
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Ahhhhh, did you _read_ what I wrote about how the _process actually works_? I was trying to give people an insight and let them try and play the numbers from there if they wanted. Write it off out of hand all you want, but that's still the way it works. Granted, my discription was messy, but hey, you're a bright guy - I'm sure you'll figure it out; after all, you've got a degree and that's all you need, isn't it? :)
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This is especially true in the Japanese business world or culture at large.
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LOL. You're speaking from more experience here, eh?
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Of course someone from CLAIR is going to proclaim JET's hiring standards to be tough and highly scrutinizing, and fair, and good, and so on...because that's the image JET is trying to send out. If Cth is saying this as an employee of CLAIR, then he is doing so with a vested interest. Fair enough. The CLAIR official position deserves as much consideration as yours or mine or anyone elses.
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So what you're saying, aside from not understanding how JET recruits despite (claiming) to have gone through it yourself, is that you _didn't_ actually read a single thing I wrote. Go back and have another go. :) Point out to me where I said JET hiring practices were any of those things. IIRC, I didn't make many (any?) comments on those lines.
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I have no stake in CLAIR, other than having been a former JET, so I feel in a neutral position to call it the way I see it. I have no vested interest defending JET or criticizing JET. I'm giving you pure honne, like it or leave it. I doubt, however, that a spokesperson for JET/CLAIR, or someone with a vested interest, is going to be giving pure honne.
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Fine. It's your opinion. It's worth how much on the net? The problem is that you don't seem to understand the difference between opinion and fact. kdynamic doesn't make that mistake. She is clear about it. You don't seem to understand where the first stops and the second starts. You also seem to have a rather large chip on your shoulder about JET.
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I'm sharing my opinion based on 3 years in the program. JET is easy to get into if you have a BA and play your interview cards right. Period. Anyone who says otherwise is trying to sell you something. |
And there you go again, presenting your opinion as if it were fact and refusing to even _consider_ that anything else might be the case. Look, no one is going to argue with your _opinion_ about JET. It's just another opinion, just like mine or kdynamic's. But you seriously shoot yourself in the foot when you try and suggest that someone stating _facts_ about how the system _actually works in practice_ is _wrong_ - especially when you have no direct knowledge of that aspect and no more experience than any other JET fresh off the boat. |
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