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lotsa
Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 68
Location: Oman
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 Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 3:17 am Post subject: English First - KSA |
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In testing the water, so to speak, I applied for a position with English First in KSA. Their offer is 6000 per month, 12mths, no increase, but all the other trimmings such as accom/travel etc included. I've yet to reply, but seems that for even highly qualified teachers EF does not recognise that and indeed come across as cheapskates. Hardly surprising really  Point is, if you are considering EF in KSA, think again unless you are happy with a low-paid job there. |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 7:21 am Post subject: |
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| If you are remotely well qualified, do not teach EF or any other 'language' school' in KSA. |
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trapezius
Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 1670
Location: Land of Culture of Death & Destruction
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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Is "English First" a local chain, or an international one?
^ What about Berlitz and Wall Street? Aren't they professional and reputable? (as they are both from abroad) |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Aren't they professional and reputable? |
No.
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| (as they are both from abroad) |
What's that supposed to mean? |
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trapezius
Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 1670
Location: Land of Culture of Death & Destruction
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| Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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Ummm... they are from abroad... abroad as in not from here. They are not local enterprises.
Berlitz is not a professional place to work in? |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 7:30 am Post subject: |
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| Ummm... they are from abroad... abroad as in not from here |
Well, duh. I was curious as to why you thought that the fact that these organisations are 'from abroad' would somehow make them more 'reputable and professional'.
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| Berlitz is not a professional place to work in? |
Isn't that what I said? If you're considering taking up employment with them, bear in mind that Berlitz are the McDonalds of the ESL industry. |
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lotsa
Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 68
Location: Oman
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| Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| Seems as thought English First is in the same league as Berlitz. Appears as though: English First, Teachers Last. |
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trapezius
Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 1670
Location: Land of Culture of Death & Destruction
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| Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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| I was curious as to why you thought that the fact that these organisations are 'from abroad' would somehow make them more 'reputable and professional'. |
Well because any product/service from abroad -- from candies to education -- that you can find in Saudi, is of much higher quality than its local counterparts/knockoffs. I have not encountered a single Saudi product/service in 2+ decades that can compete with any of the myriad ones from abroad found here.
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| If you're considering taking up employment with them, bear in mind that Berlitz are the McDonalds of the ESL industry. |
I still don't get this; if they are McDs of the ESL industry, who are the Rolls Royces? Not the ESL departments in local unis, and not English First or Wall St. Institute. So who? Which would be the most professional place to learn ESL in this country?
Edit: British Council, I guess, right? OK, after them? |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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| I have not encountered a single Saudi product/service in 2+ decades that can compete with any of the myriad ones from abroad found here. |
We're not talking about the quality of the service, but about how Berlitz or WSI are employers. And both- despite (sic) the fact that they are USAnian have a lousy reputation as employers. I should also add that neither have particularly good reputations as educational institutions either.
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| Which would be the most professional place to learn ESL in this country? |
In case you haven't noticed, this is a teachers', not a students' forum. And has been said time and again on this board, if you are in any way qualified and self-respecting, you should run a mile from any of the international language chains in KSA. |
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Stephen Jones
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124
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| Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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English First, like Berlitz and IH is a franchise. As a result the standard varies to some extent as it does from one MacDonald's to another, and you can get excellent employers and atrocious ones.
Berlitz in Jeddah used to be considered a good employer (and may still be so for all I know). The first thing the DOS did was junk the Berlitz method and introduce something sensible, a bit like a Macdonald's deciding it wasn't serving any of this junk food stuff and setting up a mom and pops diner. |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 5:02 am Post subject: |
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| ELS in Jeddah was an okay set-up. Not sure of ELS in Riyadh or Dammam |
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tudodude
Joined: 08 Mar 2007
Posts: 82
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| Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 3:16 pm Post subject: Re: English First - KSA |
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| lotsa wrote: |
| In testing the water, so to speak, I applied for a position with English First in KSA. Their offer is 6000 per month, 12mths, no increase, but all the other trimmings such as accom/travel etc included. I've yet to reply, but seems that for even highly qualified teachers EF does not recognise that and indeed come across as cheapskates. Hardly surprising really Point is, if you are considering EF in KSA, think again unless you are happy with a low-paid job there. |
I work for EF and would gladly give you off the record stuff as a PM |
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saral
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Posts: 32
Location: New Zealand
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| Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 7:33 am Post subject: English First and IPA |
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| I'm looking at an offer from English Fist and one from IPA. Could I hear from Tudodude regards EF? I'm getting a lot of information from this forum. Thanks to all for the, sometimes conflicting, opinions. I teach ESL in New Zealand (last eight years) and am pointed stubbornly towards KSA. I've been teaching Saudis for three years and this summer (yours) had a large group of Qataris. Mostly decent experiences with all. I've a BA (English) and a CELTA. I'm a bit surprised that the BA plus experience is often acceptable. Cheers to you all. |
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personae gratae
Joined: 15 Sep 2007
Posts: 21
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| Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| trapezius wrote: |
| (as they are both from abroad) |
Sorry trapezius, I do not get your point.
please elaborate...
cheers |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 12:43 pm Post subject: Re: English First and IPA |
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| saral wrote: |
| I'm looking at an offer from English Fist and one from IPA. Could I hear from Tudodude regards EF? I'm getting a lot of information from this forum. Thanks to all for the, sometimes conflicting, opinions. I teach ESL in New Zealand (last eight years) and am pointed stubbornly towards KSA. I've been teaching Saudis for three years and this summer (yours) had a large group of Qataris. Mostly decent experiences with all. I've a BA (English) and a CELTA. I'm a bit surprised that the BA plus experience is often acceptable. Cheers to you all. |
I think it makes a difference which branch of IPA, but based on what I have read here, IPA would be better than any language school chain of any nationality... all of which are in the business to make money. (I consider BC more of a political entity)
VS |
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