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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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 Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 12:54 am Post subject: |
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| Sheikh Inal Ovar wrote: |
| Does making a comment in a discussion no longer count as joining one ... |
So I guess that makes you guilty of the same crime... welcome...
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Sheikh Inal Ovar
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 1208
Location: Melo Drama School
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 4:34 am Post subject: |
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Oh lordy ... have you forgotten where we started
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... merely a statement of 3 people's personal opinions... all three representing ethnocentric stereotyping and prejudice...
I have always considered the trading of national insults a rather pitiful waste of time... another of the less attractive traits of TEFL teachers I think. ... |
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Bindair Dundat
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Posts: 1123
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 4:42 am Post subject: |
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| Stephen Jones wrote: |
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| Our objective in Iraq was only to take out Saddam, nothing more. That may be hard for you to undrstand, indoctrinated as you are in the excesses of Euro-peon imperialism. |
Here's silly me thinking it was to nick all the oil and keep the Israelis happy! |
Oil, Israel, Saddam WMDs... Cosnider for a moment that there are almost 300 million Americans, encompassing many different opinions and perspectives. This should be obvious, but apparently it is not. Americans did not all support the invasion of Iraq, and less support the ongoing action. Of those who do, and did, voice support, the reasons for that support vary.
What percentage of the Americans who you know agree with George Bush and Co.? This seems to be another one of those situations in which the Americans are wrong, but I can't find even one among my acquaintances who agrees with, or unequivocally supports, Bush.
If you ask the American soldiers who are in Iraq, for example, why they are there, I don't think many would tell you they are there for oil, or to support Israel. That may be why D i c k Cheney wants them there, or why the Izzies want them there, but that is not the soldiers' own personal motivation for being there; that is not why their families accept the risk and the sacrifice. You should be able to understand that.
Similarly, if you ask me why we are there, I am not likely to agree with all of the reasons that George Bush gives for our presence. I'll tell you why *I* supported the invasion of Iraq: because I thought that Saddam's time had come. I suppose that is all I should say on the matter. |
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Bindair Dundat
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Posts: 1123
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 4:44 am Post subject: |
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| 007 wrote: |
All are the same, American and Europeans; they are two faces of the same coin.
Of course, we have to recognize that there are good Americans and Europeans, as well, there are ugly Americans and Europeans.
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Then how is it possible that "all are the same"? In what sense is that true? |
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Henry_Cowell
Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 3352
Location: Berkeley
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 7:16 am Post subject: |
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| Bindair Dundat wrote: |
| Cosnider [sic] for a moment that there are almost 300 million Americans, encompassing many different opinions and perspectives. |
Then I think you should specify which of those 300 million Americans voiced the following "opinion" and "perspective":
| Bindair Dundat wrote: |
| Our objective in Iraq was only to take out Saddam, nothing more. |
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Bindair Dundat
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Posts: 1123
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 7:40 am Post subject: |
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| Henry_Cowell wrote: |
| Bindair Dundat wrote: |
| Cosnider [sic] for a moment that there are almost 300 million Americans, encompassing many different opinions and perspectives. |
Then I think you should specify which of those 300 million Americans voiced the following "opinion" and "perspective":
| Bindair Dundat wrote: |
| Our objective in Iraq was only to take out Saddam, nothing more. |
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I, for one. I think it's best that I should only only speak for myself. I'll leave the mind-reading to people who are better suited to it; there is apparently no shortage of such types in this thread or in this world. You are a case in point. |
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Saturnine
Joined: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 5
Location: Taiwan
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:42 am Post subject: Levity |
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Bindair Dundat
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Posts: 1123
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:09 am Post subject: |
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| The way the game works is that the winner is whoever gets in the last post before the moderators lock the thread, so the posting gets more intense as time goes on. |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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| nd the centuries-long occupation of Ireland |
Do tell us all you know about the above. I'm dying to be privy to your insights. I'm certain you know far, farmore about it than I do.
