Job Discussion Forums

[Saturnine]

Edit #2: So i tried to make the post more palatable? Questions marked in italics are main ones i'm after, still appreciate comments on the rest. Hope this thread isn't doomed. Scratch that italics looks weird, i'll underline.

My girlfriend and I are interested in getting jobs teaching english abroad starting fall 2007. We prefer North Africa and the Middle East.

I have one year of teaching english in Taiwan + two undergraduate degrees, a BS in psych and a BA in philosophy. Its feable, but i have been doing at least a little writing work with some of my older advanced students. It seems Asia focuses generally a bit more on speaking, maybe I could promote that in my credientials? My girlfriend has not yet taught abroad and will be graduating this spring with a BA in psych. However she has a year plus experience working in daycare centers? So some relevant experience teaching the very young letters and numbers and such. Is getting a job teaching kindergarten/elementary school level children any easier than teaching older children/adults? Are the masters and above requirements for all levels of education?

From what I've read on this forum we're pretty underqualified for a lot of jobs in the Middle East, but are fine candidates for places like Egypt and Morocco? Additionally, we are young. I'll be 23 she will be 22, which is bad for the ME job market right? The pay would most likely be very low in places like Egypt and Morocco making it hard to save much money, whereas if we could get jobs in the UAE, Qatar, etc the pay would be fantastic for this kind of job. Is this accurate? (If i get a job in the UAE teaching younger kids, assuming this is easier, would the pay necessarily still be significantly higher than Egypt/Morocco? I'm assuming yes.)

Are there other places that we should consider around the Middle East / North Africa similar to Egypt and Morocco where we could more easily get jobs? I believe i've heard Libya mentioned as a similar situation, is that so? Anywhere else i should look at?

We're obviously interested in working very close by or in the same school so that we can live together (the later seems easier to arrange?). Does one just look for jobs with multiple openings, send both applications and indicate its a couple's application? Any recommendations there?

How are unmarried couples percieved in this job market? Should we indicate that we are not married, attempt to slyly implicate ourselves as a married couple... Advice please.

My impression from reading the forums is that two foreigners are usually fine doing what they want, living together etc? A worry is that my girlfriend is 1/2 lebanese and thus looks somewhat not pasty white despite being very much an American, she does not speak Arabic for example. I on the other hand am pasty white. As well, she's muslim and i'm not, and we're not married... I haven't lived in the Middle East so I don't know what to expect. How much harrasment would we generate in a predominatly muslim country specifically for being a mixed couple? Would we even be able to rent a room together? I really don't know what to expect here... ?

One last thing. While finishing my undergrad degreees i took stats for a year and then tutored statistics courses for ~1.5 years (for psych). I haven't gone into advanced graduate level statistics but i have an awful lot of experience with a variety of college level introductions to statistics. As I've read it math and sciences are all taught in english in this part of the world? If this is true, would I have any chance of getting a job teaching stats given this limited experience?

- Saturnine

[veiledsentiments]

Considering the mix of details here... my first impression is that you are trolling...

Two early 20 year olds with little education - none related to education - and even less experience - who want to shack up in the Middle East and the woman is a Lebanese Muslim????

Or is it another example of the abysmal lack of cultural knowledge of young Americans?

VS

[Saturnine]

Trolls are usually more amusing in my experience...

i know so very little about where i'm going, i'd love to know more... Is this all the answer i'm getting?? I think I asked at least a dozen different questions in there. Perhaps my block of text is too fearsome?

Anyway gentle maiden, I have neither green skin nor pointy tusks ;(

[Sheikh Inal Ovar]

Perhaps if we all helped with a point here and there ...

[Saturnine]

All i meant by arab, was mistaken on the word's meaning, was i'm interested in living in a predominently muslim population which i think turkey is? That's a silly aside. I was mostly jesting on the Canadian flag itself, but i guess i was wondering about how tense things are at the moment for americans abroad which is stupid as i don't have a clue where i'm going to end up so its too variable... SO - forget that part Thank you for responding!
Edit: my post seems to be pretty indirect sometimes, sorry about that. I would still love to get general and specific advice concerning the many issues, hopefully i can be less defensive and more usefully interested as well...
Henry: ... Starting to think i should start over with a new account and small short info lite questions?

[Henry_Cowell]

[samesamebutdifferent]

On my last count, before your edits, I reckon - 856 lashes for her- 1235 for you. Stoning for her- Beheading for both- hanging for you - 11 years prison for her - 22 for you ... and 24 other forms of punishment varying in degrees of state, public and private involvement. The help you may receive from your embassy might vary depending on the country of employment. Lovely go for it ! You are obviously keen on this type of entertainment. Wages of relative sin my boy.

[007]

Saturnine,
Why not try Libya, and send your girlfriend's CV and yours to his Excellency, Colonel Gadaffi, where he can offer you a job as a private statistics teacher, where you will be responsible for counting the gun bullets produced in his Al-fateh factory in Tripoly, and your girlfriend can work as a body guard for his Excellency. I have heard that he is paying $5000 /month for English/Statistics teachers, and $10000 for women body guards.

So, Harry up, the posts are limited.

Hi Excellency contact address is:
Colonel Gaddafi
POB 001
Tripoli
Libya.

Good luck!

[veiledsentiments]

OK... I'll assume that you are just one of my embarrassing young countrymen and don't live under a bridge.

From the responses you can see that people think that your ideas and approach show that what you really need to do is spend a few days reading all the posts around this board. There have been many discussions of people living together without being married. The detail of it being relatively safe for two Westerners is out the window for you because she will look Arab and is a Muslim. That makes it a whole new ball game and you would definitely be playing with fire. You can't just 'pretend' to be married as they will ask for the documents to prove it. Even if you married her, it could cause problems for her unless you have officially converted yourself - unless she takes your name and says that she is Christian. And don't expect the US embassy to help you out. They are notoriously really only there to help American corporate/military interests. We taxpayers get short shrift.

My advice - for what it is worth - is that if you want to go overseas and teach along with your Lebanese Muslim girlfriend, go to Asia and stay away from the Middle East.

VS
(PS... as for the big pay of the Gulf... you're not eligible for any of the decent paying jobs and the cost of living is as high or higher than the US...)

[Stephen Jones]

Surprisingly enough I know of at least one case in Saudi where a Moslem woman married to a Christian husband got residence on her husband's iqama.

I doubt if it is the norm though.

As has been said, Westerners living in sin won't raise an eyelid in the UAE, and shouldn't produce problems if done discretely in Saudi or Kuwait, but the fact your girl-friend is a Moslem might produce problems.

I would suggest you and your partner try Egypt, Syria or, although not an Arab country, Turkey. Your domestic arrangements will be of no official interest to anybody, and you will be able to see a foreign culture (not so easy in the Gulf); you might not make too much money, but you don't need to at your age.

You have the basic minimum requirements to work there; you are both white, native English speakers, and have a pulse. The fact that you both have a degree is an added bonus.

[Bindair Dundat]

[scot47]

Better for you, all of us, and the world, stay in Des Moines, Iowa, which is clearly your true cultural home.

You are a good example of why Americans are not welcome in the wider world.

[Saturnine]

Edits are fun

Thank you for your helpful comment Scot47, i'm glad you felt the need to post it at this stage in the game. /cheers

On the other hand the last few responses have been interesting, thanks for the information and questions.

[007]

[denise]