Job Discussion Forums

[Queen of Sheba]

Do you think ESL teachers, and expats in general, are privy to unusual information and see odd things happening to their students and in Saudi Society? Why it is that some expats who work and travel in the Middle East, feel they have some great insights and should therefore write a book? Some like Jean Sassan and Asne Seierstad have even gone so far as obviously making stuff up. Do you find expat life in KSA worth writing about?

[Stephen Jones]

Presumably you would have criticized Thiesenger for writing Arabian Sands!

An outsider often sees things an insider doesn't.

The answer to your question is that it all depends on the quality of the book.

[Queen of Sheba]

That's interesting that you would bring Thesiger into this discussion since I never mentioned the Orientalist roots of Middle Eastern topics, but since you opened the door... Do you consider expats in KSA to be explorers documenting a vanishing culture?

I do agree that outsiders often see things that insiders don't see. I just wonder what those 'untouched' topics maybe in modern day KSA. Especially since some recent writers seem to be simply making things up or embellishing, or deceiving their hosts about their true agenda to publish. I realize this is nothing new, but could it be that the social topics and exploration days of Thesiger are tapped out?

[Stephen Jones]

[Stephen Jones]

Done a bit of googling. Seierstad's book is a novel (making things up in a novel is not unknown).

Sasson wrote about Kuwait, and was hardly the typical expat. I doubt if either you or I have sufficient knowledge of the private life of Royal Families to judge whether she made things up or not.

[desert date]

...

[veiledsentiments]

[Cleopatra]

Stephen, I'm not sure which version of "the google" you have access to, but it has produced rather odd information on the, um, 'works' of Sasson and Seirstad. And yes, I have read the books concerned (but don't tell anyone!)

[Queen of Sheba]

Thanks for clarifying my points VS and Cleo, I assumed everyone has read the books or at least the critical reviews of Sassan, and Seierstad and is aware of the allegations of lies I refer to, before criticizing the validity of my argument. There seem to be a load of others like them writing about the Middle East, and not just about KSA. Actually Sassan seems to have connection to Iraqi women now as well, funny how they all seek her out isn't it, when we are living and working with Saudi women and other women from the Middle East every day and have yet to become privy to their intimate details and family secrets. For those not aware of the accusations of plagiarism and deceit at worst and piles of embellishment or compiled stories of several people then sold as one tale, at best, read the Observer or the Guardian for some book reviews.

My question is actually around the ethics and the reasons behind making stuff up for a fast buck, I mean book, and about why these seems to be making sales. What's the motivation when you can only publish once before an entire backlash of criticism and dishonor hits you publication. You may not even be able to publish or work again, if it�s really obvious-such is the case in another genre recently when "A Million Little Pieces" by James Frey was found to be fasle and he admitted to telling tall tales.

As for Orientalist, they were certainly a more dignified, well educated and possibly well intentioned sort, but none-the-less, they have a way of looking at the region and selling it as the "Oh the poor, illiterate Bedouins are so sweet and cute once you get to know them...so go one fellow Brit never fear the barbarian - we should get to know them, and get them to like us before we bleed them dry of their resources and reformulate their governments into Sheikhdoms that work with our agenda."

Since Stephen made the connection, albeit unknowingly I believe, I have to ask if these new Middle Eastern 'writers' are just modern day Orientalists -or do we do the dignified and educated men of the 18th and 19th centuries, who wrote about the Middle East and had an explorer's spirit, a disservice by comparing them to the new lot of authors. At least they had class and spirit...even if it all lead to the same patronizing attitude towards the Middle East.

[The_Prodiigy]

Correct.

A wealth of possibilities in The Desert can be exploited for comic effect. KSA is unique in the situations that spring up.

Banned from dining with a female friend or being stopped on the street for wearing a silver neck chain. Goofy-looking security personnel at road blocks trying to appear menacing.

An underground network of exchange of Johnnie Walker Black Label and the trials and tribulations associated with arranging a decent game of "footy".

Somewhat more alarming is the twists and turns involved with administration trying to PRISE your British passport off them to take a vacation.

The giggles resulting from one or two students becoming upset when Hangman was introduced to the class and cloak and dagger needed to make a date.

Watch, observe, take notes and prepare the narrative.
It can't last long.

[Queen of Sheba]

If the same three repeated ESL and KSA anecdotes would a book make, you would have sold yours by now.

[Cleopatra]

[007]

A lot of books were written about the life of the princes and princesses (positive or negative). The majority if these books are exaggerating, and sometimes, fabricating things, like in the tabloid newspapers, just to sell their stories, regardless of the correctness of the story.
So, at the end you cannot judge 100% if the book was telling the true story or just fabricating them. Because these type of books are like the films in Hollywood, just to get money and deceive innocent readers!
And to be fair to the Saudi culture, there are some positive stories about the princesses, I have heard from closed friends, that some princesses were very generous, and helped poor and needy people, both Saudis and foreigners, to get medical operations in the West or in specialized government/private hospitals in Saudi, and they paid money for that. And some of these stories you will not find them in any book, because the princesses like to keep their help secret, so that they will not be accused of doing their work for publicity or to show-up in front of the public.

[Queen of Sheba]

Good point Cleo, money is there for the making and taking if you can write a nice trashy piece about the region, so let's hop on board! Do you have any ethics? A few tales to exaggerate? After all, it maybe better than what we are doing now...

[Queen of Sheba]