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| When America *wants* to conquer, it does. |
Keep taking the medicine.
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| Our objective in Iraq was only to take out Saddam, nothing more. |
Apart from the sheer stupidity and naivete of this manifestly false statement, what is striking is the characteristic USA-nian use of the 1st person to describe a decision taken by an elite group. Although in fairness, the above characteristics were neccessary to allow said elite group to get away with what they did - and continue to do.
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| That may be hard for you to undrstand |
You got that right. 3,000 USAnian dead for one Saddam? (I won't bother mention the dead brown people, since US 'news' generally doesn't either). And who knows how many more casualties with the great 'surge'? There have got to be more cost effective methods of political assasination, no?
Anyway, Saddam is now well and truly 'taken out', so why are 'you' surging away?
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| How petty of these democrats not to pay for a few days in the sun for the country's heroes. |
Oh, they'll pay all right. Opposition in the US exists mainly in name only.
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| I'll tell you why *I* supported the invasion of Iraq: because I thought that Saddam's time had come. |
Hang on. A moment ago you were talking about 'our objective'. Why the sudden shift to 1st person singular?
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| If you ask the American soldiers who are in Iraq, for example, why they are there, I don't think many would tell you they are there for oil, or to support Israel. That may be why D i c k Cheney wants them there, |
Ditto. So Cheney was not included in your 'our'?
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that is not the soldiers' own personal motivation for being there; that is not why their families accept the risk and the sacrifice. You should be able to understand that.
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Oh please! Many, maybe even most US soldiers are there for economic reasons, the US army doing most of its recruitment from the more disadvantaged and less well-educated sections of society. Most of them could not point to Iraq on a map 3 years ago. Most of their families probably still can't. And if the 'cause' of 'removing Saddam' was so noble, and so many families prepared to 'accept the risk and the sacrifice', why has recruitment to the US army plummetted? |
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007
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 2684
Location: UK/Veteran of the Magic Kingdom
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Bindair Dundat wrote: |
| 007 wrote: |
All are the same, American and Europeans; they are two faces of the same coin.
Of course, we have to recognize that there are good Americans and Europeans, as well, there are ugly Americans and Europeans.
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Then how is it possible that "all are the same"? In what sense is that true? |
They are all (Americans & Europeans) the same in the sense that they are using the same principle of 'Double Standards'.
About America image in the world, read this:
"A recent report by an advisory panel to the US State Department says that �America�s image and reputation abroad could hardly be worse.� It adds that the United States is viewed as �less a beacon of hope than a dangerous force to be countered.� Much of the Arab world �view George W. Bush as a greater threat to the world order than Osama bin Laden.�
Source: http://superfrenchie.com/
Karen Hughes, Undersecretary of State, was in a week-long Middle East tour to start repairing the US image.
she was in Saudi Arabia, trying to explain the U.S. policies that have caused so much antagonism.
"Instead, she�s the one who received an earful. The American people have many misperceptions about Saudi Arabia and little is done to correct it, she was told. During a town-hall meeting with Mrs. Hughes at the Dar al-Hekma College, one student noted �a very negative picture of Muslim women that is created by the American media and supported by the U.S. government.�
Hughes then tried to bring up the fact that Saudi women should be allowed to drive. That did not seem to work. Saudi women continued:
�Americans think that Arab women are not very happy,� said one student in reference to the perception that women are oppressed by their husbands. �We are all pretty happy.�
Another student said her American mother, who converted to Islam when she married her Saudi husband, is �treated badly� in the United States because she wears a scarf.
Another one said Americans should not pity Muslim women or judge them, but try to understand and respect their culture and traditions. "
http://superfrenchie.com/
| Bindair wrote: |
| ..I'll tell you why *I* supported the invasion of Iraq: because I thought that Saddam's time had come. |
What about his 'Excellency', G. W. Bush, according to your instinct, is his time coming or not? And when?
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