Job Discussion Forums

[MikeySaid]

How does being "pocho" affect one's ability to get signed on for a job teaching (english) in Mexico?

(For those who don't know, pocho generally refers to a chicano/mexican-american who does not speak Spanish particuarly well and/or is a bit out of touch with Mexican culture.)

My prometida got a bit frustrated with me when it came up that I've been conducting business in Spanish while looking for a job in Torreon. She said that I shouldn't speak Spanish when making first contact. This went against my instinct because generally speaking, my Spanish is better than 99% of people's English in Mexico (Exaggeration? Perhaps). She thought that over the phone they might assume I'm chicano/mexican-american or even worse... one of those, and POCHO... that many people might not realize that I'm a gringo who just happens to speak Spanish.

Note: I am NOT of hispanic heritage.

Now, this may be regional, or she might be wrong... but I wanted to get the perspective of the people on this board.... are you less likely to hire a Chicano/Mexican-American? Is being pocho really looked upon that poorly? And lastly... are there schools that won't hire me because I speak Spanish?

(Okay, it wasn't the last question.... If students find out I speak Spanish... will that make it harder for me to get them to speak English in class?)

[Samantha]

Your girlfriend surely knows the difference between a true "pocho" and simply someone that speaks Spanish well. Being a "pocho" has nothing to do with Spanish language skills or lack thereof. It's to do with attitude. And believe me, those you speak Spanish with will know that you are a foreigner no matter how good you think your Spanish is. I'm not sure what her concern is about but it certainly can't be that you will be confused with being "pocho". And you speaking Spanish will be an asset in getting a job, from my personal experiences since you may not find someone who speaks English (as you point out). Many of the schools I have worked in have had noone who could speak English in the offices (yes, including the coordinators). Lots of teachers from the USA speak enough Spanish to get by and may speak it well. From Canada, not so many, but knowing French generally helps to learn Spanish more quickly.

[MikeySaid]

Right... she knows the difference... she's traveled, been out of the country quite a bit and all that...

Her point was that people who can't make the same distinctions she can might assume I'm a mexican or a pocho chicano... and that this could somehow harm my chances of being selected for a position. I've seen on the Japan boards that being anything other than whitebreadcan cause problems... and thought maybe there was some validity to what she said.

Sidenote: Being pocho has a LOT to do with language skills, as language is one of the biggest carriers of culture. It's at least an indicator.

[Samantha]

If you feel this is really the case then there should be no confusion, what with your great Spanish skills as opposed to their Spanglish. I can tell you from the perspective in my corner in Mexico it is the arrogant attitudes brought along that work to perpetuate the dislike of "pochos". Another case for interviewing in person and not over the phone.

[tagastelum]

I think your fianc�e's concerns are valid but misguided.

In my experience as a pocho teaching English in Monterrey, no one holds the fact that I'm Mex-Am against me. In fact, Mexicans could care less about hyphenated identities. (That seems to be a distinctly North American preoccupation.) Here, I am an American, and no one will ever think otherwise. Even though I speak passable Spanish and my ancestors are from Sonora, I remain culturally hard-wired as American. And so for the time being, I remain extranjero.

I think speaking Spanish for your first contact with potential employers is the right decision. It shows that you are willing to reach out and adapt to your new home. The fact that English is your native language is most likely already obvious. Speaking Spanish is a great way to make friends and influence people in Mexico, so keep on using it.

Except in the classroom. My students know the rule: teacher only speaks English in the classroom, but he will chat in Spanish before school, after school and during breaks. That way, I can connect with my students, while still forcing them to practice their English in class.

Hope my two cents are useful.

[El Gallo]

My friend here is a true pocho. He is from Chiapas but lived in the US for three years. When we go to Soriana or other stores, he speaks English. "Excuse me, where is the coffee please?" I immediately remind him 'espanol". We have become the mutt and jeff comedy act. The huge gringo that tries to speak Spanish and the pocho who always speaks English.

[MELEE]

Freddy where are you?


I just wanted to point out for lurkers that in Oaxaca, Pocho means born on the other side, Gabacho is the word for people who has assimulated US culture (Anglo) while on the otherside and Cholo is the word for people who have assimulated US Chicano culture.

I also think your fiancee's concerns are misguided. No one is going to mistake you for a Pocho or any other similar thing. The only disadvantage is that you might not get a job at someplace where they perfer (perhaps for faulty reasons) a monolingual teacher. I imagine it will open up more jobs to you, not limit your possiblities.

Going on only what you have stated, I also feel that her comments are extremely classist. But I've never met here and don't have enough information so I will try to suspend judgement for the time being.

[MikeySaid]

Melee...

Bizarre... i've never heard people use pocho, gabacho (gavacho), and cholo in those specific ways...

In the US, Queretaro, and Torreon, it's always seemed that Pocho was someone who'd become 'white-washed', gavacho was for any light-skinned foreigner, and cholo... well I can't recall hearing someone on the south side of the Rio Bravo using that word....

[Samantha]

It's used in this area all the time. "I wouldn't live in that neighborhood; it's full of cholos". "That guy dresses like a cholo". If someone is a "cholo" they are perceived to be in a gang and into drugs and other unsavory behaviors. The definition in the following list agrees.

See this list of expressions (which "pocho" didn't make, but cholo and gabacho did).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Chicano_Cal%C3%B3_words_and_expressions

Interesting link with lengthy history of "cholo":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cholo


This definition of pocho, buried in Wikipedia seems to fit with the local perception. It is perceived here that "pochos" consider themselves better than "real Mexicans" and are not well-liked for that reason.

[thelmadatter]

Gustavo Arellano, the author of the "Ask a Mexican" syndicated column, uses "gabacho" instead of "gringo" Never heard of it used to refer to Mexican-Americans.

[Samantha]

I hadn't heard the word gabacho used, so I did some reading and in the process learned something; "gabachero".

[FreddyM]

Well, I won't quote any references as to the meanings of the various words, but I will tell you my own understanding of them. "Cholo" usually refers to Chicanos, perhaps involved in some kind of gang activity, "gabacho" is just another word for gringo, and "pocho" is a Mexican from the United States who does not have good command of the Spanish language and considers himself better than other Mexicans.

I was born in Mexico, but grew up in the United States. My English is much better than my Spanish, but I can get by fairly easily in this culture. I don't think being of Mexican origin has had a terribly negative effect on my seeking a job as an English teacher here. The school where I work considers me a native speaker, and pays me accordingly. I got a job offer at Tec that I turned down, and several other schools expressed interest in my services as well. I'm pretty well qualified too however, so that probably has more impact in the types of jobs I apply for than where I was born or whether I know Spanish or not (or how fluent I am in it).
I've been well treated here in Mexico, and have the unusual ability to sort of blend in with whatever group I am with...I can consider myself one of the guys and Mexican when I want to, or hang out with a bunch of English native speakers equally well. I've had different reactions from the Mexican teachers here. Many have thought I was American (and thus gringo) but the fact I am communicate in Spanish and look Mexican means I can be accepted as well. Other Mexican teachers I've met were a little shocked to realize I spoke perfect English. So it goes both ways.

[MikeySaid]

Freddy, thank you. Best reply yet.